What advantage do the roller timing sets have over the stock variety, other than the multiple adjustments available for cam timing? Are they stronger, lighter, produce less friction resistence? Will they last as long as stock? Do they ever break? Curious.

 

Well...it's hard to make a blanket statement, because the term "double roller" can cover a multitude of sins these days.

A true roller chain set has bushings on the chain pins, which are supposed to literally "roll" into the sprocket teeth, reducing friction, & damping chain harmonics. Whether they actually do this is questionable, & whether it has any positive effect is more so. A lot of cheap sets have no bushings, or the "bushing" doesn't roll. Cheap being the $25-$40 range. I have also seen a cheaper set that specifically claims it has operating bushings; true, it does, & they are so sloppy that you can actually wiggle them on the pins.

As far as harmonics go, in the past a lot of Chevy drag racers have used the std. nylon-tipped sprocket & Morse chain because it DAMPENS them more than a double roller. The caveat being, they got replaced frequently. Nowadays belt drives are more common than anything else in drag racing, & do the best job at reducing harmonics.

Stronger? Dunno, depends on the materials & design. Some of the Chinese sets use a lot of metal to crutch the fact that the metallurgy is sub-par (to be kind).

As a rule, the double roller sets tend to stretch less, leading to longevity in life & timing settings...though a good stock chain will do pretty well, too.

One big advantage for the double roller sets is that they are all metal. IMHO, the biggest reason double roller sets exist is due to the (again) common Chevy SB/BB nylon tipped cam sprocket. Due to high mileage, or overheating/high oil temps, they tended to shed the nylon coating. Anybody who's ever torn down an old Chevy has seen the oil pump pickup clogged with nylon shards, sometimes terminally. As the SBC controlled the aftermarket from the late '50s on, (for the most part), since there was a need, there came the part.

So far as Y blocks go, as far as I know Rollmaster makes the only two roller sets. One has billet gears & the IWIS chain, which is as good a chain as anything out there. It is possible the billet gears could lead to issues down the road, maybe, as normally a bronze thrust plate or Torrington bearing is used with a billet gear. I doubt it would be much of a problem except for a daily driver, & maybe no problem at all. The oiling mods to the plate would help, I'd guess.

The other Rollmaster I have not seen; supposedly it has iron gears. Dunno what chain. The lesser Rollmasters have Rollon chain, which their fellow Aussies say is junk.

The Melling Y-block std. set looks pretty good & seems reliable.

Dunno how interesting all this is, but there ya go.

If you want to know a little secret for other engines, the Comp Hi-Tech sets are the same thing (repackaged) as the good Cloyes True Roller sets, but cheaper, sometimes over $20 less. The Comp Magnum sets are the same as the Cloyes "Street" sets.

The Ford Motorsports (OK, Ford Racing) sets are very good as well & are nicely priced.

 

That is all very interesting Homespun, glad I asked. When I think about the roller chains, it brings to mind all the issues we used to have with the old Harley primary and drive chains (probably an unfair comparison). Way back in the 70's I was thrilled to be the first in Wichita with a belt driven primary on my panhead.

The stock Y-block sets seemed to last as long as the motor, in some cases 50 years. So I'll stick with it unless there is something more definitely positive about the rollers.

 

When I replaced the cam in a 292 to a mild performance regrind from CamCraft, I degreed the cam. Neither of the stock-type timing chains were nearly close. I bought a RollMaster chain from Mummert with the offset keyways. There was a manufacturing defect with one of the offset notches (it was supposed to be -6 degrees but it was -8 like the next one. Otherwise, it was a nice part.

 

Paul,

Fill in a few details, if you'd be so kind. Recall what makes the stockers were? And, which Rollmaster was it? I've only seen the high-zoot billet version.

The last Melling I looked at about six months ago was around -2 when installed per the marks.

 

The two 'stockers' were an SA gear (going from memory) and an 'Engine and Performance Warehouse' model 3031. The RollMaster is a CS4060 double roller part. I think it has the german chain. It was spendy, like $140 or so, but I'm glad I got it.

The cam was a 'marine' regrind on an ECK core. As I recall, it had a 112 degree LSA, two degree more than the stock grinds. I had to off set it about 8 degrees. I think I ended up about one degree advanced from straight-up.

 

Hey Paul,

Thanks- I lost track of the thread for a few days. I believe you're right, that's the GOOD Rollmaster (as opposed to merely good.)

I've heard that SA Gear was taken over by Dynagear, then the combined company was sold (or the owners lost control) a few years ago. Supposedly quality went in the toilet. Badger Pistons was also involved in this. About 7-8 months ago the owners regained control and swore to rebuild the company to its former quality. I know Badger had some issues that they were trying to solve & it sounded like they were sincere.

BTW, I saw you were looking at that Clevor manifold on the Bay. You might want to check out the Price Motorsports adapters or the CHI manifold/water manifold combo, if you can't find a used one. Might have to sell the yacht, though!

Seriously, I think Bush Performance is still making the Track Boss 9.5 deck manifold, (and both 302 manifolds) but not the Street Boss dual plane, if that holds any interest for you. I can scrounge up an address & phone # somewhere.

 

Thanks for the tips about the adapter plates and the manifolds. I just missed that Track Boss but that's ok, I have too many projects already. I picked up a 351 EFI lower intake manifold and it looks like it ought to fit up to Cleveland heads really good with a little welding. The intake runners are oval shaped right up to the intake/head flange where they suddenly go rectangular. Maybe after I get the shop built I'll invest in a TIG and try a Clevor EFI lash-up.

But before that will be another Y-block (and another RollMaster timing set), a 312 for my truck.

Edit: I just remember something I wanted to throw out here; I was working on a 3.8L in a Ford Taurus. It had a timing chain tensioner that looked like it would bolt up to a lot of other engines. The Y-block in particular has bosses under the timing chain that used to be used to bolt on bits of metal that redirect oil onto the timing chain. I'm thinking that I'll buy a tensioner and try to fit it to my 312.