Fishin is right, Ryan. Motorcrafts and Autolites are still two piece crimped together. The heads were changed on the 08's to help prevent breakage. If I'm correct, they added more threads. Someone help me out here and either correct me if I'm wrong or verify what I've said.

 

Nope.....there IS a new spark plug in the late model 07's and 08's and 09's now...Tylus...help me out here....there was another thread with a picture of the new plug.....anyone???

 

F150online Forums - View Single Post - NewTSB on spark plug removal


Thats what the new plug and head look like...

And no...most parts catalogs are still incorrect....

 

First of all, all of the 5.4L 3-valve Fords, Lincoln and Mercury engines all use the same plugs from 2004 to 2009 and even the new 4.6L 3-valve is the same way. The only engine that uses the "old" original plugs (short and fat) are the 4.6L 2-valve. If you are having a dealership replace them all get a signed written statement that when removing a broken plug that after the job is completed that you are not responsible for any damage caused by the ceramic that may be left in the cylinder. All Ford Dealerships use the same tool and technique when removing broken plugs from the 5.4L 3v engines. Which requires the technician to push the ceramic core into the cylinder through the steel ground probe and then using the extraction tool to screw into the ground probe (sort of like a screw jack). Now the question is how to remove the ceramic that is left in the cylinder.... Some dealerships turn over the engine and attempt to "blow" ceramic out the spark plug hole, Some even use compressed air after removing the cylinder injector to "blow" the ceramic out. If the dealership tells you that the debris left behind (ceramic dust or bits) will not hurt the engine and will just be burned off, they are full of crap and feeding you a line of bull. 1. it is a cast iron block and 2. it is a Aluminum Head both will scratch very easily with ceramic, porcelain, other metal or even a scotch brite pad. If the chunck is big enough it could even get lodged in a valve and damage it, bent valves are not a good thing. Example take your wifes Finger nail file and drag it gently across a pop can and see the marks.

Whn I first bought my F150 and after about 30K miles, the truck started bucking and had no power. The dealership had it for 3 weeks and finally determined that it was defective plugs. They replaced them and after an additional 60K miles I decided to change them. 6 out of the 8 broke off and that was even having a Ford Mechanic (who is a friend of mine) assist and he broke off 3 of them. He then offered to get the extraction tool from the dealership and attempt to remove them, that is when he informed me about the ceramic the may be left in the cylinder and the damage that could occure after. That is when I opted to pull the heads and pound the broken plugs out from the inside out. He also informed me that the dealerships do not use anti-sieze nor die-electric grease unless a TSB or service manual specifies that it to be used. Needless to say when I reassembled the engine I used Nickel Anti-seize and Die-electric on everything that I could. My recomendation is to get a statement of responsability from the dealer or service manager that if any additional damage occures that they will be held liable for the repairs and after you get the truck back pull all 8 of the plugs and coat them with Nickel Anti-seize to save yourself time and money later. I drive my truck anywhere from 200 - 500 miles daily and pretty much live in it being that it was purchased late 2004 and now has 198K miles on it. Will probably keep it another 100K if I can. I know of many cases of people who have bought a used truck with the 5.4L 3v engine and before finalizing the purchase they make the dealership agree that they will change the plugs and be liable for any additional damage that may occure if the plugs break off. Also make sure that you get the old plugs back so you can verify the wear, if there is "blow by" and if any were broken.

As for the Champion plugs, most dealerships can get them check Napa, Advance Auto, O'riely's (sp?), Pepboys. I know that they carry them and run about $20 a piece compared to $12 - $15 for the Autolite plugs. The Champion plugs just came out with in the past 6 months and are the only 1 piece plug available.

 

Greg, the problem was not the threads that were breaking it was the weld at the top of the ground probe beneath the threads. The problem is the close tolerance of the plug port into the head chamber, carbon builds up around the ground probe and locks it in. So, at which point either the ceramic comes out with the threaded plug, leaving the ground probe still in the head or the ceramic breaks off leaving the ceramic and the ground probe still in the head. Supposedly Ford Engineers have bored out the head port that holds the ground probe to a larger size but unfortunately it is all hearsay being that the heads all have the same part number. Even after takeing a 09 apart and a 04 apart there is not a noticable difference in the clearence. The reason that they kept the same part number is due to Recalls and if they admit that there is a problem then they would have to correct all of the 5.4L 3v engines with the new heads, costing big $$$$ to Ford.

 

1. Not the case...check out the link above....Yes the parts catalogs haven't been updated...but the dealership can run your engine by the vin and they WILL have a new head and spark plug number if it was built after 11/07 (or right around there)


2. The champions came out about two years ago.....

3. Brisk also makes a 1 piece plug

 

Thanks, GRNMSTR. Maybe this old machinist doesn't know everything, but I think if Ford would have made the plugs welded together like the Champions and Brisk plugs, they could have avoided a lot of problems. It is my understanding that the Motorcraft and Autolite plugs are crimped together instead of welded like the Champions and Brisks. Any way you look at it it's a bad design. And to think those engineers went to college for that. Kind of reminds me of the 6.0L PSD debacle that could have been avoided with the proper fasteners and better designed HPOP, oil cooler, and EGR system. That's why I like my old 351's and 460's. They weren't so fragile and can be made to perform as good or better than the modular motors.

 

Whoa there is a lot of bad info in here... If you use the Lisle tool correctly the porcelain will NOT get into the cylinder. It bottoms out at the end of the ground loop and that's as far as it needs to go for the tool to grab the ground shield. Ford did change the head design in late 07 to a more conventional plug design. Click on the link in Ryan50hrl's post to see the new design. PM me with you VIN and I can run a OASIS report and tell you if you have the new design. Pulling the plugs every 20K just to clean them sounds like a lot of extra work to me. If anti-seize is properly applied the the ground shield they should be good to go until it's time to replace them again. When the 3v first came out Ford updated the plugs for a misfire problem. Back then no one knew about the breaking problem and didn't use anti-seize. Now pretty much everyone uses it according to the newest TSB. Also the newest TSB says to use Motorcraft Carb tune-up cleaner instead of Aerokroil. The Motorcraft stuff works wonders and 15 out of 16 plugs will come out without breaking. Dealers may charge a higher labor rate, but they have access to the latest TSBs and Ford's technical hotline. If you get the feeling they are trying to rip you one, just go there and get them to show you what they are talking about. I get tired of ppl badmouthing dealers.

 

grnmster,

Not to hijack the thread or anything but being that your f-150 has almost 200k on it would you mind sharing your maintenance practices?

What type of oil and filter do you use?
How often do you change the trans fluid?
Have you had any troubles?

My 07' had the popped up cowl issue but aside from from that its been rock solid for 30k and I can easily see getting 200k out of it.

Thanks

 

I recommend that you call a couple of your local auto part stores and see what they say. They are the ones that are hearing the stories and selling the tools and plugs. Ask them if its happening to 08 models. From what I am hearing the change is on 09 models.

 

The head in Ryan's link is a 4.6L, are the 5.4L and 4.6L 3-valve heads the same?

 

The national chains seems not to have spark plugs for the 09 mustangs yet, those may have changed.

 

The 4.6 and 5.4 3v share the same design and have both changed to that style of plug and head.....

There was someone in here a few months back that pulled a plug out of their 08 F-150 and took pictures....but i can't find that thread....

 

The 4.6 and 5.4 3v share the same design and have both changed to that style of plug and head.....

There was someone in here a few months back that pulled a plug out of their 08 F-150 and took pictures....but i can't find that thread....

 

The problem is that no ones needing plugs yet for a 2008 model year....so the parts stores haven't got corrected catalogs yet......Go to the dealer, give them your vin (something built after 11/07) and i'll flat out guarantee that its a new plug and head design.......

Trust me as i did do this, only to find out that it was fall 07 rather than summer 07 and i was stuck with the old design on mine.....