Timing issue? Pickup Coil? Inertia switch?
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Timing issue? Pickup Coil?
I have an 86 EFI 302(not original motor).
I was having problems with it running rich/wouldnt stay running unless you kept your foot on it. I have checked the map sensor,IAC, fuel pressure regulator and fuel pressure itself. Those things checked out ok. What didnt check out ok was the EGR, it will not hold vacuum and loses it almost immediately. There is not an obvious leak....does this mean it is bad or does it share a vacuum line with something else? The sensor had correct voltage to it.
Since I was having this problem, I checked the plugs and they were fouled, so I gave it a tuneup, new plugs, wires, cap & rotor. I also replaced the coolant temp sensor and ignition module. I cleaned out the air filter box and cleaned the intake with carb cleaner. Now it will not start....any ideas?? There is spark from the coil and spark to the plug wires. The fuel pressure is 35 at the schader valve and you can hear the pump run everytime you turn the key. It just cranks and cranks but will not fire. We tried turning the Distributor slightly while cranking but it just wont go.
I was having problems with it running rich/wouldnt stay running unless you kept your foot on it. I have checked the map sensor,IAC, fuel pressure regulator and fuel pressure itself. Those things checked out ok. What didnt check out ok was the EGR, it will not hold vacuum and loses it almost immediately. There is not an obvious leak....does this mean it is bad or does it share a vacuum line with something else? The sensor had correct voltage to it.
Since I was having this problem, I checked the plugs and they were fouled, so I gave it a tuneup, new plugs, wires, cap & rotor. I also replaced the coolant temp sensor and ignition module. I cleaned out the air filter box and cleaned the intake with carb cleaner. Now it will not start....any ideas?? There is spark from the coil and spark to the plug wires. The fuel pressure is 35 at the schader valve and you can hear the pump run everytime you turn the key. It just cranks and cranks but will not fire. We tried turning the Distributor slightly while cranking but it just wont go.
Last edited by sainty333; Dec 16, 2006 at 05:31 PM. Reason: Clarification
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From: Right Next to U
What you shouldv'e done was use a code reader to determine what sensor was giving you problems and then fixing that code that came up first...but now thats water under the bridge and is already past, so now that it won't start at this time is a few things you could try, and thats the line going to the EGR (vaccum) ARE you sure you are not getting any vaccum? Have you applied vaccum to the EGR and the diagfram didn't respond? Make sure of this as these EGRs are not cheap. You have to use the same number thats on it as a replacement...(already found this out...) If so, replace the EGR...
Do a Code check useing a Digital Code reader (or if you like the multimeter sweep cheap way...do that one)
Post codes.
Do a Code check useing a Digital Code reader (or if you like the multimeter sweep cheap way...do that one)
Post codes.
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I tried to use a code reader initially, but the truck kept dieing out because it was running so rich. Another problem is that the plugins are corroded and we werent sure if it was even going to get good contact with the reader.
As far as the vacuum to the egr goes, I applied vacuum to it with a pump/tester and it would almost immediately lose whatever pressure it just built up. Diaphram stuck???
The only part I really threw at the truck so far is the ignition module, the rest needed to be replaced anyways.
thanks again for any thoughts
As far as the vacuum to the egr goes, I applied vacuum to it with a pump/tester and it would almost immediately lose whatever pressure it just built up. Diaphram stuck???
The only part I really threw at the truck so far is the ignition module, the rest needed to be replaced anyways.
thanks again for any thoughts
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From: Right Next to U
Well yes it could be that but you are supposed to do a KOEO Test with the code reader, if its making contact it will read (9v battery are required for the code reader).
It simply plugs in and the black wire also plugs into it.
The TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) is under the Throttle Body, which will have to come off to install it (Make sure its adjusted right, some have adjustments ability and some doesn't)
Throwing Parts at it isn't going to fix it...and can be a costly mistake but at least you will know that its not that part (unless you get a bad sensor part, then you'll be forever throwing parts at it-endlessly)
The code reader will help you narrow it down to the cause of your problem(s). Just be sure to reboot the computer after each installation of the electric parts you'll installed)
It simply plugs in and the black wire also plugs into it.
The TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) is under the Throttle Body, which will have to come off to install it (Make sure its adjusted right, some have adjustments ability and some doesn't)
Throwing Parts at it isn't going to fix it...and can be a costly mistake but at least you will know that its not that part (unless you get a bad sensor part, then you'll be forever throwing parts at it-endlessly)
The code reader will help you narrow it down to the cause of your problem(s). Just be sure to reboot the computer after each installation of the electric parts you'll installed)
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KOEO = Key on Engine OFF.
Reboot time is min 30 min, disconnect the neg battery with Key off. Then try to start it. Drive it for 10 miles - Normally smooth driving skills. Do a KOEO test again. Post codes repost results so others can be helped with same or near problems.
Reboot time is min 30 min, disconnect the neg battery with Key off. Then try to start it. Drive it for 10 miles - Normally smooth driving skills. Do a KOEO test again. Post codes repost results so others can be helped with same or near problems.
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From: Right Next to U
21 = Engine Coolant Temperature (ECT) Out Of Range
24 = Intake Air Tempperature (IAT) out of Range
31 = EVP Signal Is/Out of Range/PFE Signal low/EGR Bad
ECT Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (located right front side ((Drivers side) between Intake and Valve cover (one wire)
IAT is near the above sensor
EGR is next to Throttle Body (You already knew this one)
After replacements be sure to reboot computer and test drive then check codes again. Post results.
24 = Intake Air Tempperature (IAT) out of Range
31 = EVP Signal Is/Out of Range/PFE Signal low/EGR Bad
ECT Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (located right front side ((Drivers side) between Intake and Valve cover (one wire)
IAT is near the above sensor
EGR is next to Throttle Body (You already knew this one)
After replacements be sure to reboot computer and test drive then check codes again. Post results.
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Originally Posted by locknkey
21 = Engine Coolant Temperature (ECT) Out Of Range
24 = Intake Air Tempperature (IAT) out of Range
31 = EVP Signal Is/Out of Range/PFE Signal low/EGR Bad
ECT Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (located right front side ((Drivers side) between Intake and Valve cover (one wire)
IAT is near the above sensor
EGR is next to Throttle Body (You already knew this one)
After replacements be sure to reboot computer and test drive then check codes again. Post results.
24 = Intake Air Tempperature (IAT) out of Range
31 = EVP Signal Is/Out of Range/PFE Signal low/EGR Bad
ECT Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (located right front side ((Drivers side) between Intake and Valve cover (one wire)
IAT is near the above sensor
EGR is next to Throttle Body (You already knew this one)
After replacements be sure to reboot computer and test drive then check codes again. Post results.
I have already replaced the ECT...this must have been a stored code. I didnt reset after this because it didnt start. I will be picking up the sensors monday and I will let you know.
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Stop, "I will be picking up the sensors monday", what sensors? Stop throwing your money away! With both codes 21 and 24, it sounds like you did the KOEO test with a cold engine, makes sense 'cause you can't start it. All tests should be performed with the engine at operating temp. Code 31 EVP circuit below minimum voltage just indicates that the EGR position sensor or circuit may be bad, usually code 31 indicates EGR valve is closed and code 34 indicates EGR valve is stuck open usually due to carbon build-up. Engine should start with a bad EGR system system as long as the pintle valve is closed, if it's stuck open far enough it may not start, kinda rare, because it can let up to 10% of your intake air consist of exhaust gasses. Engine will not start, correct? Take a systematic troubleshooting approach to this and quit buying parts. Do you have a manual, ie Haynes or Chiltons, and are you certain you have both spark at the plugs(you said at the wires) and fuel out the injectors, not just fuel pressure? Checked all fuses, links, vacuum lines?
Last edited by daszanto; Dec 18, 2006 at 10:39 AM.
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From: Bonita Springs FL
Here is your problem:
If the EGR is leaking as badly as you say it is, then it doesn't matter how many sensors you replace, an engine that is sucking in exhaust gases at idle is never going to run right.
Originally Posted by sainty333
What didnt check out ok was the EGR, it will not hold vacuum and loses it almost immediately. There is not an obvious leak....does this mean it is bad or does it share a vacuum line with something else? The sensor had correct voltage to it.
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I have checked vacuum to the egr, will not hold, drops out almost immediately.
As far as throwing parts at it, all but one of the items needed to be replaced. The plugs were totally carboned up, the wires were decaying, the cap and rotor had white char marks on the contacts, the sensor failed a basic resistance test. About the only thing I threw at it was the ignition module because i was frustrated. And who hasnt been there!! LOL I will try taking apart the egr and cleaning it up with carb cleaner to see if it helps.
Thanks for all the input fellas!!!!
Much appreciated
As far as throwing parts at it, all but one of the items needed to be replaced. The plugs were totally carboned up, the wires were decaying, the cap and rotor had white char marks on the contacts, the sensor failed a basic resistance test. About the only thing I threw at it was the ignition module because i was frustrated. And who hasnt been there!! LOL I will try taking apart the egr and cleaning it up with carb cleaner to see if it helps.
Thanks for all the input fellas!!!!
Much appreciated