I have always used Delo 400 15-40. Use it in my excavator, dozer, F250w/aV10 w/216000 miles, Expedition with 133,000. Has always been a good oil for me. And Costco is the cheapest place that I have found to get it at. Has gone up a little because of the ULSD!!!!

 

I only put about 5K/year on my rig , so I just change oil&filter twice a year. I use Rotell 10-30 it winter and 15-40 in the summer. I've done the same on the '93 7.3 and have never had any lube related repairs.

 

I have gotten flamed for the same reasons. My truck is going to die either way, it could be tommorrow or 10 years from now. I change my oil and filter every 5K regardless.
Right now my big dilema is i do not know how much oil is in my 5 gallon bucket of rotella, i forgot and im afraid to change it because i may need more oil.

 

Hey guys "firemediceric' was the one who brought this oil experiment to my attention on another thread. Just giving credit where credit is due. It began with the idea of and engine oil flush at sevice intervals and ended with the experiment that you saw.Have a great day all. Country

 

Just out of curiosity I have been running the motorcraft 15-40 for 120k or since new.What is the over all opinion of the motorcraft ?

 

OK... I've been thinking about this foam issue in synthetic oil, and I have a few questions I'd like to toss out on the table for a re-visit to the issue.

What's the purpose of the oil? Lubricate, right? Perhaps provide a small heat sink to take away some of the combustion heat? Maybe a little. Okay. I'm still with you. next question.

How much oil does it take to provide adequate lubrication? Thick film, thin film, does it make a difference thick or thin? Obviously, it can be too thin to provide adequate lubrication, but can it also be too thick of a film (not talking about viscosity here, just the thickness of the oil film on the two surfaces needing lubrication betweeen them). Certainly, the internal clearances determine, to some degree, the maximum thickness of the film. I would propose that maximum film thickness cna provide a retarding effect, or at least slight resistance to movement between the surfaces of any two parts being lubed.

So?

So THIS... If there is foam in the oil, it offers a potential for a thin film instead of a thick film between moving surfaces. The thin film could be good, but I guess it might also be potentially too thin, depending upon the individual brand or oil properties.

Just because the synthetic oil gets a little foamy, is that necessarily a bad thing? I understand how it could be, but the potential doesn't make it an absolute, does it?

Are there other potential problems with this foam?
Who is behind the testing that this "No synthetic" recommendation came from? Who did the testing? Was the analysis done properly?

The reason I am asking is because of how badly I've seen other industrial studies performed over the years... like the whole dioxin paranoia which resulted in the closure of over 90 manufacturing plants in this country that was based on a single study which was proclaimed to be invalid and inaccurately done by the people who did the study. Problem was that they didn't fess up until the EPA legislations were promulgated and businesses were shut down.

How do we square this one signle report from one individual with the experiences of so many others?

I honestly don't have all the answers. I just want to be a little cautious about throwing out synthetics based on this one recommendation. I'm still evaluating a synthetic in my engine right now, but I am not yet convinced either way.

Forgive my long diatribe... just wanted to open this issue back up again after having thought about it for a week.

What do you guys think?

 

Well Foam is not good, where there is foam there is air. There are two foam tests that are done on oil:

ASTMD-892 (sequence 1-3)

and ASTMD-6082 (high temp oil test)

The better oils will have better test results and post their results. You can find these test results on some posts at bobistheoilguy.com or on some oil manufacturesres web sites.

Not all synthetic brands foam and some synthetics foam less than some base stock oils, so I wouldn't group all synthetics into one category. If you are concerned about foam in a particular synthetic oil you are intersted in using try to find the ASTDM test reults on that particular oil then make your decision based on those test results.

 

I for one am not concerned with the foaming issues. I just changed the oil last night and filled up with synthetic. Of course, I do use Schaeffers 9000 which is reccomended by the BITOG forum.

I actually think my truck has started running better since I switched to the Schaeffers. I was talking with my Schaeffers rep about that yesterday and he said it didn't suprise him and he's seen it before. The additive package they have cleans the internals, including the injectors. This would go right along with the first couple of UOA's I had after the switch, showing my wear numbers temporarily go up as the old crud was cleaned out. But, this last UOA I got had the lowest wear numbers to date, no matter what oil I was using. Looks like my choice of synthetic has cleaned up my engine.

I like my synthetic and will stick with it for as long as I can see in the future. It's doing my engine well, and I have no motivation to change.

 

Pete, what happens when you put air bubbles in a closed pressurized hydrualic system? your hpop and injectors are the same way except the injectors dispise air so much that they may blow a cup off the bottom end and send metal into your combustion camber.

 

Brandon, I was thinking along those lines of the compressability of the air in the HPOP and injectors last night, and can easily see potential issues there. Had not thought through that aspect before making my post yesterday afternoon. Good point.

white Buffalo:
I have asked for the test data you prescribed from Amsoil, and hope to hear back from them soon. The oil has been performing marvelously thus far, and I have over 7K miles on it with a UOA from Blackstone at the 6K mile mark. At the point of sampling, the oil demonstrated wear metal values lower than "typical" for an oil with only 5200 miles on it. This being my first run of synthetic through the engine, I am well pleased, even though i really don't know what the previous owner was running in it when i got it last September.

white Buffalo and jtharvey:
Since you're both using the Schaeffers, I have another question for you. I have read somewhere in this forum, but can no longer find the thread, where someone suggested that Scaheffers will provide the UOA service at no charge if you're using their oil. Is that true? I have not been able to find a reference to that on their website, if it is true. I had planned on trying out the Rotella T 5w40 synthetic after completing my current run on teh Amsoil DEO, but am now very interested in the Scaheffer's 9000 5w40 as my next step (partially due to the reports about its low foaming tendencies).

I apprecaite all you guys' input.

 

Below is Amsoil's response to my inquiry regarding the foaming tendencies of the oil I am using (Amsoil DEO 5w40). It appears to contain reassuring information, but there are no specific numbers reported. I'm going to ask again for comparable data with real numbers in it, or a specification comparison sheet. We'll see what I get from that inquiry.

"Thank you for contacting AMSOIL with your concerns.

In response to your inquiry, foaming tendacies (ASTM D-892 sequences) are included as part of our new product product development process. Articles often use Shell Rotella as a standard of comparison. Our Diesel oils out perform Shell Rotella (and ASTM D-892 requirements).

Thanks again for the opportunity to respond to your concerns. As always, please feel free to contact us again if we can be of further assistance.

Sincerely,
Byron Selbrede
Technical Services"

 

I have not heard that Shaeffers will provide a UOA at no charge. I'm not saying this is not true, but I've not heard it before. I would think my rep would have told me about it since he knows I have UOA's done. But, it's worth a phone call or email to find out.

 

Pete,

Here is the link to the Technical Data sheet (including the foam test) for Schaeffer's 15W-40 (7000) and 5W-40(9000) for comparison when/if you get the specific data you requested.

http://www.schaefferoil.com/datapdf/700.pdf

http://www.schaefferoil.com/datapdf/9000.pdf


The foam test results are on page 4 about 1/2 way down.
<O

As far as the free UOA are concerned. Here is how Schaeffer's policy works:

1) You can purchase a case on 6 UOA testing kits (with postage paid return canisters) for $54. That is $9 a kit.

2) If your purchase is over $500 you get 3 free UOA test kits.

3) If your purchase is over $1,000 you get 6 free test kits.

 

Those are the kind of results I like to see. Makes me very happy with my choice of oil.

 

Thanks, Rich... I'm going with the 9000 on my next OCI.