Starting Issues..... Grinding
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 56
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From: Warrensburg, Missouri
Starting Issues..... Grinding
I need all the help that i can get!!!!!
I have a 1991 ranger, but the previous owner put a 2.9L V6 from a 1989? Bronco II.
The starter is not grabbing the flywheel correctly. I cant even start the truck because of this........
Here is what i have done and observed....
New battery
New Starter
New Ground Cable
New Positive cable
New Solenoid
New Battery terminals
Upon inspection, the flywheel looks good.... it looks like the starter drive is barely grabbing it on the front of the flywheel.
I tried shims.... did not work
I am really lost as what to do next....
I have a 1991 ranger, but the previous owner put a 2.9L V6 from a 1989? Bronco II.
The starter is not grabbing the flywheel correctly. I cant even start the truck because of this........
Here is what i have done and observed....
New battery
New Starter
New Ground Cable
New Positive cable
New Solenoid
New Battery terminals
Upon inspection, the flywheel looks good.... it looks like the starter drive is barely grabbing it on the front of the flywheel.
I tried shims.... did not work
I am really lost as what to do next....
Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: Warrensburg, Missouri
I have tried a Starter from a 92 ranger, 91 ranger, <-- same as 89 ranger, and one from a 89 B2....
I also tried on from a 4.0L? it was a smaller but had more teeth on the starter drive.... still didnt work...
I went out there today and tried doing a variety of shims.... i tried angling it different ways..... one way it actually started to grab a little and give it a tiny tiny tiny turn.... I pulled the starter and inspected the gears again..... they all look in almost perfect shape....
I also tried on from a 4.0L? it was a smaller but had more teeth on the starter drive.... still didnt work...
I went out there today and tried doing a variety of shims.... i tried angling it different ways..... one way it actually started to grab a little and give it a tiny tiny tiny turn.... I pulled the starter and inspected the gears again..... they all look in almost perfect shape....
Rub my Belly
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,093
Likes: 1
From: Lawrence, KS
Did the vehicle ever start after the engine swap? If not I am thinking the previous owner may have used the wrong fly wheel spacer or maybe even put the fly wheel on backwards. (not sure if that's possible) could even be the wrong flywheel.
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 56
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From: Warrensburg, Missouri
ya, the truck ran and drove. When it started.... it grinded bad.... sounded terrible
I bought it from an auction... it started right up, but the starter sounded terrible.... started driving it home, when all of a sudden.... i hear a bad grinding noise.... the starter had fallen out! I had to get a new starter because the previous owner put only 1 bolt in it... the casting around the only bolt was broken, so i bought a new one. I bolted the new one up and i am now in the pickle that im in now!
Is it possible to put the flywheel on backwards? I really hope that i dont have to drop the transmission...... Im a one man team with fisher-price tools! lol
I bought it from an auction... it started right up, but the starter sounded terrible.... started driving it home, when all of a sudden.... i hear a bad grinding noise.... the starter had fallen out! I had to get a new starter because the previous owner put only 1 bolt in it... the casting around the only bolt was broken, so i bought a new one. I bolted the new one up and i am now in the pickle that im in now!
Is it possible to put the flywheel on backwards? I really hope that i dont have to drop the transmission...... Im a one man team with fisher-price tools! lol
Rub my Belly
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,093
Likes: 1
From: Lawrence, KS
Not sure if it's possible. If it's an auto, I think it could be possible. You might research an engine swap to see if the 3.0 to 2.9 flex plate and crank to flex plate adapter are the same. As much stuff as you have been threw I'm thinking the problem could lie there. Not sure, just throwing out some ideas.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 13,873
Likes: 3
From: Atlanta GA
You might have a 2.8L flywheel.
Measure the flywheel for exact diameter, the thickness, and count the teeth. I have a scrap one in my garage and I will compare the two. Drop me a PM when you post it.
Measure the flywheel for exact diameter, the thickness, and count the teeth. I have a scrap one in my garage and I will compare the two. Drop me a PM when you post it.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,670
Likes: 12
From: Sand Lake, MI
Sounds that way to me to, got the wrong something going on in there. Flywheel? spacer? something backwards? or some combination of all that.
I have a good 2.9 flywheel and the FW spacer if you need it, yours if you want them. They are out of a 89 bronco 2. Could even round up the bolts if needed....
But yea sounds like you need to drop the trans and find out whats in there but first I'd measure the depth from the bell housing where the starter bolts up to the front edge of the flywheel's teeth, then measure the starter from the face of the bolt flange to the end of the bendix gear with it kicked out all the way. Measurement should be real close to the same on both, starter doesn't/can't reach it? the flywheel is the wrong one or mounted wrong. I doubt FW would clear without any spacer at all, would hit the back of the block, but who can say for sure what someone might have done in there?
I have a good 2.9 flywheel and the FW spacer if you need it, yours if you want them. They are out of a 89 bronco 2. Could even round up the bolts if needed....
But yea sounds like you need to drop the trans and find out whats in there but first I'd measure the depth from the bell housing where the starter bolts up to the front edge of the flywheel's teeth, then measure the starter from the face of the bolt flange to the end of the bendix gear with it kicked out all the way. Measurement should be real close to the same on both, starter doesn't/can't reach it? the flywheel is the wrong one or mounted wrong. I doubt FW would clear without any spacer at all, would hit the back of the block, but who can say for sure what someone might have done in there?
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,907
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From: suburban atlanta
I think you have the wrong starter. Do you still have the old one that fell out and broke? If so, you can manually move the shoe into the field windings, and measure how far the teeth move into the flywheel gear. Measure from the flat surface on the starter - where it bolts to the bell housing - to the far end of the teeth. You will have to use a square of some kind to get an accurate measure. Now, do the same thing on the replacement starter. If they are different, you have the wrong starter.
This is a lot easier than dropping the transmission, etc. You can also measure the offset of the flywheel teeth from the flat machined surface where the starter mounts. You should be able to calculate if the gears would engage with the starter shoe pulled in and the gear extended.
This ain't rocket science, it is plain addition and subtraction.
FWIW, I know of no FoMoCo product that used shims as a normal assembly line procedure on their starters. I am willing to be corrected..
tom
This is a lot easier than dropping the transmission, etc. You can also measure the offset of the flywheel teeth from the flat machined surface where the starter mounts. You should be able to calculate if the gears would engage with the starter shoe pulled in and the gear extended.
This ain't rocket science, it is plain addition and subtraction.
FWIW, I know of no FoMoCo product that used shims as a normal assembly line procedure on their starters. I am willing to be corrected..
tom
Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: Warrensburg, Missouri
I think you have the wrong starter. Do you still have the old one that fell out and broke? If so, you can manually move the shoe into the field windings, and measure how far the teeth move into the flywheel gear. Measure from the flat surface on the starter - where it bolts to the bell housing - to the far end of the teeth. You will have to use a square of some kind to get an accurate measure. Now, do the same thing on the replacement starter. If they are different, you have the wrong starter.
This is a lot easier than dropping the transmission, etc. You can also measure the offset of the flywheel teeth from the flat machined surface where the starter mounts. You should be able to calculate if the gears would engage with the starter shoe pulled in and the gear extended.
This ain't rocket science, it is plain addition and subtraction.
FWIW, I know of no FoMoCo product that used shims as a normal assembly line procedure on their starters. I am willing to be corrected..
tom
This is a lot easier than dropping the transmission, etc. You can also measure the offset of the flywheel teeth from the flat machined surface where the starter mounts. You should be able to calculate if the gears would engage with the starter shoe pulled in and the gear extended.
This ain't rocket science, it is plain addition and subtraction.
FWIW, I know of no FoMoCo product that used shims as a normal assembly line procedure on their starters. I am willing to be corrected..
tom
I do not have the old starter, i gave it to the Auto parts store for a core.... i went back in the next day and they had already sent it out....
I have tried a bunch of different ford starters.... and none have worked...
I wil get out there and do some measurements and report back!
Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 56
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From: Warrensburg, Missouri
Well, so far what i have cam up with is this....
Bell housing to front of flywheel--->1/2"
Bell housing to rear of flywheel----->about 7/8"
Flat part of starter to far end of starter teeth when the gear is extended---> 1 1/4"
I didnt count the teeth on the flywheel or measure it because its getting pretty damn cold and i dont have a garage. The starter has 9 teeth though.
Basically by looking at those numbers, my starter should kick out far enough. Is seems like the starter needs to be cocked to the side one way or angled????? The starter is hitting the front of the flywheel and just grinding the front of it.
Bell housing to front of flywheel--->1/2"
Bell housing to rear of flywheel----->about 7/8"
Flat part of starter to far end of starter teeth when the gear is extended---> 1 1/4"
I didnt count the teeth on the flywheel or measure it because its getting pretty damn cold and i dont have a garage. The starter has 9 teeth though.
Basically by looking at those numbers, my starter should kick out far enough. Is seems like the starter needs to be cocked to the side one way or angled????? The starter is hitting the front of the flywheel and just grinding the front of it.