Does anyone know if installing a programmer will cause warranty issues with Ford? I'd like to add one for occational towing and for the ability to have the additional guage functions, but since the truck is new (300 miles) I don't want to have problems down the road if it needs warranty work. I have had very good luck with Ford, but it seems all the mfg's will jump at any opportunity to deny warranty claims.
Thanks!

 

If they can trace the problem back to the installation of your tuner then yes it will void the warranty. The easy thing to do though for those trips to the dealership simply return your truck to the stock tune and remove your Edge, the dealership won't even know you have it. Also make sure to tell your dealership not to reflash your truck.

 

The only way they could deny a warranty claim is if they could PROVE that it was the fault of negligence or aftermarket accessories. If a dealer insists that it was the fault of the tuner, when it couldn't have caused the failure, there are several legal options you can take.

I'm thinking of doing the same thing with the edge, as I like the additional gauges you can configure with it.

 

Snowdog- Read your owners manual. It tells you what voids the warranty. A dealer can choose not to perform warranty work if they feel a modification caused the problem, they don't have to "prove" anything. Then it is up to you to prove it did not.

 

Take this for what its worth...

My father is a Senior Master Mechanic for a Ford Dealership in Burton, OH. (Gotta love the D-plan!) He has denied several warranty jobs because of chip upgrades. Their regional engineer has some black-box device that connects to the trucks computer and can tell if a chip was ever installed, even if it has since been removed. Granted most of these have been for Powerstroke engines, but if it holds true for those, I couldn't imagine why they would apply the same for the Trident engines.

Personally, (and this is only one man's opinion) I can't imagine an instance when the power boost from a chip would be worth the cost of replacing an engine out-of-pocket.

 

You make a good point, but the issue here is federal law, not a FoMoCo document....

The Magnusson-Moss Warranty - Federal Trade Commission Improvement Act of 1975 protects consumers from such fradulent activity by new car dealers. Under this Act, aftermarket equipment that improves performance does not void a vehicle manufacturer's orginial warranty, unless the warranty clearly states the addition of aftermarket equipment automatically voids your vehicle's warrany or if it can be proven that the aftermarket device is the direct cause of the failure. The easiest way to check this is to look in your owner's manual under, "what is not covered". Under Magnusson-Moss Act a dealer must prove, not just vocalize, that aftermarket equipment caused the need for repairs before they can deny warranty coverage. If they cannot prove such claim-or offer an explanation- it is your legal right to demand compliance with the warranty. The Federal Trade Commission (202.326.3128) administers the Magnusson-Moss Act and monitors compliance with warranty law.

In all but the most rare cases, it's illegal to specify that you cannot use aftermarket equipment.....

"Tie-In Sales" Provisions
Generally, tie-in sales provisions are not allowed. Such a provision would require a purchaser of the warranted product to buy an item or service from a particular company to use with the warranted product in order to be eligible to receive a remedy under the warranty. The following are examples of prohibited tie-in sales provisions.

While you cannot use a tie-in sales provision, your warranty need not cover use of replacement parts, repairs, or maintenance that is inappropriate for your product. The following is an example of a permissible provision that excludes coverage of such things.

Although tie-in sales provisions generally are not allowed, you can include such a provision in your warranty if you can demonstrate to the satisfaction of the FTC that your product will not work properly without a specified item or service. If you believe that this is the case, you should contact the warranty staff of the FTC's Bureau of Consumer Protection for information on how to apply for a waiver of the tie-in sales prohibition

 

Te way a Ford engineer can tell if a Edge or any other programmer has modified the pcm code is by a cdoe flag(P1000) being set.
To remove this code,disconnect the neg battery cable of 30 min then reconnect. THEN cycle the key from off to on(DO NOT START) 6 times.
This is SUPPOSED to clear the code. I just select return to stock,disconnect the Edge,hide the cable & pod.

 

The dealership wont be making any calls on voiding warranty.... that will be up to Ford Motor Company. The dealer only reports its findings and preserves the findings upon the request of Ford for later inspection. They can deny a warranty repair if they find clear evidence of damaged caused physically by the customer. That is a management call there. A technician only points out the damage to the manager.

So a warranty may not be voided, but covered repairs may be denied.

 

They can still tell, if your running a chip.
at least on my PSD EX. I tried all that stuff but they still new it was chipped. I have Edge now, on my 06 F150 and havent needed to go to dealer with her yet. I think there is some sort of (Black Box) on the PSD. So I would think they probably did the same with the F150. Just a guess. Has anyone taken there chipped F150 to a dealer to have serviced and was it detected?

 

I just called the old man and this is according to him...

Codes P0603, P0605 and P0608 are permanantly embedded in the processor and CANNOT be removed. Most scanners cannot detect the codes, but some dealerships and the Ford Engineers have scanners that will. If the code is detected, then the warranty work will be denied.

He just had Powerstroke this week that was denied for repairs. The owner used the truck to plow & spread salt and had installed a chip and a K&N filter. He had tried to reflash the processor to hide evidence of the chip but the engineer found the codes. There was damage to the drivetrain and rear axle caused by over-torquing. Coupled with the damage to the engine from the salt dust inhaled through the unmaintained K&N, the owner is out $14k in uncovered repairs.

 

In this case, you can point to both problems and prove that the owner was responsible. Undermaintained filter and too much power screwed up the driveline. Hell, snow plowing is already hard as heck on a truck; compounding that issue with forcing the engine to put out more than it should is asking for trouble.

BUT, say this same truck with the same deficiencies came in with say...a bad alternator. The dealer couldn't deny covering it under warranty, since there is no way the alternator could be damaged by those mods.

 

Theoretically yes, but that would depend on the dealer. Considering the financial situation of Ford (and other major automanufacturers) they are looking for any reason to deny warranty work. If they could make some excuse (no matter how remote), they will make you fight to get it covered.

Case in point- a friend took his truck in for vibrations & shimmy... he had replaced the tires after 30k because they pretty much were shredded from gravel roads. The dealership tried to deny the coverage since the tires were not original equipment. He had to fight to get the work covered but in the end, the dealership did the work since the tires were equivelent to what was on the truck from the factory.

 

GGarrahan - I have read my manual from cover to cover, and they leave out a lot that could affect the warranty coverage. Do they specifically mention tuners or chips? NO. So from the warranty docs it is impossible to tell if you install something if it will void your warranty. I primarily want it (Edge) for the guage functionality, not to increase power. But after the warranty expires, it might be nice to use the tuning function...

 

Yes, even after removing the chip and (returning it to stock) it can still be detected!! As far as voiding the warranty, an alternator, maybe not but, engine and drivetrain it can and WILL!!

 

Okay. The owner's manual does NOT mention the complete warranty...that's in the seperate Warranty Guide...

Page 12-13 of the 2007 Warranty Guide:

Damage Caused by Alteration or Modification
The New Vehicle Limited Warranty does not cover any damage caused by:
• alterations or modifications of the vehicle, including the body, chassis,
or components, after the vehicle leaves the control of Ford Motor
Company• tampering with the vehicle, tampering with the emissions systems or
with the other parts that affect these systems (for example, but not
limited to exhaust and intake systems)
• the installation or use of a non-Ford Motor Company part (other than
a certified emissions part) or any part (Ford or non-Ford) designed
for off-road use only installed after the vehicle leaves the control of
Ford Motor Company, if the installed part fails or causes a Ford part
to fail. Examples include, but are not limited to lift kits, oversized
tires, roll bars, cellular phones, alarm systems, automatic starting systems
and performance-enhancing powertrain components or software
and performance ‘‘chips’’

Furthermore, these are the only things that will completely void a warranty...Page 14-15, 2007 Warranty guide....

Other Items or Conditions Not Covered
The New Vehicle Limited Warranty does not cover:
• vehicles that have had the odometer disconnected, altered, or inoperative
for an extended period of time with the result that the actual
mileage cannot be determined
• vehicles that have ever been labeled or branded as dismantled, fire,
flood, junk, rebuilt, reconstructed, or salvaged; this will void the New
Vehicle Limited Warranty
• vehicles that have been determined to be a total loss by an insurance
company; this will void the New Vehicle Limited Warranty
• converted Expedition EL Limousines that are not equipped with the
Limousine Builder’s Package (17L) Option, or if the wheelbase is
extended beyond 140 inches, or if the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating
(GVWR) exceeds 9,900 pounds. See important information about
Expedition EL limousine conversion (page 38).
14
• any other Ford or Mercury vehicles that are converted to limousines.
This will void the New Vehicle Limited Warranty. See important
information about conversions (page 38).
• converted ambulances that are not equipped with the Ford Ambulance
Prep Package, see important information about ambulance conversions
(page 37)

!!!!!