driveline geometry
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Freshman User
Joined: May 2002
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From: west texas
driveline geometry
is there an easy way to figure out how to install my 351W/C6 in order to get the proper driveline geometry. if i don't get the angles right i'll keep tearing up u-joints and other various things, right?
old and in the way
Joined: Jul 1997
Posts: 5,921
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From: Lovely Hueytown Alabama
driveline geometry
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 05-Dec-02 AT 02:21 PM (EST)]Ronnie,
go to my page and look in the left column... article on Driveline Phasing...
hope it helps
john
http://jniolon.clubfte.com
go to my page and look in the left column... article on Driveline Phasing...
hope it helps
john
http://jniolon.clubfte.com
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,328
Likes: 124
From: Iowa
driveline geometry
The driveline section on John's site is very good. Pinion angle measuring is fairly straight forward. Does anyone have a good method to determine the side to side angle. The rearend should be somewhat self centering. Not really sure how to verify trans is parallel on the horizontal axis.
'fenders
'fenders
Posting Guru
Joined: May 2002
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From: Northwest Fl
driveline geometry
Fenders, I’m not sure if this is the easiest way to find the side angle but it should work.
Take a 'plumb-bob' (a pointed weight on a string) and drop it over the drive shaft, lowering it to the floor by the string. Mark that spot on the floor then go to the other end of the drive shaft and drop the weight over the same side of the drive shaft and mark that spot on the floor. Connect the marks then do the same thing using the same procedure to the rear axle. Mark each end of the axle and connect the marks. Extend the drive shaft line so that it crosses the axle mark and measure this angle on the floor with a protractor.
Hope this helps.
Take a 'plumb-bob' (a pointed weight on a string) and drop it over the drive shaft, lowering it to the floor by the string. Mark that spot on the floor then go to the other end of the drive shaft and drop the weight over the same side of the drive shaft and mark that spot on the floor. Connect the marks then do the same thing using the same procedure to the rear axle. Mark each end of the axle and connect the marks. Extend the drive shaft line so that it crosses the axle mark and measure this angle on the floor with a protractor.
Hope this helps.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,328
Likes: 124
From: Iowa
driveline geometry
Tom
Forgive me if I missed something but I do not see how this will prove the trans and rear diff are parallel. It will prove if the driveshaft and rearend are perpendicular to each other, but perpendicular is not necessarily required for good geometry. Again, perhaps I missed something here.
'fenders
Forgive me if I missed something but I do not see how this will prove the trans and rear diff are parallel. It will prove if the driveshaft and rearend are perpendicular to each other, but perpendicular is not necessarily required for good geometry. Again, perhaps I missed something here.
'fenders
Posting Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
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driveline geometry
Used to be real important that the base of the intake manifold where the carb sat was perfectly level. This tended to put the tranny output shaft on a slight downward angle (aprox. 3 degrees).
Don't know what induction you're using and if this is important with FI - I doub't it....
For whatever that was worth...
Don't know what induction you're using and if this is important with FI - I doub't it....
For whatever that was worth...
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old and in the way
Joined: Jul 1997
Posts: 5,921
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From: Lovely Hueytown Alabama
driveline geometry
well...
hopefully when you put in your rearend, it was perpendicular to the frame rails... that should be easy enough to check with a couple of reference measurements from known points...
If the engine and trans are square in the frame rails.. i.e. two parallel points are the same distance from a frame rail... like the center of the crank and the center of the tail shaft.. it's straight...
if those two items are correct, things have to be parallel.. and
continuing on with this thinking... as long as the universal joint angles arent so great as to bind the joint... you'll have no problem.. besides I think it would be hard to get things so out of line on a horizontal plane that it would cause problems. And, probably on a vertical plane also, unless you're jacking the truck up like a monster truck with 42" mudders on it.
Just get everything parallel and you should be in da groove, man !!
john (plumb and square)
hopefully when you put in your rearend, it was perpendicular to the frame rails... that should be easy enough to check with a couple of reference measurements from known points...
If the engine and trans are square in the frame rails.. i.e. two parallel points are the same distance from a frame rail... like the center of the crank and the center of the tail shaft.. it's straight...
if those two items are correct, things have to be parallel.. and
continuing on with this thinking... as long as the universal joint angles arent so great as to bind the joint... you'll have no problem.. besides I think it would be hard to get things so out of line on a horizontal plane that it would cause problems. And, probably on a vertical plane also, unless you're jacking the truck up like a monster truck with 42" mudders on it.
Just get everything parallel and you should be in da groove, man !!
john (plumb and square)
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Posting Guru
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,495
Likes: 2
From: Northwest Fl
driveline geometry
Fenders it’s my fault, I thought you were looking for the angle of the drive shaft in relation to the rear axle. I know that sometimes the right and left rear axles are different in length and that even in some applications the engine is not centered in the engine bay. This would create the side-to-side angle from the transmission to the rear that I thought you were referring to.
Sorry for the confusion.
Sorry for the confusion.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,328
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From: Iowa
driveline geometry
John
As you may recall, my frontend was majorly whacked before I R&R'd the Volare for the final install. I guess I just pray the rails are parallel.
RMF
My fan blade would be rubbing the ground or my transmission sitting right under the seat to get the intake level. But you're correct, that is a goal to shoot for. Especially with a carb. I am curious if my engine/trans is parallel with the rearend (which is straight) They don't have to line up, just be parallel.
'fenders
As you may recall, my frontend was majorly whacked before I R&R'd the Volare for the final install. I guess I just pray the rails are parallel.
RMF
My fan blade would be rubbing the ground or my transmission sitting right under the seat to get the intake level. But you're correct, that is a goal to shoot for. Especially with a carb. I am curious if my engine/trans is parallel with the rearend (which is straight) They don't have to line up, just be parallel.
'fenders
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From: Ventura County, CA
driveline geometry
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 10-Dec-02 AT 11:06 AM (EST)]I also have heard that 3 degrees is correct. FYI, I noticed that Bob's F-100's has motor mounts for 302/351 conversions. Here's their phone # :
1-909-681-1956 PST
Daryl
1-909-681-1956 PST
Daryl
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,328
Likes: 124
From: Iowa
driveline geometry
<thanks guys. i'm using the original rearend, so i can just base everything off of the measurements of it. right? >
Ragsman
More than likely you will be just fine with a stock rearend. When you start swapping out rearends and engine/trans combos is when the games commence. I have seen a lot of projects where people just settle for pretty good. The little effort involved in getting everything within a degree or so of correct is worth it. Drivetrain vibration is annoying and you should not have to tolerate it. Especially when you can often correct it for ten bucks worth of pinion shims and a cheap angle guage.
'fenders
Ragsman
More than likely you will be just fine with a stock rearend. When you start swapping out rearends and engine/trans combos is when the games commence. I have seen a lot of projects where people just settle for pretty good. The little effort involved in getting everything within a degree or so of correct is worth it. Drivetrain vibration is annoying and you should not have to tolerate it. Especially when you can often correct it for ten bucks worth of pinion shims and a cheap angle guage.
'fenders
