My buddy needs some help...
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Joined: Nov 2006
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From: North of Greenville
My buddy needs some help...
I live over in the 7.3 forum because that's waht I have myself. However, one of my buddies has a '04 6.0 F250 Lariat Crew, 4x4, 46K miles on the truck, and has been having tons of trouble with it. I'm hoping some of you guys may be able to help me guide him a little. Since the truck is still under warranty, the dealer has been taking care of these issues by those means.
Prior to my friend purchasing the truck, the PO had the Fuel Injection Control Module replaced.
To-date, here's a list of the additional work the dealer has done since the first of the year:
EGR cooler replacement<O
</O
EGR valve replacement<O</O
Two new injectors<O</O
Tore-down turbo and cleaned it.<O</O
Replaced throttle plate<O</O
PCM replacement (whole new brain chip)
Current symptoms (quoted directly from an email I received from my friend this morning):
"If I had any hair I’d pull it out! It seems to happen around 95 °F outside and 45 °F in winter pulling hills or trailers.
<O</O"95 °F day case: Leaving a stop sign or red light, light accel ~1,200 RPM. The sharp clucking sound typical of a diesel engine slowly becomes muted, over a period of 3 seconds or so. The muted sound is like my older 7.3, when you had it in neutral and rev’d it up under no load. The, “sometimes” white smoke comes from the exhaust pipe. This smoke does not always appear. It chokes down in power, RPMs seem to stop accel, but don’t drop-off either. Then the strangest sound comes from what sounds like under the hood right in front of the drives side, it’s a barking dog sound. The barks are short and at a steady frequency. Four or five barks and then maybe I push the peddle or something in my haste, because it goes away and then the power catches, the clucking returns, and “BLAST-OFF”, everything is accel’n normally.
<O</O"~45 °F day case: Pulling a hill accel’d to 70MPH. Barking begins at short constant frequency and seems to stay much longer than in 95 deg F day case. Pulling trailers on flat ground and up hill causes this phenomena as well in cold weather.
<O</O"The barking sound is like a sucking, maybe the turbine is acting up. But during each “bark” there is a lose of power so great it fells like the brake is being applied.
<O</O"Here is what I have noticed this morning after the usual cutting out, smoking and barking on the way home yesterday. I tried to see what the thing would do if I just sat in the parking lot, put it in neutral and ran it up to 2K RPM and held my foot steady. What do you think it would do? I think it would have gone to 2K RPM and held there as long as my foot held there. No, it goes to 2K RPM, maybe a second later it goes to 2.5K RPM, waves about (10-15 RPM) and returns to 2K RPM. Is there an actuator that is controlled by any electronic sensor from the peddle?"
<O</O<O</O
<O</O
<OAny insight you can offer would be greatly appreciated.</O
Prior to my friend purchasing the truck, the PO had the Fuel Injection Control Module replaced.
To-date, here's a list of the additional work the dealer has done since the first of the year:
EGR cooler replacement<O
</OEGR valve replacement<O
</OTwo new injectors<O
</OTore-down turbo and cleaned it.<O
</OReplaced throttle plate<O
</OPCM replacement (whole new brain chip)
Current symptoms (quoted directly from an email I received from my friend this morning):
"If I had any hair I’d pull it out! It seems to happen around 95 °F outside and 45 °F in winter pulling hills or trailers.
<O
</O"95 °F day case: Leaving a stop sign or red light, light accel ~1,200 RPM. The sharp clucking sound typical of a diesel engine slowly becomes muted, over a period of 3 seconds or so. The muted sound is like my older 7.3, when you had it in neutral and rev’d it up under no load. The, “sometimes” white smoke comes from the exhaust pipe. This smoke does not always appear. It chokes down in power, RPMs seem to stop accel, but don’t drop-off either. Then the strangest sound comes from what sounds like under the hood right in front of the drives side, it’s a barking dog sound. The barks are short and at a steady frequency. Four or five barks and then maybe I push the peddle or something in my haste, because it goes away and then the power catches, the clucking returns, and “BLAST-OFF”, everything is accel’n normally.<O
</O"~45 °F day case: Pulling a hill accel’d to 70MPH. Barking begins at short constant frequency and seems to stay much longer than in 95 deg F day case. Pulling trailers on flat ground and up hill causes this phenomena as well in cold weather.<O
</O"The barking sound is like a sucking, maybe the turbine is acting up. But during each “bark” there is a lose of power so great it fells like the brake is being applied.<O
</O"Here is what I have noticed this morning after the usual cutting out, smoking and barking on the way home yesterday. I tried to see what the thing would do if I just sat in the parking lot, put it in neutral and ran it up to 2K RPM and held my foot steady. What do you think it would do? I think it would have gone to 2K RPM and held there as long as my foot held there. No, it goes to 2K RPM, maybe a second later it goes to 2.5K RPM, waves about (10-15 RPM) and returns to 2K RPM. Is there an actuator that is controlled by any electronic sensor from the peddle?"<O
</O<O</O<O
</O<O
Any insight you can offer would be greatly appreciated.</O
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,616
Likes: 882
It sure sounds like it is turbo related. It appears that it was addressed at the beginnig of this year though...very weird. That stuff happened to me when my egr valve (before I disabled it) was sticking, but that was also replaced according to your email.
Who did the turbo tear down and rebuild?
Who did the turbo tear down and rebuild?
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,616
Likes: 882
Prior to my getting involved with the repairs of my truck (warranty is up), my vehicle went to the dealer 1/2 dozen times for CEL or intermittent power loss.
The symptoms you describe are similiar (not exact) to my situation when my EGR valve was sticking. I highly doubt it is the case with your friend's vehicle. There are some sharp techs on this 6.0 forum...you'll get some good leads.
Good Luck
The symptoms you describe are similiar (not exact) to my situation when my EGR valve was sticking. I highly doubt it is the case with your friend's vehicle. There are some sharp techs on this 6.0 forum...you'll get some good leads.
Good Luck
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 42,085
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From: Lakewood, Ca.
Hi Pete -
I'm by no means one of the sharp 6.0 techs that JB is referring to, but I'll ad my $.02....
Turbo related sure sounds possible...maybe something to do with the VGT solenoid, or even improper assembly.
From the posts I have seen on bad pedal assemblies , they usually just quit working at all. Of course that's not to say that couldn't be it.
If your buddy has the means to pull codes from the OBDII that would be a big help.
I'm by no means one of the sharp 6.0 techs that JB is referring to, but I'll ad my $.02....
Turbo related sure sounds possible...maybe something to do with the VGT solenoid, or even improper assembly.
Originally Posted by F250_
Is there an actuator that is controlled by any electronic sensor from the peddle?"
If your buddy has the means to pull codes from the OBDII that would be a big help.
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Hotshot
Joined: Nov 2006
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From: North of Greenville
Hi Steve. Thanks for chiming in.
My buddy can't pull codes, but I've offered to do that for him with my AE, but he lives a good bit on the other side of town and is still letting the dealer dig into things.
He was getting the P0487 (EGR) code even after they replaced/repaired the EGR components, but that was resolved when they replaced the PCM. I'm not sure what codes he's getting right now. I am meeting up with him for lunch tomorrow, but the truck will still be at the dealer (we work in two separate office locations).
I'm getting the distinct impression that they're just throwing parts at it, and that may be partially due to the reimbursements they get from Ford for warranty repairs.
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New User
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 12
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From: Alabama
Hi guys. Its my truck that Pete is helping with. We found some writing yesterday on this website where a guy explained the same sym.s as my truck is having, and said it was the EBP sensor that fixed his truck. I printed that text out and gave it to the service people at Ford this morning. We'll see if this is the problem.
The main thing that happens is the clucking and clattering gets muted to the point that it almost sounds like a gas engine right before flaking out on me. Then some times, this "barking" sound comes from in front of the drivers seat under the hood.
Yes, I too have thought they are throwing parts at my truck in hopes to fix it. I am all for it. So far, I have gotten plenty of new parts in an honest way.
Rodger Dale
The main thing that happens is the clucking and clattering gets muted to the point that it almost sounds like a gas engine right before flaking out on me. Then some times, this "barking" sound comes from in front of the drivers seat under the hood.
Yes, I too have thought they are throwing parts at my truck in hopes to fix it. I am all for it. So far, I have gotten plenty of new parts in an honest way.
Rodger Dale
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Brett Foote
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Joined: Jul 2004
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From: Ohio
The barking or sneezing is boost pressure escaping out the air intake. The turbo will exhaust boost pressure since you have no waste gate on the VGT. An EGR will cause bucking or sneezing also when throttle is applied with excessive black smoke or unburnt fuel seen out the exhaust.
Exhaust Back pressure Sensor EBP was eliminated in the newer flash. I would review the turbo, EGR valve and BARO sensor.
Exhaust Back pressure Sensor EBP was eliminated in the newer flash. I would review the turbo, EGR valve and BARO sensor.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
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FYI - turbo issues can throw EGR codes. Maxium gave you some good advice!
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Hotshot
Joined: Nov 2006
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From: North of Greenville
Thanks, Maxium.
I guess that really leaves the BARO sensor as a potential culprit for now, since the EGR valve has already been replaced and the turbo torn down, cleaned, and put back together (still assuming that the "put back together" part went the way it should have).
I haven't heard from rwilson yet to see if the dealer had any word for him since getting the truck yesterday morning.
I guess that really leaves the BARO sensor as a potential culprit for now, since the EGR valve has already been replaced and the turbo torn down, cleaned, and put back together (still assuming that the "put back together" part went the way it should have).
I haven't heard from rwilson yet to see if the dealer had any word for him since getting the truck yesterday morning.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 21,113
Likes: 3,939
From: Ohio
2004 F-Series/Excursion Barometric Pressure Sensor Application:
Be advised that the barometric pressure (BARO) sensor was changed for the 2004 model year. Trucks built before 9-29-03 use the same BARO sensor as previous models--F8UZ-12A644-AA. Trucks built on or after 9-29-04 (2004.25) use part number 4C2Z-12A644-AA. Using the incorrect part for applicate will cause driveability symptoms. Broadcast Message 3162.
Be advised that the barometric pressure (BARO) sensor was changed for the 2004 model year. Trucks built before 9-29-03 use the same BARO sensor as previous models--F8UZ-12A644-AA. Trucks built on or after 9-29-04 (2004.25) use part number 4C2Z-12A644-AA. Using the incorrect part for applicate will cause driveability symptoms. Broadcast Message 3162.
Thread Starter
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Hotshot
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,288
Likes: 269
From: North of Greenville
2004 F-Series/Excursion Barometric Pressure Sensor Application:
Be advised that the barometric pressure (BARO) sensor was changed for the 2004 model year. Trucks built before 9-29-03 use the same BARO sensor as previous models--F8UZ-12A644-AA. Trucks built on or after 9-29-04 (2004.25) use part number 4C2Z-12A644-AA. Using the incorrect part for applicate will cause driveability symptoms. Broadcast Message 3162.
Be advised that the barometric pressure (BARO) sensor was changed for the 2004 model year. Trucks built before 9-29-03 use the same BARO sensor as previous models--F8UZ-12A644-AA. Trucks built on or after 9-29-04 (2004.25) use part number 4C2Z-12A644-AA. Using the incorrect part for applicate will cause driveability symptoms. Broadcast Message 3162.