400m help
Thread Starter
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Freshman User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 44
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From: Grand Junction, CO.
400m help
ok so from a bone stock 79 f150 2wd longbed.....would i notice any seat of pants feel if i just add the weiand action plus intake and a holley carb with flowtech headers and a dual 3 in exhaust with an H pipe and the timing straight up?
also whats the concenus on carb for this motor? 600 650 750?
its a street truck by the way and i am ditching what is left of the smog junk...
or should i go another route?
also whats the concenus on carb for this motor? 600 650 750?
its a street truck by the way and i am ditching what is left of the smog junk...
or should i go another route?
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 843
Likes: 1
From: USA
First issue here: You will get beat up on this by some folks here, your engine is Ford 400. No M. It gets miss-labeled because it comes from the 351M/400 series engine. No biggie, happens all the time. To answer your original question, yes you will feel a seat of the pants difference. The Weiand intake is a good intake and services these engines well. As far as a carb. is concerned, 750cfm is a waste of air. Your engine can't use all. If you're in the high part of Colorado then the 600 will be just fine, you'll have to jet it down some to get your plug color right. These engines can go through an obnoxious amount of fuel if you let them. Flowtech headers are good, get ceramic coated if you can, but you don't need a 3" exhaust. 2 1/2" with an "H" will do just fine. If you're changing your timing set try to go double roller. When you ditch the rest of the smog junk you will have to re-curve your distributer to keep things in check. Detention will be a problem otherwise. These engines are good engines but like any other engine it depends on how deep your pockets are as to what you can do with them.
ok so from a bone stock 79 f150 2wd longbed.....would i notice any seat of pants feel if i just add the weiand action plus intake and a holley carb with flowtech headers and a dual 3 in exhaust with an H pipe and the timing straight up?
also whats the concenus on carb for this motor? 600 650 750?
its a street truck by the way and i am ditching what is left of the smog junk...
or should i go another route?
also whats the concenus on carb for this motor? 600 650 750?
its a street truck by the way and i am ditching what is left of the smog junk...
or should i go another route?
Thread Starter
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Freshman User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
From: Grand Junction, CO.
ok not to start an argument or get slammed here but every book that i have read in since i bought this truck, be it a ford pub or someones engine build guide labels these engines as an m. so they are all wrong? is this not a modified version of the 351 block? and isnt that what the m stands for? just newbie questions on that one...
on the rest of it tho... yes my pockets are deep enough to do this build right the first time, so thats why i am asking all the dumb questions..lol i want to buy things one time unless i break them. so if there is a better setup id really like to know.
on the distributor...wouldnt i need to recurve it anyway since i will be changing the timing by 30 deg? and by detention did you mean detonation? or is that something else i dont know about? im glad to hear that i can do a 2 1/2 exhaust, and the 600 carb...much cost savings there
i really appreciate the help and im tryin to learn as fast as possible so as not to annoy the elders here
on the rest of it tho... yes my pockets are deep enough to do this build right the first time, so thats why i am asking all the dumb questions..lol i want to buy things one time unless i break them. so if there is a better setup id really like to know.
on the distributor...wouldnt i need to recurve it anyway since i will be changing the timing by 30 deg? and by detention did you mean detonation? or is that something else i dont know about? im glad to hear that i can do a 2 1/2 exhaust, and the 600 carb...much cost savings there
i really appreciate the help and im tryin to learn as fast as possible so as not to annoy the elders here
Thread Starter
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Freshman User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 44
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From: Grand Junction, CO.
gary p. i like your header pics....what brand and style are those? i really wish there were more ford guys in my area so i had brains and trucks to pick knowledge from...
Senior User
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 157
Likes: 0
From: Mariposa, CA
ok not to start an argument or get slammed here but every book that i have read in since i bought this truck, be it a ford pub or someones engine build guide labels these engines as an m. so they are all wrong? is this not a modified version of the 351 block? and isnt that what the m stands for? just newbie questions on that one...
i really appreciate the help and im tryin to learn as fast as possible so as not to annoy the elders here
i really appreciate the help and im tryin to learn as fast as possible so as not to annoy the elders here
History of the Ford 351M
The engineers at Ford took the basic 351C block and modified it to power a whole new generation of environmentally-friendly cars and trucks. To start, Ford changed the transmission bell-housing pattern to match that of the larger 429/460 engines. This would allow Ford to continue putting the larger, heavy-duty 460 C6 transmissions with the new 400 engines. Ford also enlarged the main journal diameter from 2.75 inches to 3.0 inches allowing for a greater bearing wear area. The crankshaft stroke was also increased from 3.5 inches to 4.0 inches for a 50 cubic inch increase in engine displacement and greater low-end torque. Finally, the deck height was increased 1.09 inches in order to accommodate the 400s larger stroke. Consequently, the intake manifold had to be widened approximately one inch to accommodate the new deck height. The rest of the engine remained virtually the same. In fact all of the 351C valve train components (except for the pushrods) interchange with 351M/ 400 engines. The 351M/400 cylinder heads will also interchange with the 351C 2brl heads, although the 351M/400 heads have 78.4cc combustions chamber where as the 351C 2V heads had a 76.2cc combustions chamber.
Hope this helps.
Moderator
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 22,415
Likes: 92
From: Denver Metro Area, CO
drilldeep: You can learn a LOT about the M-block engines from the guys in this forum; I
spent around a year reading & learning before doing anything with my engine.
Another good source is Bubba's stuff; although his site is now offline, an archived version
of it lives here:
Bubba's M Block Workshop - Clevelands Forever!
-ct
EDIT: About the M designation, I suspect you're just confused. If you still have a sticker on
your valve cover, it should say (near the top LH side):
Engine family: 351M/400
In short: There is the 351M (and 351W & 351C) and the 400 (with no M in its name). I
read somewhere that, officially, there was no real meaning to the letter M, it's just come
to be known as standing for Modified, or Michigan, or Midland, the general population has
attached those meanings to it, not Ford.
spent around a year reading & learning before doing anything with my engine.
Another good source is Bubba's stuff; although his site is now offline, an archived version
of it lives here:
Bubba's M Block Workshop - Clevelands Forever!
-ct
EDIT: About the M designation, I suspect you're just confused. If you still have a sticker on
your valve cover, it should say (near the top LH side):
Engine family: 351M/400
In short: There is the 351M (and 351W & 351C) and the 400 (with no M in its name). I
read somewhere that, officially, there was no real meaning to the letter M, it's just come
to be known as standing for Modified, or Michigan, or Midland, the general population has
attached those meanings to it, not Ford.
Thread Starter
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Freshman User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 44
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From: Grand Junction, CO.
cool, appreciate the learnin' on that guys...
so....the million dollar question...since this seems to be the ******* step child of Ford motors...is it worth hangin on to and buildin or is it cheaper and better to swap in something else? im all for being more original but if it comes at the cost of parts and performance and such.....
my plan was a rebuild keeping as close to stock bore as possible, throwing in a good performing and sounding cam with some 351c heads and intake and exhaust....nothing super radical but was hoping for something that will turn some heads for sure...
be fun to make some of the local camoro guys a bit nervous at the light...lol
so....the million dollar question...since this seems to be the ******* step child of Ford motors...is it worth hangin on to and buildin or is it cheaper and better to swap in something else? im all for being more original but if it comes at the cost of parts and performance and such.....
my plan was a rebuild keeping as close to stock bore as possible, throwing in a good performing and sounding cam with some 351c heads and intake and exhaust....nothing super radical but was hoping for something that will turn some heads for sure...
be fun to make some of the local camoro guys a bit nervous at the light...lol
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Thread Starter
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Freshman User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 44
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From: Grand Junction, CO.
umm no answers for the new guy eh....
it just seems that i might be able to get more for my 10k motor stash with a different motor and parts would be much easier to come by? ?? or am i just not hittin the right parts and shops?
quoted from Bubbas m-block performance page:
When M-blocks were introduced in trucks in the 1977 model year, the truck engines went back to the original, non-retarded camshaft timing. So if your M-block is from a '77-up truck with the OEM timing set, it doesn't have the retarded camshaft timing.
it just seems that i might be able to get more for my 10k motor stash with a different motor and parts would be much easier to come by? ?? or am i just not hittin the right parts and shops?
quoted from Bubbas m-block performance page:
When M-blocks were introduced in trucks in the 1977 model year, the truck engines went back to the original, non-retarded camshaft timing. So if your M-block is from a '77-up truck with the OEM timing set, it doesn't have the retarded camshaft timing.
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jul 2007
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keep the 400, you can squeeze good power from it for not much, the main supplier for these engines is Tim Meyer, hes got unique high compression pistons and tons of goodies, you can use your stock heads they are identical to 351c 2v heads, and like someone said on another thread,
"call Tim Meyer (1-507-238-4141) and get his opinion on what you would like to do, He is a good guy and knows everything about these engines."
"call Tim Meyer (1-507-238-4141) and get his opinion on what you would like to do, He is a good guy and knows everything about these engines."
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