Hello. I know much has been posted on this issue and I have done more reading than I care to want to remember. Here is my problem. I have a LATE 04 ford 6.0 with an intermittent no start. Spins like a sewing machine with two good batteries. I have done the basics to keep this thing running. Good clean oil, clean fuel, proper filters from IH, no the ones from the autoparts stores ARE NOT the same. The issue is this. I went downtown, 30 min drive turned it off and a minute later no start. Towed it home waited until next morning, no started. Gave it the lightest sniff of either, bingo instant run. I am getting fuel to my upper filter, injectors are firing ( I can hear them cycling ). The fuel pump runs nicely. Sometimes it doesn't have any issues at all and will restart hot or cold with no problems. Since mine is a late '04 ( I even have 05 rims ) it has basically all the updates to eliminate all those stupid leaky joints that the ealier models suffered from. I have the second incarnation of the HPOP, the first being a piece of crap. The only joint that is left to leak on my truck is apparently a joint right at the HPOP but I can't see this being the issue since it's intermittent. ( by the way for those who don't know, they make a plastic bracket to hold that leaky joint tight together to solve that last leaky spot ) The truck purs once it's running, no power issues at all, no stumbling, no weird smoke, nothing. I am at a loss, I will be buying a code scanner ( the autoenginuity one with the Ford pack ) to get the codes but maybe someone has an idea ? I should mention that each time the truck wouldn't go, I would only have to give it a very small shot of ether and she goes instantly. When I mean small I mean really small shot as I don't like to use it and when it fires it doesn' spring to life like some engines I have seen that seem to over rev because of too much ether. This is just a squirt through that 1" bypass hose ahead of the air cleaner. Maybe 1 - 1.5 seconds worth. Anyway, I read somewhere this could be a FICM but why does this need to be "flashed" or programmed by the dealer when you replace it ? Any help would be greatly appreciated. By the way, I have to say I have been to this site www.powerstrokehelp.com and it really made me feel a lot better about my truck. I know these trucks are finicky, at least mine has most of the revisions that fixes all these problems. For those with 05 later trucks, have some relief in the knowledge a lot of these issues aren't your problem. It seems the '03 up to mid '04 trucks are the ones that had most of the HPOP problems. In later models they got rid of a lot of those stupid tubes and seals. At least that is what my understanding it from the info I got. The one thing this website stresses over everything else, change your oil often, change your fuel filters often and run clean fuel with FORD or IH filters ( the latter being 1/2 the cost ).

Thanks for anyone who took the time to read this and can help me !!

 

The FICM comes blank from Ford and HAS to be reprogrammed to work. You could still have an HPO leak, but get it scanned before you proceed further and start throwing money at it.

 

Checked for fuel at the engine mounted filter again, comes out nicely when you hit the key. Checked for oil on the engine filter again, fills up when cranking.

More importantly, checked voltage on ICP sensor during crank, 3.8 volts.

Also checked Voltage during crank and showed 10.5 volts during crank to start with glow plugs running ( I suppose but I let them cycle until the light went off anyway, although I hear they can cycle after that as needed ).

Unfortunately don't yet have the code scanner as they have to be ordered from the US and customs guys SUCK, so much for free trade, what a misnomer.

 

I would wait until you get the autoenginuity scanner and then you can look at the different sensors that are needed to start firing the injectors. Like the injector pressure regulator and the injector control pressure. Both have to be working correctly before even firing an injector at start up. The STC fitting on 05 and later engines also is common for high pressure oil leaks. I cannot give an answer though as to why it would start with the ether. I would stick to the basics as to what this engine needs fed back to the computer in order for it to start.

 

I agree with partsman. FICM crapping out.

 

Could be a FICM but could still be a high pressure oil concern, if you have never had the pump fittings replaced that could definetly be the concern. And FYI, every year of the 6.0 had problems with high pressure oil leaks. In fact, early 04's and 03's had problems with pumps and infrequently the braided lines to the oil manifolds but they had a different set up for the discharge line so they didn't brake like the later models. Later 2004's and on didn't have as many pump problems but had a lot more places to leak.

 

I could see it being the FICM but why still high pressure. I have seen low oil pressure build by seeing the oil filter housing fill. Then checked oil pressure from the HPOP by measuring the ICP sensor which showed 3.8 volts. As I understand it, .80 volts is minimum and equals roughly 500PSI. Since the IPC is mounted in the head area, I assume its getting to the wavy manifold that feeds the injectors. So I would think the HPOP is indeed doing its job but maybe I am missing something. Also, I thought that after they replaced many of those pieces in the end of 04 those hoses you speak of are mostly gone. That is what I have read and seen in most of the information I can find from the dealer and the 6.0 bible, not just heresay.. The earlier ones had all those hoses and crap but the wavy manifold replaced a lot of junctions and such. As I understand it, the only place it would leak now, with the exception of cracks or breaks, would be the connection from the HPOP to those manifolds and they make a bracket to help fix leaks there too. There are just so many incarnations of this engine, it's hard to get it all straight but it seems to me I have the new pump, in fact I know I do from the VIN and I do have those wavy manifolds as well so a lot of those joints are apparently no longe in there.. Are you guessing or are you sure there's a bunch of these joints still in existance on this version of the 6.0..

 

I'm not guessing, I know. I am a Ford certified diesel mechanic. Later styles with the wavy manifolds leak at the dummy plugs and I have seen the manifolds themselves cause extended crank times. With the braided lines on the old style, I have only ever seen 1 braided line with a hole in it. Usually it was always the pump or ipr and never the discharge line because it was supported unlike the later style. If you look at the wavy manifolds, they are more complex to make, every plug they had to put in it has to have an o-ring and thus it has more potential leaks. As for the reason it starts with ether, once the engine is spinning fast enough the high pressure oil pump can overcome most leaks, and then when you shut if off the leak won't allow it to reach 500 psi, it could still be a FICM but you should have injetor circuit codes or a p0611 for FICM performance. Also, if the FICM is bad enough it shouldn't stay running whether you shoot it with ether or not.

 

Hey, sorry I didn't mean to offend at all, there's just so much misinformation out there too and while I want to hear from everyone of course, I don't want to be misinformed either, it just leads you down the wrong road. So here's one question, the ICP gets pressure from the wavy manifold right ? So I am guessing the leak would be up there, but since I show 3.8 volts, wouldn't one assume the pump is at least functioning and pumping as it should and that the issue ( if oil pressure related ) is in leaks past the pump up in the wavy manifolds and more precisely in only some spots because the ICP is sensing enough pressure to get the higher than needed voltage to fire the injectors. I heard someone say it's linear so if 0.80volts is 500psi then 3.8volts would work out to around 2400PSI during just cranking, which seems very high considering it's only around 200RPM at that point, maybe it's not linear because I think operating pressure once running is 3500 PSI right ? I am just trying to understand everything I can about this whole unit. It does really help paint a picture of all the component interelationships and since I intend to keep this truck for a bit, it's nice to know where to start if once I get this fixed something else goes wrong. Like say on an island with no tow truck in the middle of nowhere like last time, costing a mere $1200 just to recover the truck to civilization.. YEAH.

 

That voltage is way low IMO. The FICM can be affected at voltages that low.

 

Hey Bismic.. again, not trying to argue with anyone but here again is where this becomes hard and just so you know, I APPRECIATE everyones help. I read from the ford bible ( i think ) 10.5V during crank is good. I never tried to see what voltage my other 7.3 truck goes down to during start but at that point with all that draw, I would not have expected 12volts to remain constant. That said, I have had a lot of alternator problems with this truck. They apparently use a real ****ty one and they tend to fail because they can't charge a low battery fast enough before they overheat, thus blowing the regs. This I know for sure form experience. The older trucks like my 97 used a much beefier alternator that could shed more heat and keep them from cooking themselves during a low battery charge cycle. It wouldn't then surprise me at all if the FICM failed because I bet I have tried to start that truck a couple of dozen times over the years with nearly dead batteries ( due to being where there isn't a charger around ) Usually when they are down beyond a normal drop from starting, I charge them properly rather than leaving the alternator to do so, which is a big no no..

UPDATE - my 7.3 drops to about 11 volts at worst for a second.

 

Every system is different. I just know how hard the FICM works to amplify the voltage to 48 volts. No problems w/ the discussion or disagreement - but I firmly believe that 10.5 volts is too low - it will kill the FICM. I watch my voltages very closely. I do not drop below 11.5 V on start up - NEVER.

If you could post the link to the Ford Bible stating 10.5 V is good, I would appreciate it (but would still disagree w/ it).

Edit - looking back at my notes, my typical voltage on start-up (w. the glow plugs operating is between 11.8 and 12).

 

Smallish update. While waiting for the code scanner to come via snail mail from the US, through to snail main in Canada, I decided to buy another used FICM from a running '04. My thoughts were that I could use a spare if that doesn't turn out to be the issue anyway and having had so many alternator battery issues, I thought it's likely my FICM is indeed screwed. Well anyway, no go, interestingly, ether doesn't work either anymore. She's dead.. ah.. the 6.0 liter piece of crap, has there ever been a worse engine, I think not. So, back to square one but I think it's an oil pressure issue indeed. Any thoughts ? I also found that when the stealership did all the work to my truck to fix the heads and such, they didn't affix a sensor wire back to where it belongs and it was resting against the turbo downpipe. Inspected the wire and it was thankfully still unscathed but for a minute, I thought I found the culprit. Now that I have this other FICM in, I also noticed two things, a check engine light that wasn't there before is now, and it doesn't seem to cycle all of my injectors like the old one did. Maybe I am imagining that but I swear there was more rattling upon Key on before.

 

My voltage almost always drops to the 10V range when starting first time of the day. My Bell 65 gives me that warning almost every morning winter or summer. Even with BRAND NEW batteries. And my alt puts out only 13.1-13.5 even though on the test bench it will put out 14.1 and it's a 135A alt. Never had a starting problem even cranking times up to 60 seconds when replacing injectors (although they are usually 25-35).

 

npccpartsman - good to know, but I still do not think it is the proper performance. I admit, I do not know this for sure, but if mine were to drop that low, something would be wrong.

cabinman - just curious, what International fuel filters did you get? Did you give them the part number that you got from these forums?

Also - I do not recall seeing you post your mileage. Do you still have any 5 yr/100k warranty?