6.7 Ford Engine
Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 110
Likes: 3
From: Boston
What is the point of urea and why would they even use it then? I was under the impression from reading about this engine that it is going to use passive regeneration with urea injected into the DPF.
Man I thought this engine was going to be more simple than the 6.4 pre DPF.
Posting Guru
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,082
Likes: 0
So the 6.7 is still going to heat the DPF to 700 degrees or whatever it is via spraying fuel on the exhaust stroke?
What is the point of urea and why would they even use it then? I was under the impression from reading about this engine that it is going to use passive regeneration with urea injected into the DPF.
Man I thought this engine was going to be more simple than the 6.4 pre DPF.
What is the point of urea and why would they even use it then? I was under the impression from reading about this engine that it is going to use passive regeneration with urea injected into the DPF.
Man I thought this engine was going to be more simple than the 6.4 pre DPF.
The dpf will regenerate at lower EGTs (passively) in a NOx rich environment. With the addition of SCR, there will be less EGR which gives you less soot to oxidize and the NOx rich environment needed for passive regens. Soot oxidizes at 250C in a NOx environment whereas it takes 600C in an oxygen rich environment (active regens).
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,868
Likes: 9
From: Rhode Island
So the 6.7 is still going to heat the DPF to 700 degrees or whatever it is via spraying fuel on the exhaust stroke?
What is the point of urea and why would they even use it then? I was under the impression from reading about this engine that it is going to use passive regeneration with urea injected into the DPF.
Man I thought this engine was going to be more simple than the 6.4 pre DPF.
What is the point of urea and why would they even use it then? I was under the impression from reading about this engine that it is going to use passive regeneration with urea injected into the DPF.
Man I thought this engine was going to be more simple than the 6.4 pre DPF.
The main components of Diesel emissions is soot, and NOx. The DPF only filters soot, it doesn't do anything about NOx. It needs to be heated to high temperatures to burn the soot off. The Urea is NOT injected into the DPF.
The SCR(device that uses the Urea) only converts the NOx (oxides of nitrogen) into pure nitrogen gas and water. It does nothing for the soot.
The emissions system will be more complicated then the 6.4. There is a bonus however. To get NOx emissions down, you use a lot of EGR. EGR really slams the mileage on Diesels. The SCR and Urea can easily deal with extra NOx in the exhaust, so the engine can be programmed to use less EGR then the older engines. I expect around 2 MPG more with the 6.7 from just the less EGR, never mind any other improvements Ford may do.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,757
Likes: 5
From: Corvallis, OR
I really wish Ford would have just put the Cummins in since they own the company. I guess its just the previous contract with Dodge that prevents this? Or maybe just saving face by not using "the Dodge engine".
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,096
Likes: 0
Ford barely owns Ford. They most certainly don't own Cummins.
Elder User
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 937
Likes: 0
Why? Aluminum heads?
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Joe Kucinski
Freshman User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Fort St. James
Im going to throw my 2 cents in here. You wont find a single diesel with less problems or as long of a life as the old ones. THe old 6.9 and 7.3 pre turbos had far fewer problems and way longer lifes. The reason is simple. People want more. More hp, more torque. The companies respond and the engines that could become the engines that blow up. You have engines with smaller displacements kicking out 2-3 times the power. Your going to find the weak link far sooner. I understand that a good part of it is effieciency. But you still have the higher cylinder pressures due to turbos and the higher egts (I believe the new ones have higher egts than the old if not please correct me.) If you take an old ford 300, the thing was bullet proof in stock trim, start adding go fast goodies, after a while you get your 350hp, but at what cost. Instead of getting 300,000km on it you get 180,000km. Like I said just my 2 cents. People want more but they dont want to give anything up, if you want more power deal with the problems. The emmisions just tend to exasberate things even more.
Monty
Monty
Freshman User
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
With all the money Ford is spending on designing a new diesel, wouldent it be great to see a Caterpillar in there? What a selling point...Cat C7 out of the box with 900 lbs. of torque,let Cat deal with all the smog stuff,they already have all the parts on the shelf,and I would pay alot more for for a good truck with a good engine,look at the choices Detroit is giving us,
Ford- good truck, bad diesels
Chev/GMC- girly truck,decent engine,weak suspension
Dodge-Good engine, crappy truck
No wonder they are it trouble!
Ford- good truck, bad diesels
Chev/GMC- girly truck,decent engine,weak suspension
Dodge-Good engine, crappy truck
No wonder they are it trouble!
New User
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
If you read more into the 6.0L problems. Most were caused by competition for short. Ford needed an answer to chevys duramax and the 7.3 wouldnt make emissions standards. Ford put pressure on Navistar to get the motor out, Navistar inturn hired german engineers half way through the development process to help with the design. Everything was rushed through due to the time line ford gave Navistar. The problems with the early 03 and 06 6.0's with the HPOP and Turbo were mostly at faults of the german engineers. They designed these items with german petrolium products in mind. There diesel is closer to our Kerosene, everything there is refined futher. The xtra soot from the higher sulfer diesel caused the problems with the turbo and some of them with the injectors. If you know anything about fluids, its all about compatability! Try putting Mercron 3 in a ford tranny designed for SP and see what happens!
Senior User
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 110
Likes: 0
From: Central IL
If you read more into the 6.0L problems. Most were caused by competition for short. Ford needed an answer to chevys duramax and the 7.3 wouldnt make emissions standards. Ford put pressure on Navistar to get the motor out, Navistar inturn hired german engineers half way through the development process to help with the design. Everything was rushed through due to the time line ford gave Navistar. The problems with the early 03 and 06 6.0's with the HPOP and Turbo were mostly at faults of the german engineers. They designed these items with german petrolium products in mind. There diesel is closer to our Kerosene, everything there is refined futher. The xtra soot from the higher sulfer diesel caused the problems with the turbo and some of them with the injectors. If you know anything about fluids, its all about compatability! Try putting Mercron 3 in a ford tranny designed for SP and see what happens!
New User
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Future Diesel Engines
Ford needs to take themselves out of the box on these V8 Diesels. They need to focus on a truly reliable Diesel Engine, a six cylinder in line with a single turbo with the ability for more power if it is desired.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,868
Likes: 9
From: Rhode Island
Just curious, what makes you think a single turbo inline 6 more reliable then a twin turbo V8? ...Because as far as I know, some of Cummins's, Cat's and Detroit's strongest most reliable diesels were V8s, V12s, V16s and V20s, with two or even four turbos.