Question about 428 crank.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jan 2003
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From: Ohio
I always have my 428 cranks neutral balanced so that you can. That way you can put any plain 390 flywheel on it. It cost a few extra bucks at balance time for the Mallory metal, but worth it later down the road.
Freshman User
Joined: Jan 2006
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I don't think I would go there......The difference is in the crank counter weights not the rods. The pistons are recipocating weight as apposed to rotating weight and would not effect the needed flywheel/dampner counter weights. Just my 2 sense.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
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From: Long Island USA
Originally Posted by onebad40willys
you dont need to rebalance to use. some people say you dont need the external wieght. just need the 390 rod's and 410 piston's or custom piston's. then just have a machine shop balance and blue print it.
428 is externally balanced. And the 428 flywheel has a cast-in counterweight in it.
If you want to use a 428 crank, get the flywheel with it.
And then get everything balanced anyway
The problem is, you can't just put a 428 crank in a 390 without different pistons (410).
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,562
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From: Long Island USA
Originally Posted by Freightrain
Ya, I left out the piston differences.
Getting the crank neutral balanced, allows you to run any FE flywheel and not 428 specific parts.
Getting the crank neutral balanced, allows you to run any FE flywheel and not 428 specific parts.
Unless your deck height is HUGE
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Freshman User
Joined: Jan 2006
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OK, Let me try this again. I have built two 390 motors with 428 crankshafts. They are refered to as a 410 in most circles. When using a 428 crankshaft in a 390 you either A) need to use a 428 flex plate or flywheel which has an weight added to it in a specific location (offset balance),or B) Have the
crankshaft balanced to neutral to match the 390 flywheel or flex plate. I suppose you could also add weight to the 390 flywheel. Most machine shops prefer to neutral balance the 428 crank by adding heavy metal. It seems 428 flywheels are getting hard to find. A word on the pistons....
I used Engine Tech flat tops for a 390 as the compression height came out
perfect and it was alot less $ than having pistons custom made. Go by the
actual comp Height of the after market piston and not what the orignal
390 comp height is. Piston manufactures have a habit of reducing the replacement pistons Comp Height for some reason or other.This allows this 390 piston to work in this application. Make sure to calculate comp ratio
as these two motors came out a little high for daily drivers.
This was 12 years ago so I don't know if Engine Tech still offers the same piston.
crankshaft balanced to neutral to match the 390 flywheel or flex plate. I suppose you could also add weight to the 390 flywheel. Most machine shops prefer to neutral balance the 428 crank by adding heavy metal. It seems 428 flywheels are getting hard to find. A word on the pistons....
I used Engine Tech flat tops for a 390 as the compression height came out
perfect and it was alot less $ than having pistons custom made. Go by the
actual comp Height of the after market piston and not what the orignal
390 comp height is. Piston manufactures have a habit of reducing the replacement pistons Comp Height for some reason or other.This allows this 390 piston to work in this application. Make sure to calculate comp ratio
as these two motors came out a little high for daily drivers.
This was 12 years ago so I don't know if Engine Tech still offers the same piston.
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: Malvern, Ohio
The 390 is the SAME exact block as a 428 no matter what you think it is and it is a FE SERIES block. If you put the crank in the 390 I think its makes it a 410 which was an engine actually made by Ford back in the day for mercury vehicles.
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2006
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For the 428 I have sitting on the stand for a Donzi boat install...I used a 428 crank in a '352 casting' block (I don't even remember now what it was to start with), bored for the 428 pistons. The flywheels are readily available and mine is a new Centerforce..they do not have the added weight..they end up with a bunch of holes drilled opposite where the factory weight was cast in. Still the correct counterbalance, whether you add weight on one side or subtract from the other. I picked up a set of the heavy 'Le Mans' rods the easy way..stole 'em out of a 361 FT engine that was in the 'pile' of FEs I have out back.
Since I now have an 'SCJ' configuration in terms of all the parts for the rotating assembly, I must admit that balancing the whole mess gave my balance technician a minor fit because of no hatchet weight on the balancer spacer..but he got er done.
There are numerous ways to skin that cat.
Since I now have an 'SCJ' configuration in terms of all the parts for the rotating assembly, I must admit that balancing the whole mess gave my balance technician a minor fit because of no hatchet weight on the balancer spacer..but he got er done.
There are numerous ways to skin that cat.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,600
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From: Iowa
I dont even know where to start with this thread.
The 428 crank needs to be rebalanced for usage with a standard FE flywheel or flexplate. Alternatively, you can balance the standard FE flywheel or flexplate to match the crankshaft. Both ways work, just make sure it's right before you put it together. Neutral balancing the crank is probably the best way, since it reduces stress on the crankshaft.
You can put a 428 crank in a TRUCK 390. You still will need new pistons, since the ridge on the cylinder walls will necessitate overboring the cylinders. Truck 390 pistons = 410 pistons.
All FE blocks have a deck height of 10.17"
FT 361 motors do not have Lemans rods. They have standard FE short rods. Same length, so it's easy to confuse 'em. Fortunately they're plenty strong.
The 428 crank needs to be rebalanced for usage with a standard FE flywheel or flexplate. Alternatively, you can balance the standard FE flywheel or flexplate to match the crankshaft. Both ways work, just make sure it's right before you put it together. Neutral balancing the crank is probably the best way, since it reduces stress on the crankshaft.
You can put a 428 crank in a TRUCK 390. You still will need new pistons, since the ridge on the cylinder walls will necessitate overboring the cylinders. Truck 390 pistons = 410 pistons.
All FE blocks have a deck height of 10.17"
FT 361 motors do not have Lemans rods. They have standard FE short rods. Same length, so it's easy to confuse 'em. Fortunately they're plenty strong.
Needsmorecoffee.
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,624
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From: CT
And.....LeMans rods used a tri-lobe thread capscrew vs the bolt and nut of the std rods to bolt the cap to the rod. Easy to spot. Also when using a std/CJ 428 crank with LeMans rods you can use the SCJ weighted crank spacer behind the balancer and take weight off the balance weight found on the #6 counterweight and more or less make it into a SCJ balanced crank. The SCJ crank was cast without this balance weight found on std and CJ balanced cranks. That is the basic difference between the SCJ and CJ cranks. The extra weight on the crank nose does stress things a bit on the SCJ's and it's not the best design on Fords behalf. Don't confuse this with the main question asked as I'm pretty far off topic. I just wanted to input my .02 about the CJ vs SCJ balances and the mix and match. There are a few ways to do it.
G.
G.
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2006
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Oops..my bad. I had a couple 'spare' rods that were same as the ones I used in the 428 build I posted about earlier that came out of FT 361s and I took look-see...and they are C6AE-C rods..not the 7/16-bolt cap screw 'Le Mans' rods.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 174
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From: Lynchburg Virginia.
Thanks for the info! If I understand correctly, I can use the 428 crank if I also use a 428 flywheel and not have to do excessive rebalanceing. I know about the differance in deck height, but was not sure about the balance. Is the harmonic balancer on the front different as well ?