Oil Pump Gone?
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Freshman User
Joined: Mar 2005
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Oil Pump Gone?
Ok, I need some confirmation here:
I did an oil change of my F350 (360FE motor).
When I drained the oil, the first thing to come out was water. Crystal clear water. Then some white "stuff" I presumed was oil mixed with water (just a tiny bit), then the drainage oil.
Odd...
So next, I remove the oil filter. Odder yet... it's empty. Bone dry, and just as new and clean looking as the day I put it on last year. (The truck mostly sits).
Now I'm thinking the oil pump has quit...
So I refill the oil, and start 'er up, sans filter. Nothing. Nothing coming out at all.
I'm thinking the oil pump went, and the oil just sat in the pan and the moisture just condensed into the oil pan... easy, if the pump quit... it's not getting stirred into the oil.
Sound about right? I thought of trying to blow some compressed air into the center hole where the oil filter spins on, in case maybe it's a clogged screen. I was also thinking of pulling the distributor, and seeing if there's an issue with the shaft.
What are y'alls thoughts?
I did an oil change of my F350 (360FE motor).
When I drained the oil, the first thing to come out was water. Crystal clear water. Then some white "stuff" I presumed was oil mixed with water (just a tiny bit), then the drainage oil.
Odd...
So next, I remove the oil filter. Odder yet... it's empty. Bone dry, and just as new and clean looking as the day I put it on last year. (The truck mostly sits).
Now I'm thinking the oil pump has quit...
So I refill the oil, and start 'er up, sans filter. Nothing. Nothing coming out at all.
I'm thinking the oil pump went, and the oil just sat in the pan and the moisture just condensed into the oil pan... easy, if the pump quit... it's not getting stirred into the oil.
Sound about right? I thought of trying to blow some compressed air into the center hole where the oil filter spins on, in case maybe it's a clogged screen. I was also thinking of pulling the distributor, and seeing if there's an issue with the shaft.
What are y'alls thoughts?
Logistics Pro
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,785
Likes: 4
From: Mddl A MexCans
If it starts and runs(good) then there is nothing wrong with the dizzy/shear pin. I would expect a sheared drive shaft to the pump before a failed pump based on the 0 oil in the filter scenario. Pull either the dizzy (& use a 6" long extension with a thin wall .25" socket and spin the pump shaft) or the pan #2 and confirm the shaft is in good order. I would expect a failing pump to at least pump some oil. JM .02¢ keep us posted.
Hotshot
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 18,488
Likes: 22
From: The Big, Oregon
Ok, back up here- starting and running without an oil pump is a bad thing. Usually involves knocking and bearings being spun since lubrication is critical to the process here.
I have to wonder how that engine is still running.
I have to wonder how that engine is still running.
Cargo Master
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,574
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From: Golden, CO
I have to wonder where the water came from.
The high pressure bypass is...inside the oil pump. If you have the filter adapter that holds the filter horizontal, and the bypass is stuck open, there is nothing to stop the filter from draining back to the oil pan.
I hope you didn't stretch a rod.
The high pressure bypass is...inside the oil pump. If you have the filter adapter that holds the filter horizontal, and the bypass is stuck open, there is nothing to stop the filter from draining back to the oil pan.
I hope you didn't stretch a rod.
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The filter is vertical; stock I presume. It looks like it's never seen a drop of oil.
The water is very clear. I'm thinking condensation that built up- both from the oil never being run through the motor to get hot enough to evaporate it, and the oil pump not mixing it into the oil (which would turn the oil into a tell-tale creamy mess.)
I suppose I could unscrew the oil pressure sending unit (for the idiot light, which doesn't work) and see if oil is flowing there?
The water is very clear. I'm thinking condensation that built up- both from the oil never being run through the motor to get hot enough to evaporate it, and the oil pump not mixing it into the oil (which would turn the oil into a tell-tale creamy mess.)
I suppose I could unscrew the oil pressure sending unit (for the idiot light, which doesn't work) and see if oil is flowing there?
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Cargo Master
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,574
Likes: 4
From: Golden, CO
Maybe you dodged a bullet. Maybe the bypass is stuck open, but still allowed enough oil through the system. There should be oil in the filter. The sender port is after the filter. If there is no oil in the filter, there will be no oil at the sender.
Good practice is to pour oil in the filter at installation. You don't do this?
Just for grins, spin the filter back on, remove the sender, pull the plugs and distributor cap, crank the engine for a few minutes. Could be the pump lost it's prime...could be.
This poor old thing didn't make a gawdawful racket?
Good practice is to pour oil in the filter at installation. You don't do this?
Just for grins, spin the filter back on, remove the sender, pull the plugs and distributor cap, crank the engine for a few minutes. Could be the pump lost it's prime...could be.
This poor old thing didn't make a gawdawful racket?
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Freshman User
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I had changed the oil just before I parked it about 2 years ago. Then I started it up a couple weeks ago, and it's run for about 5 minutes at a time. I would think the oil filter would have filled up in one of the few times I've run it since I did the oil change a couple years ago; that's the filter I took off and found bone dry. No, I don't usually fill the filter up; I have to tip it to get it by the plow frame.
It is ticking a little; I'd definitely have figured more racket, though; but if it's getting oil somehow, darned if I can see how.
Could the pickup screen be clogged with gunk from sitting? This truck has done way more sitting the past 8 years than running.
I'm kinda hoping it's something relatively easy to fix; we're coming up on plow season, and I'd like to at least get by. I have another 360 with 1100 miles on a reman I was going to dump in in the spring.
It is ticking a little; I'd definitely have figured more racket, though; but if it's getting oil somehow, darned if I can see how.
Could the pickup screen be clogged with gunk from sitting? This truck has done way more sitting the past 8 years than running.
I'm kinda hoping it's something relatively easy to fix; we're coming up on plow season, and I'd like to at least get by. I have another 360 with 1100 miles on a reman I was going to dump in in the spring.
New User
Joined: Nov 2008
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hate to say it but water dose not build up like that without couse sounds like you changed the filter right after that pump went and ya heated it just enough to lose a seal
bet that shaft gone and ya ya can get to it with a long extension and a drill after ya pull the dis but remember to tape the socket ya use so it dosent drop
that can be a real pain
did ya park it right after ya put the filter on?
bet that shaft gone and ya ya can get to it with a long extension and a drill after ya pull the dis but remember to tape the socket ya use so it dosent drop
that can be a real pain
did ya park it right after ya put the filter on?
New User
Joined: Nov 2008
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slide the socket on the shaft where the dizzy sat and turn it by hand first if it turns free with a little resistance then turn it with the drill atached to the extension and see if it primes that filter full
helps to leave the filter a tad loose so you dont fight any build up in th oil ways but it should prime even if the pump is just going out,
if not then you may have some blockage in the intakeline or the oil filter housing
but if the pump turns free and smoot then it should push some oil
helps to leave the filter a tad loose so you dont fight any build up in th oil ways but it should prime even if the pump is just going out,
if not then you may have some blockage in the intakeline or the oil filter housing
but if the pump turns free and smoot then it should push some oil
New User
Joined: Oct 2008
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Ok its possible that the water is condensation. The question is, how much water came out? A little or a lot? Its normal for a vehicle that sits for extended lengths of time to have condensation, especially if you live in a climate with alot of temperature changes. A clogged crankcase ventilation line can also cause this. Just because the engine ran, doesn't mean the oil pump is good, i know people who have driven around their neighborhood with the oil drained out of their engine and it still ran fine (its some kind of oddity, but its true), others barely made it out of their drive way. If you put the drill on it, its possible (if the pump is good) that it can push out the front seal if it builds up to much pressure (correct me if im wrong on this guys), but i've made that mistake before priming an engine. But you can look at it this way, if it pushes the seal out, you have a good pump lol.