77 Brake Problems... Front Disk Rear Drums
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Junior User
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77 Brake Problems... Front Disk Rear Drums
Got to where I had to pump up the brakes to get it to stop, so i replaced the master cylinder. I bench bled the mc and then the rear brakes, but I can not find the bleeder valve on the front disks. Where might it be located at? Anyone got a pic? Also when pumping the brakes bleeding the rears sometimes the fluid would gush up and out of the mc. I did not have the cover on it. Is this normal?
I have been reading through posts for an hour now and cant find the answer to my question.
Thanks and nice forum I have used the handy SEARCH feature to fix my dash lights, dome light, and speedo.
I have been reading through posts for an hour now and cant find the answer to my question.
Thanks and nice forum I have used the handy SEARCH feature to fix my dash lights, dome light, and speedo.
Posting Guru
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,192
Likes: 1
From: lino lakes, mn
the bleeder screws are on the top inboard end of the caliper just behind the brake line and towards the frame.The squirt is normal but never leave your master open during bleeding or anytime other than filling it brake fluid absorbs moisture from the air this lowers it boiling point and contaminate sthe fluid put the cap on the brake fluid right away too.
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 2,838
Likes: 6
From: SD
Before the master was replaced, did the pedal always sink to the floor? Did you lose fluid? The low brake pedal is sometimes caused by rear shoes worn or out of adjustment. Might want to check those over too.
Marty
Marty
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Plowpusher- Found the bleeder valves. Thank you. They were dirty as hell and one of them is stripped. That should be fun...
One of the rear bleeder valves is stopped up so I may just replace the rear cylinders.
73custom- The brakes did not sink to the floor before, however when this all started the first thing i did was check the brake fluid and it was gone so I added more and the problem never got better... The truck however has not ever stopped real good. I have only had it a month or so and you always had to push pretty hard to get it to stop.
One of the rear bleeder valves is stopped up so I may just replace the rear cylinders.
73custom- The brakes did not sink to the floor before, however when this all started the first thing i did was check the brake fluid and it was gone so I added more and the problem never got better... The truck however has not ever stopped real good. I have only had it a month or so and you always had to push pretty hard to get it to stop.
Postmaster
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,544
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From: okc
this applies to any vehicle, when the brake fluid gets low its time for brake pads...unless there was a leak, all the brake fluid that was in the MC is now down in the brake lines because the caliper pistons are extended and filled with the most of the fluid..when you replace the pads and compress the calipers the fluid travels back up to the MC and generally fills it back up to the full point..obviously this is only true if there wasnt any leaks in the system...if your in doubt about any parts of your brake system replace them, its too crucial of a system to have old parts that can fail at any time and leave you without brakes at all..if the bleeder valves are rusted to the point they are clogged, replace the wheel cylinders, calipers, any rubber lines, and possibly the porportioning valve too because most likely all of those parts with be rusted too....
Senior User
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: upstate N Y
If your gonna do your brakes CHANGE the brake fluid dont just bleed it.As plowpusher said brake fluids draws moisture.Suck/bail/sponge the master cylinder dry if you are not replacing it then add fresh fluid.When brake fluid is contaminated with water it compresses instead of applying pressure and it will also boil. Bleed your brakes untill the fluid comes out clear not just until the bubbles stop.Also if your disk pads are worn you will have alot of travel as Swoke said .Make sure the disk caliper slides free in the braket when you replace it.These calipers often get stuck then only one brake pad gets worn out ,then the rotor gets worn off on 1 side .
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Cargo Master
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 2,364
Likes: 3
From: Eustis FL
Calipers and cylinders are cheap for these trucks, since they are not Brembo, Baer or Wilwood.
Replacing it all when you have problems like this on an unknown truck is a great start, and not a waste of money at all. Then you can look at things like proportioning valves as a potential problem, or a kinked or blocked line.
As a side note, you can get aftermarket adjustable proportioning valves for under $40. You will have total control over rear brake bias. I am having rear brake weakness myself, and have ruled out the m/c already, since it came from a perfectly working truck (my 78) and was only a few months old. When I am able to see my truck again, I am replacing the rear cylinders, then try again. If that doesn't do it, it will get a new proportioning valve. For the sheer value of the adjustable valve, I won't mess with a factory replacement. I have a Trailer Special, and it could really benefit from the adjustability.
Mark
Replacing it all when you have problems like this on an unknown truck is a great start, and not a waste of money at all. Then you can look at things like proportioning valves as a potential problem, or a kinked or blocked line.
As a side note, you can get aftermarket adjustable proportioning valves for under $40. You will have total control over rear brake bias. I am having rear brake weakness myself, and have ruled out the m/c already, since it came from a perfectly working truck (my 78) and was only a few months old. When I am able to see my truck again, I am replacing the rear cylinders, then try again. If that doesn't do it, it will get a new proportioning valve. For the sheer value of the adjustable valve, I won't mess with a factory replacement. I have a Trailer Special, and it could really benefit from the adjustability.
Mark
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Ok Got the calipers off. Started out with good news. Got the passenger side off and the pads and rotor looked perfect. I thought hmm these are in good shape.... Then the drivers side. The pads were nearly gone and the rotor had more groves in it then Arkansas Highways.... They drivers side pads and rotor is shot. So it looks like new pads for the fronts and a new rotor on the drivers side however, I am not real sure how the heck to get the rotor off on the drivers side. Any ideas what would cause one side to look like it was not being used. Hopefully it was just a bad caliper.... Also how do I get that rotor off? Should I replace the bearings in the front while I am doing the brakes?
One more thing. Why would the moderators not allow unlimited searches? It seems pointless to post questions that have already been addressed over and over? I was trying to find out how to get the rotors off and got a message telling me I had reached my max number of searches....
One more thing. Why would the moderators not allow unlimited searches? It seems pointless to post questions that have already been addressed over and over? I was trying to find out how to get the rotors off and got a message telling me I had reached my max number of searches....
Postmaster
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,544
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From: okc
to get the rotor off, pop the little cap off with a flathead screwdriver, the one in the very center of the rotor (the actual hubcap as apposed to a "wheel cover") then remove the cotterpin and the large nut...i always suggest when replacing one rotor to replace both, or if the replacement is a used one have them both turned to the same size to avoid one side braking better than the other....what usually causes brakes to wear unevenly is improper installation of the caliper, a faulty caliper, or someone not cleaning and greasing the caliper slides during a brake job... definitely change the wheel bearings too, personally i would buy new calipers, pads, rotors, bearings and rubber brake lines that way you know your front brakes are all good....but, being the poor sap that i am i know thats not always possible, so if you cant buy all new rotors, at least get new bearings, calipers and pads, then have the rotors turned to match each other...
New User
Joined: Jan 2008
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The moderators don't limit the searches.
The system does.
Believe it or not, we want new people to ask the same question that has been asked before.
It;s just better if they are a week apart so there aren't numerous active thread with the same topic.
FTE is a family and limiting searches is like a personal invitation to become a family member by POSTING MORE.
About the brakes.
The guys have this thread under control already
The system does.
Believe it or not, we want new people to ask the same question that has been asked before.
It;s just better if they are a week apart so there aren't numerous active thread with the same topic.
FTE is a family and limiting searches is like a personal invitation to become a family member by POSTING MORE.
About the brakes.
The guys have this thread under control already
Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: Mar 2006
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Originally Posted by Mil1ion
The moderators don't limit the searches.
The system does.
Believe it or not, we want new people to ask the same question that has been asked before.
It;s just better if they are a week apart so there aren't numerous active thread with the same topic.
FTE is a family and limiting searches is like a personal invitation to become a family member by POSTING MORE.
The system does.
Believe it or not, we want new people to ask the same question that has been asked before.
It;s just better if they are a week apart so there aren't numerous active thread with the same topic.
FTE is a family and limiting searches is like a personal invitation to become a family member by POSTING MORE.
Onto the brakes...
Yes It does seem the folks are on top of this thread thanks thus far. Got a bunch of shiny new parts:
One new Rotor
Wheel Bearings for both sides
Calipers
Pads
Rear Cylinders
Rear Shoes
Even though the parts are cheap they sure add up in a hurry...
Forgot to get the slide grease so back to AZ for it. Will post any updates after I get the grease and get the parts I have this far installed.
Senior User
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
From: upstate N Y
You don't need much grease just clean off any rust and make sure the slide is smooth and rub a small amount on with your finger.You could wipe enough off the side of a ball joint or tie rod end to do the job.
New User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 0
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Are you talking about the support key and support spring ?
The spring goes on top in the groove of the key with the curved ends pointing down toward the key
They compress to hold the caliper in position.
The spring goes on top in the groove of the key with the curved ends pointing down toward the key
They compress to hold the caliper in position.
Last edited by Mil1ion; May 4, 2006 at 10:55 PM.