cracked front differential

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Dec 14, 2007 | 11:09 PM

#16

ATC Crazy

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From: SW VA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Club Wagon

Please "preach" to another congregation & "NEVER use 4WD unless you are" offroad or negotiating continuously bad winter road conditions. Yesterday I used the 'Cream Puff's' 4WD for the 1st time & was not "stuck". I needed to drag some old junk cars that had been sitting a long time, had sunk into the ground, flat tires & seized brake drums.

Well obviously you can use 4WD to move or tow things that you'd need the traction for. But I still stand by my origional statement, that 4WD should NEVER be used on dry or wet pavement, or other hard surfaces. Over the years, I have seen shattered T-cases, CV-joints, U-joints, and differentials because of this...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Club Wagon

FWD & 4WD both plainly DO "help one bit on ice" as well as virtually every other bad road condition, w/o being "stuck". Snow tires also definitely "help" being compounded of different rubber to enhance winter traction. Pickups driven in 2WD have a pathetic reputation for traction, unless well loaded, anything will "help" them. Don't let the FL 40 fool you, I've driven on loads of ice with RWD, FWD & 4WD.

90% of people don't have a designated winter tire that they throw on their vehicles in the winter...so lets leave the snow tires out of it.

Ice is ice...2WD, 4WD, or 6WD...you don't have control on it. If you don't already know, Im talking about black ice...not a lake or hockey rink. When you have all 4 tires spinning (or skidding) on the ice...what do you think happens when the front tires grab traction? Yeah, that's the shock load that breaks things.

When you hit the brakes on ice while in 4WD, all 4 tires lock up and you will become sideways and out of control fast. Leave it in 2WD, and you will at least have the rear tires (in most cases when they don't lock up...my truck doesn't have ABS, so this applies to me) to help guide the vehicle in a straight line.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Club Wagon

Suggest you drive a Subaru for awhile & discover how AWD is superior to RWD.

And you are comparing apples to oranges. AWD T-cases act as an open differential...designed for use in high-traction enviroments.

Dec 15, 2007 | 12:25 AM

#17

grandaddy's66

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Joined: Aug 2003

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From: Eastern, Iowa

Quote:

Originally Posted by Club Wagon

What's "specialty drivetrain shop" best guess? Wound up tight in 4WD on hard dry surface OR that "pretty good jolt"? May never know for sure?

They didn't know for sure. But they did say try to avoid 4WD on dry pavement at highway speeds. They said it's overkil anyway and puts strain on things that need not be, just as you guys said.

Quote:

Glad to hear the gears & bearings didn't lose oil.

No friggin joke!

Quote:

Call around junkyards & repair shops, you might find a front end that is wrecked or w/shot gears that can donate a bargain axle housing. Bet my stealership would need days to order cross country & I'd need to be sitting when they quoted price.

My ASE guy pays to be networked just for stuff like this. He already has me one en route and the whole shooting match is going to set me back coupla hunnert.

Quote:

I'd always thought of "a c-note" as $100. Eleven "c-notes" in chorus do a lot more "squawking" leaving the comfort of "my wallet". You were contemplating dropping more than a 'G' on your recent truck purchase!

you, sir, are correct. I meant to say "G" note. C-note is hunnert. G-note is ten hunnert and MUCH more painful.

Dec 15, 2007 | 02:36 AM

#18

Club Wagon

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Let's review your "original statement" then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ATC Crazy

This is EXACTLY why I preach to people to NEVER use 4WD unless you are stuck. 4WD will not help one bit on ice...nothing will.

I still stand by my origional statement, that 4WD should NEVER be used on dry or wet pavement, or other hard surfaces

so lets leave the snow tires out of it

Ice is ice... If you don't already know, Im talking about black ice...

You said "nothing will". IMO that is not true, snow tires do help, so do additional driven axles. There is no reason to "leave" anything "out of it".

Intermittent spinning tires that "grab traction" are SOP & rarely threaten to "break things". However, running distances with a 4X4 drive train constantly fighting itself b/c of a lack of slip is expressly warned against.

Similarly I see no reason to limit discussion exclusively to "black ice". The issue seems to be about excess traction NOT minimal traction. 4WD will not be damaged as long as there's poor enough traction to readily allow wheel slip. Most offroad surfaces (grass, sand, dirt, loose rock) are OK. Ice is surely a "hard surface" & you now say "4WD should NEVER be used on "hard surfaces"? IMO 4WD can't claw at "hard surfaces" any harder than rock crawlers seek.

Suggest you not try to "preach" & refrain from overusing "NEVER". The point is that you shouldn't run these pickups in 4WD on good surfaces where traction is fine. You need to avoid the temptation to use 4H when a road is mostly free of ice b/c you fear patches of "black ice" or other slippery spots.

Dec 15, 2007 | 07:01 AM

#19

LxMan1

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Joined: Dec 2001

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From: Louisville,Ky.

OK guys, let's agree to disagree.

Dec 15, 2007 | 11:10 AM

#20

ATC Crazy

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From: SW VA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Club Wagon

Let's review your "original statement" then.

You said "nothing will". IMO that is not true, snow tires do help, so do additional driven axles. There is no reason to "leave" anything "out of it".

Intermittent spinning tires that "grab traction" are SOP & rarely threaten to "break things". However, running distances with a 4X4 drive train constantly fighting itself b/c of a lack of slip is expressly warned against.

Similarly I see no reason to limit discussion exclusively to "black ice". The issue seems to be about excess traction NOT minimal traction. 4WD will not be damaged as long as there's poor enough traction to readily allow wheel slip. Most offroad surfaces (grass, sand, dirt, loose rock) are OK. Ice is surely a "hard surface" & you now say "4WD should NEVER be used on "hard surfaces"? IMO 4WD can't claw at "hard surfaces" any harder than rock crawlers seek.

Suggest you not try to "preach" & refrain from overusing "NEVER". The point is that you shouldn't run these pickups in 4WD on good surfaces where traction is fine. You need to avoid the temptation to use 4H when a road is mostly free of ice b/c you fear patches of "black ice" or other slippery spots.

I admit, It was my fault for leaving out some information.

In my origional statement, I meant never to use 4WD on the road unless you are stuck. Anything off-pavement will be fine.

But, I still stand by my belief that you should NEVER use 4WD on the road unless there is a significant layer of snow, or if you are stuck for some reason.

Dec 15, 2007 | 12:06 PM

#21

montanafordman

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From: Meridian, ID

To throw my opinion out there - 4wd comes in real handy on the icy roads but the thing that gets me is when I see people blazing past me on a narrow highway at 60 plus with their 4wd rigs thinking that - heck even though there is a fresh snow and or black ice I have 4wd so I'm invincible, needless to say I see them in the ditch 4 miles down the road - it doesn't do much for Handling going down a FLAT stretch and SURELY doesn't do squat for braking!! Just because you have 4wd doesn't mean you can outdrive a car that doesn't - you still will take a lot longer to slow down and stop! Then when you get in the ditch that has 4ft deep snow and all your wheels spin it doesn't do much good either - where I find 4wd the most useful is getting into traffic on snow and ice, and especially when driving up mountain passes around here on ice - ever had your rig suddenly downshift on a 6.5% grade going uphill on ice with only the rear wheels spinning? yeah having the rear end break loose like that is NOT fun! Basically avoid dry roads and 4wd - but if its snow/ice and intermittent wet pavement I'm not too worried if I"m going in a straight line.