Make sure to post up whatever you end up using for brackets, pump, etc. That way all the info is in this thread for later when someone searches for hydroboost!

Also - 75F350 makes a good point - thanks to all that are serving! I didn't meant to be so feisty yesterday - just a bad day and the putting down of perfectly capable parts because they were originally installed in the "other" brand kinda urks me.

 

No issues with me man I understand people can have bad days. Yes I was a soldier and did some time in Iraq butt am now a civilian who works with the Army maintaining track vehicle systems. I am currently in Iraq in support of 4th ID my old division. I spend ten months of every year with the soldiers deployed to Iraq, Kuwait, NTC, and JROTC. I was in Iraq eleven months last year went home two months and here I set again.

Ok maybe I set and think of things to much but are you guys who run this hydro boost system running four wheel disk brake set ups? Is this system ok for use with rear wheel drum set up using wheel cylinders does it create higher pressure on the system components? Is this why I read the mention of an adjustable proportioning valve to regulate the increased pressure on the older components? I have only ever seen this style of power brakes in association with four wheel disk. Sorry to cloud the forum with my questions do to lack of knowledge to this set up.

Oh to be honest the Chevy thing was to be a ha ha ha sorry it was not seen that way!

 

I wouldn't consider your questions as clouding the forums, but rather a "let's learn more about this setup" question - which is good. And you do bring up some good points, so yeah - lets open up this discussion a bit more.

A little back ground on MY use for the hydroboost. I haven't run the system yet, but know a few people who do. No one has had any issues and most love it. The cars they run it on ranger from "el crapminos" (no offense Ed - never liked those things) with lopy cammed 454's to diesel conversions. Some cars have "stock" brakes (disk front and drum rear), others are 4 wheel discs with big Brembo calipers, etc.

The reasons I am looking at the setup are different for the 2 vehicles I want to put it on.

The 1st is "Muttly" - my 74 crew (it's a Mutt consisting of Chebby, ford and dodge parts - get it "Muttly Crew"???). Anyways, the mutt will be getting a 5.9L cummins and I figured I'd dump the vacuum pump for a hydroboost. The mutt will most likely get a Corp 14 rear with disks, possibly the d70 I have in the dodge - but that would get disks too.

The 2nd vehicle is the ranger. It's not much of a ranger anymore (full tube frame race vehicle (pics in gallery). There is no room to run a vaccuum booster and not much foot room to run a long brake pedal. This truck will have 4 wheel disks (race hubs with dodge rotors and Toyota 4 piston calipers).

Both trucks will be getting in line, driver controlled proportioning valves like those available from wilwood.

 

MAny hydro-boost set ups were available with rear drum brakes, in fact probably more were offered as drum brakes in the rear and not 4 wheel disc brakes.

Here is the thing, the 3/4 ton master cylinders, and boosters were not exactly optimum.
Add weight or larger tires and this becomes a real problem.
Some trucks with increased displacement engines that might have larger duration cams and less vacuum really suffer in the brake dept.
Now larger boosters help, but these are pretty costly, and require about the same installation time as a decent hydro system.
Now, if we consider a popular diesel configuration, which have problems with vacuum, or lack of vacuum, you can see that a vacuum pump will be required. This only adds to the complexity of the vacuum system. Since the hydro set-up runs off of hydraulic pressure, it is there as long as the pump is turning.
One might ask what happens in the event of pump failure? Well this is a good question, and the answer is simple. The system is designed to be used for up to three pumps of the brakes without pump pressure, and then the valve will befault to a standard non assisted braking system. No harm, no foul, and very few failures.
now given the complexity of the vacuum system, and its small problems, you can see that the hydro boost is a very cost effective alternative with great benifits.

Pressure can be a little interesting, and this would be the reason for pressure altering valves.
In some cases where a rack and pinion system is used, the racks do not accept pressure as high as the system outputs, so a restriction has to be made.
Same applies for the brakes, but this is also tru for rear disc brake conversions.

 

My power steering pump is shot. If I'm looking at replacing the pump already, would that lower the cost of a hydroboost conversion (as in spending a little more for a more powerful pump)?

 

Ok another question how much horse power is lost using this hydro boost set up? How much is used with a vacume pump set up? And alao how is the pressure stored to mske the hydro boost operate three or four times if you loose power?

eBay Motors: 75-77 Ford Econoline Van E100-E350 Power Steering Pump (item 260260110475 end time Jul-14-08 20:47:12 PDT)

 

Good question regarding the ability to apply brakes after a failure. These systems have an accumulator that stores fluid and permits up to three pumps of the brakes.
These have external, and some internal. Some are spring loaded, and some are nitrogen filled.
Check this out, it should cover your questions.
Operation, Diagnosis and Repair of HYDRO-BOOST Power Assist Systems, Bill Williams, Brake & Front End, March 2005

The above even has some troubleshooting stuff. It is pretty comprehensive.
As far as hp losses, it does place a little extra demand on the crankshaft, but this is a suplimental system, and you are not adding another pump, you are still using a power steering pump already. The losses are minimal. Since you already have a pump, and do not have to turn a vacuum pump, you might even be ahead of the game with regards to hp losses.
Less junk hanging off of the engine means less belts, and that means less chance at throwing one, and reliability goes up.

 

I could not give you any numbers to support it, but I did not notice any power loss when I converted mine to hydroboost. I did not have to adjust the idle up or anything like that either. If it does use up some horsepower, wouldn't you be on the brakes anyway so it wouldn't matter?
The hydroboost operates with an accumulator to store fluid pressure in case of engine or pump failure. This is how it stops a couple times without the engine running.

 

Now 77f150got_sand has got me thinking. I have a high lift cam in the 472 and getting the truck to go is fine........stopping can be scary!!!

I was working towards the brake upgrade Danny Cabral wrote about, using the thunderbird calipers in the front, one ton cylinders in the rear until I find a rear disc brake conversion I'm happy with and using the 1 ton Master Cylinder with a hydroboost pump. The Superduty setup sounds like a really economical way to get the same thing with just a bit of fab work. Did you rob the whole setup off a wrecked '04 or get it from a dealer? Any other info you could offer would be great.

I have a March pulley setup, pretty, but not worth the bling. The PS pump has a nice billet case but it just covers a.............wait for it..............chevy impala PS pump. I had a terrible time getting the pump to work right until I added a remote reservoir.

 

Many times additional fluid can really be the key to sucess, and as many have found, keeping this fluid cool is also important.
I too ran an additional reservoir, and I even extended the neck on a pump, and found that by adding a very large cooler for the power steering, I was able to kill two birds with one stone.
The large cooler now holds more fluid than the old modified pump ever did, and it stays very cool, even off road when I am working the snot out of the box.
I too run a saginaw pump, from a chebby donor. Just the way it goes I guess. That stuff is just so easy to find.

 

I hear you on the cooler part. If the Superduty pump/MC setup works out I'm going to plumb a cooler and filter in also. I've been using braided lines and until I know the direction I'm going I don't want to buy any of those more than once

 

Ok as I mentioned earlier about HMMV parts they use a cooler for the power steering as well. The cooler bolts to the left side of the radiator I assume the cooler is there to keep every thing cool brake booster pump and even the fan clutch which is tied into the power steering system. Yeah the HMMV has a lot being powered from the Saginaw pump.

The newer heavier armored HMMV has all the above I mentioned and they added a slightly larger cooler and external reservoir.

Thanks for the reading material!!!!!!

Ok as I showed Ford also used the pumps and some one mentioned the Ford vans for use of the brackets. Sorry I prefer to trine stick with Ford parts so to who ever mentioned the van thanks. I referenced the HMMV a GM product because that is the only vehicle I’m remotely familiar with that uses a HYDRO BOOST set up.
And thanks again for the information it allows comparasion and judegement of both set ups now that were a little smarter on it.

 

77f150got_sand, I can't get the PM thing to work. Could you e-mail me when you have a chance, I have a couple questions to run by you on your brake setup. Thanks!
jwebster@tnt21.com

 

Why mix Brand names into this anyway?? The pump is a universal brand like Bendix anyway, right?

 

I actually got my Superduty setup from ebay for like $75 I think. It was from a junkyard selling on there. It took me a couple hours to mount it where the origional power booster was and get the correct length and geometry for the pushrod. The next step was getting custom hoses made, I ended up loading the truck on my trailer and taking it around town to different shops until I found one that could make me the hoses.
Here are some threads that helped me with my installation:

start reading about post #15
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/4...any-ideas.html

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...-question.html