Ignition Cut Out
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Senior User
Joined: May 2002
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 11-Sep-02 AT 10:15 PM (EST)]I have an 86 F350, 460/C6. Just replaced the timing gears with the Edelbrock roller, straight up. I run an MSD 5 ignition box with my stock Duraspark.
Here's the problem. Immediately after replacing the timing gears, I took it on the freeway and experienced a momentary ignition cut out. Not a miss, just for a split second the ignition system cut out.
Now it will cut out once in a while, mostly at highway speeds. It has happened at slower speeds, but not as much, and it will do it more as I drive. It's inconsistent. I suspected the dist. cap-n-rotor but this didn't fix the problem.
What else? Could it be the coil? My MSD box, stock ignition box? Could it be in the ignition switch?
I have to believe that this is just a coincidence that it started hapenning immediately after installing the timing gears. I didn't do anything to the ignition system.
Help me out here guys...Thanks
Here's the problem. Immediately after replacing the timing gears, I took it on the freeway and experienced a momentary ignition cut out. Not a miss, just for a split second the ignition system cut out.
Now it will cut out once in a while, mostly at highway speeds. It has happened at slower speeds, but not as much, and it will do it more as I drive. It's inconsistent. I suspected the dist. cap-n-rotor but this didn't fix the problem.
What else? Could it be the coil? My MSD box, stock ignition box? Could it be in the ignition switch?
I have to believe that this is just a coincidence that it started hapenning immediately after installing the timing gears. I didn't do anything to the ignition system.
Help me out here guys...Thanks
Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,357
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From: S. Mississippi
Ignition Cut Out
I'm not too familiar with a 460 (never owned one) but if they have that TFI ignition from ford, like the smallblocks do, then id look there on your distributor. i had an 85 mercury with a v6 do this to me constantly and it finally died, i never fixed it but i eliminated all other possibilities, and it was my ign module on the dizzy. take it off and go to autozone and they will test it, or either drive the truck there and they will test it. (i don't remember which)
Good luck to ya!
Good luck to ya!
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Senior User
Joined: May 2002
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
Here's another clue...
These "cut outs" will occur with the engine running between 2500 and 3000 rpm, whether on the freeway, or running in second going down the street at 45mph.
The only indication of a problem (other thant he momentary loss of power) is the vacuum guage slams to zero for the split second of the "cut out". The tach remains steady.
Is this even ignition?
I replaced the cap-n-rotor, fresh plugs and wires, and a new coil.
The vacuum guage has me scratching my head.
I need the experts here to help me out.
Thanks
These "cut outs" will occur with the engine running between 2500 and 3000 rpm, whether on the freeway, or running in second going down the street at 45mph.
The only indication of a problem (other thant he momentary loss of power) is the vacuum guage slams to zero for the split second of the "cut out". The tach remains steady.
Is this even ignition?
I replaced the cap-n-rotor, fresh plugs and wires, and a new coil.
The vacuum guage has me scratching my head.
I need the experts here to help me out.
Thanks
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Senior User
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 484
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
I tried all of these thing...
retarded the timing
unplugged the vac advance
bypassed the msd box
replaced the coil
replaced the ignition module
Nothing is helping and it is getting worse.
Please...Help!!!
retarded the timing
unplugged the vac advance
bypassed the msd box
replaced the coil
replaced the ignition module
Nothing is helping and it is getting worse.
Please...Help!!!
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,157
Likes: 1
From: Central Kali
Ignition Cut Out
If you could rig up a timing light inside the cab, you could drive it and monitor the ignition to see if it quits. The vacuum guage is interesting. I am thinking it may not be a ignition problem. Is this a carb or a fuel injection system? 
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Senior User
Joined: May 2002
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
I am running an Edelbrock 750 w/electric choke. Very little electronics, only the module, and I changed that.
The only thing in the ignition left is the distributor itself.
It is also strange (or coincidence) that this problem started immediately after changing the timing gears. If it were mechanical though, it would be happening with a pettern, right?
Here's another thing to think about. I doubt that this has anything to do with it, but...The alternator is acting up. The guage is eradic, and the lights are pulsating, like the voltage regulator is going out. Test shows a voltage "pulse". If the voltage were to spike at high speeds, could this effect the ignition? It seems then that I would be blowing light bulbs and stuff too.
Unless someone has a wonderful suggestion, I am going to replace the distributor. I am tired of replacing good parts though.
I got a headhache...
The only thing in the ignition left is the distributor itself.
It is also strange (or coincidence) that this problem started immediately after changing the timing gears. If it were mechanical though, it would be happening with a pettern, right?
Here's another thing to think about. I doubt that this has anything to do with it, but...The alternator is acting up. The guage is eradic, and the lights are pulsating, like the voltage regulator is going out. Test shows a voltage "pulse". If the voltage were to spike at high speeds, could this effect the ignition? It seems then that I would be blowing light bulbs and stuff too.
Unless someone has a wonderful suggestion, I am going to replace the distributor. I am tired of replacing good parts though.
I got a headhache...
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Ignition Cut Out
With a long piece of wire with alligator clips on it attach it one end to the + side of the coil > Run the other end to the cab attached to a red wire of a Voltmeter.
Take the other wire(black) and run it to ground.
Now go for a drive. If the Voltage on the Voltmeter drops to nothing ,that tells you that it's the voltage going to the coil that disappears.
If the voltage doesn't drop,then the problem is secondary circuit > Coil to the Distributor.
The alternative is to have someone run beide the truck watching the voltmeter laying on the inside fender>
*GRIN*
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Take the other wire(black) and run it to ground.
Now go for a drive. If the Voltage on the Voltmeter drops to nothing ,that tells you that it's the voltage going to the coil that disappears.
If the voltage doesn't drop,then the problem is secondary circuit > Coil to the Distributor.
The alternative is to have someone run beide the truck watching the voltmeter laying on the inside fender>
*GRIN*
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Thread Starter
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Joined: May 2002
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
thanks for the suggestion, this will at least narrow it down, but with this only happening at higher engine speeds, would you lean more toward the distributor, or could it still be in the ignition switch or something like that?
It seems like if it were the ignition switch, or before the ignition module, it would happen at any speed, but still maybe eradic.
Everything from the module to the coil has been replaced, and the MSD box has been taken out of the loop.
And...does the vacuum guage going to zero, and the tach remaining steady mean anything, or does it still sound like ignition?
Thanks for all the help.
It seems like if it were the ignition switch, or before the ignition module, it would happen at any speed, but still maybe eradic.
Everything from the module to the coil has been replaced, and the MSD box has been taken out of the loop.
And...does the vacuum guage going to zero, and the tach remaining steady mean anything, or does it still sound like ignition?
Thanks for all the help.
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Ignition Cut Out
I didn't see the vacuum going to zero part.
Have you tried another vacuum gauge to confirm it ?
No vacuum means the pistons aren't sucking in air.
Distributor's usually give you a miss & backfire at higher speed when they fail.This from worn out bushings and the out of round effect of the shaft.
It could be the stator assembly in dizzy.
It seems more electrical oriented.
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Have you tried another vacuum gauge to confirm it ?
No vacuum means the pistons aren't sucking in air.
Distributor's usually give you a miss & backfire at higher speed when they fail.This from worn out bushings and the out of round effect of the shaft.
It could be the stator assembly in dizzy.
It seems more electrical oriented.
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FTE Assistant Administrator
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Posting Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
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From: Greenwood In. USA
Ignition Cut Out
I seem to remember from my Tech School days that Ford Dura Spark pick up coils were prone to the wires breaking internally so that when the advance worked it would act up. Just a thought
Regards
Gasman
Regards
Gasman
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
The saga continues...Replaced the dist today, and when I initially started it the timing was at 0 degrees, and it was backfiring through the carb at just above idle. I got in the truck and closed the door and this is the problem I am experiencing. It's actually backfiring through the carburator and this is slamming the vacuum guage to zero.
I advanced the timing to 15 degrees on the new dist. This is as far as I can advance it due to the wires comming out of the dist being mashed against the thermostat housing. This made it a bunch better, as I could not get it to backfire while standing, I had to take it for a drive to get it to do it.
I am thinking that my dist is off a tooth? My old one was in the same place, I could get it to almost 20 degrees, but the black wire from the dist was broken. Is my timing too far retarded? and will this cause my backfiring through the carb problem. Did the new straight up timing gear set just bring out that the dist was off a tooth?
I'm getting close, but I still gotta headache.
Thanks guys...
I advanced the timing to 15 degrees on the new dist. This is as far as I can advance it due to the wires comming out of the dist being mashed against the thermostat housing. This made it a bunch better, as I could not get it to backfire while standing, I had to take it for a drive to get it to do it.
I am thinking that my dist is off a tooth? My old one was in the same place, I could get it to almost 20 degrees, but the black wire from the dist was broken. Is my timing too far retarded? and will this cause my backfiring through the carb problem. Did the new straight up timing gear set just bring out that the dist was off a tooth?
I'm getting close, but I still gotta headache.
Thanks guys...
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,157
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From: Central Kali
Ignition Cut Out
Perhaps you just found the cause of the problem. If the old timing chain had a lot of slack, and you put the distributor back where it was; would the timing with the new gears not be different? No wait, you checked the timing with a light. You can pull the distributor out and move it a tooth to get it centered where you want it. I would check the timing marks to be sure TDC is correct. I use a dial indicator on a spark plug adapter to do this.
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Senior User
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From: Garden Grove USA
Ignition Cut Out
Yeah I think I found the problem...I had to move the dist back in order to get enough space to advance the timing more. Using the hot start method, I had it at about 36 degrees advanced before it would try to not turn over. I am starting to think that changing the timing gears do infact effect the timing not just a little, but quite a bit.
Seems to be running great now, but I haven't done a thourough road test yet.
Just as a side note, while I was removing the dist I completely lost spark somehow. No voltage coming out of the coil. Got very frustrated, and confused two other novice mechanics like myself.
Found out to be a loose conncection in the coil cap (what connects the wires to the coil). Spent a ton of curse words figuring that one out. Replaced the connections and fired 'er up.
Thanks for all the help...
My headache is going away... 
Seems to be running great now, but I haven't done a thourough road test yet.
Just as a side note, while I was removing the dist I completely lost spark somehow. No voltage coming out of the coil. Got very frustrated, and confused two other novice mechanics like myself.
Found out to be a loose conncection in the coil cap (what connects the wires to the coil). Spent a ton of curse words figuring that one out. Replaced the connections and fired 'er up.
Thanks for all the help...
My headache is going away...
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Joined: Apr 2004
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From: Malvern PA
I have a 95 250 5.8L Went dead yesterday and will not start. Replaced the module, cap and rotor. Gettin' spark off the coil but thats it. I have a new stator ***, how do you replace it and am I on the right track? help!!