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Old Feb 3, 2009 | 07:44 PM
  #46  
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ckal704
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Originally Posted by tbm3fan
Submariner. Philippines December 1941. US submarines based in Manila withdraw to Java on Dec. 21, 1941. Bataan Death March April 1942.

Something doesn't ring right. As one can see all US subs pulled out of Manila before it fell on Jan. 2, 1942. If you, as a submariner, were still on the island then you missed your ship. The first confirmed sinking of a Japanese warship was Dec. 16, 1941 by the USS Swordfish. Don't think the Japanese had built up their dislike of US submariners yet.

While I don't necessarily doubt he was a prisoner of war I do doubt he was in the Bataan Death March. We had not lost an American submarine yet so there could not have been any present.

If he was a submariner who was a POW who survived then he would be on this list along with the name of his boat.

US SUBMARINE POWS OF WWII
Well, I'm only repeating the story as I remember it.
Bill never talked about his war experience himself. My father told me some of it and his wife told me other parts. So, I apologize if the facts don't add up.
What I know to be facts:
He was P.O.W. in WWII
He kept a loaded .45 and 2 pineapple grenades in a drawer of a cabinet in the side room of his cabin. I saw them. Were the grenades fake? Who knows?
His name is not on the list at the link provided. So he was not captured as a submariner. Can't explain that, was my impression that he was in the subs. So I am wrong there, somehow. Called my dad. He verified Bataan, but didn't have an answer for the submariner part. So the story is wrong there somehow. And too, I don't know who told my dad so it may have been a tale from someone all along.
His fingers were gruesome to look at. Crooked, crossed and some nails deformed. Not just a couple on one hand, but every single one had something terribly wrong with it. I do not doubt he was POW.
I was in his camp when the Korean kids asked about plugging in their cooker and saw his reaction. It was shocking to see someone transformed in the way he was for those few scary moments. I had never before or since seen anything like it.
I was at our camp when after he died his wife came out to visit with my mom and she relayed the manner of his passing to my mother. I was in the room for the story. She was there to witness it, I believe her.

But my point is that I knew a man that Walt Kowalski reminded very much of. He had gone through hell in war and every day was a struggle for him.

Sorry if some of the details don't match up.
Anyway....thanks again to all of our vets for their sacrifice. I think part of what Gran Torino shows is that war never really leaves most veterans.
 
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Old Feb 4, 2009 | 02:45 AM
  #47  
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It may be possible that the story was heard partially right and wrong at the same time. Wherever you have submarines you also have submarine tenders. At the time there were three tenders in the Manila and Cavite area. They were AS-3 USS Holland, AS-9 USS Canopus and AS-20 USS Otus. While the Holland and Otus left for Port Darwin the Canopus was ordered to stay behind. Also a few men from the other two tenders had orders to stay behind to obtain spare parts and torpedos. The Canopus was to move up to Mariveles Bay at the tip of the Bataan. She was to service smaller vessels and Army equipment while there. When Bataan fell on April 9th the Canopus back out into deep water under her own power and then scuttled herself. Naturally all those surface sailors became prisoners of war.
 
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Old Feb 4, 2009 | 05:36 AM
  #48  
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I saw it the other day,and their are many morales in the story.I think Clint was sending us a message,he sure looked aged.
 
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Old Feb 4, 2009 | 11:26 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by 393STROKER
I saw it the other day,and their are many morales in the story.I think Clint was sending us a message,he sure looked aged.
he can still whoop a$$! Loved the movie, I thought it had a great message.
 
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