Can you just imagine a Detriot 12V 2stroke in a F-series. The hood would be as long as the bed!!!
The Cummins I-6 is a nice engine and Gale Banks is supposedly pulling 1000 lb-ft of torque in his aftermarket package. But the dodge boys are paying for it with front end weight on that truck! I think the IH (Navistar?) V-8 is a better pick for Light Duty Pick-ups. Over the years both engines suffered from fuel injection system problems, but the latest Common Rail Injection systems seem to be the best yet.

 

Those deer's have some really low HP figures....
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but look at the torque and the operating range... won't find too many light truck drivers that will know to be shifting that soon. Can tell they are tractor type motors, since the max rpm is so low.
When I was buliding car crushers the Deere was the main engine of choice even though we would install any engine they wanted.

 

This is true. But do two things, look at the torque, then go look up the HP figures for the industrial version of the existing PSD engines.

I'm sure those Deere motors could be turned up quite a bit. JD seems to be quite conservative with their HP ratings.

I'll even help with part of it:

6068: 250hp @ 2200rpm, 755ft-lbs @ 1400rpm. They have a 300hp marine version if that tells you anything...

4045: 173hp @ 2200rpm, 516ft-lbs @ 1400rpm.

 

I like the Cummins I-6, Cat would be better, but pricier.

I've heard an I-6 is really the best for all around general purpose use.

 

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The low hp figures are going to hurt acceleration, you can have all the torque in the world but without good horsepower it ain't gonna go like most pickup truck owners would like. Those motors are made for a different application and I feel wouldn't do well in a pickup.

 

You didn't compare the figures like I asked. Lets look at the existing PSD. 6.0L, 365ci. International sells this engine as the VT365. Take a look at the industrial ratings for the VT365 here. It is rated at 230hp, with a rated RPM of 2600. Then look at the Ford specs for the 6.0L PSD. Horsepower is 325 at 3300 RPM. Obviously, there is a big difference there. The industrial horsepower rating is about 71% of what the rating Ford gives it is. The industrial RPM rating is also 78% what Ford gives it.

Now lets look at the Deere engines. Start with the 6068. Obviously, Ford wouldn't just plop this engine in the truck in it's current form. In industrial trim, it's rated at 250hp, at 2200rpm. Now, lets figure what this engine would do in a Ford truck, figuring the same power and RPM differential that the 6.0L currently has between industrial and PSD usage.

250hp / .71 = 352hp
2200rpm / .78 = 2820rpm

So we can say that with the same type changes, the John Deere 6068 engine would have about 352hp @ 2820rpm, when changed for use in a Ford truck.

Now lets look at the 4045:

173hp / .71 = 244hp
rpm conversion is the same as above

So we can say that with the same type changes, the John Deere 4045 engine would have about 244hp @ 2820rpm, when changed for use in a Ford truck.

Now looking at the above numbers, since when is 352hp not enough???

Edit: Obviously, these numbers are not exact on how the engine would be rated, but they should provide a good indication.

 

OK Rusty I gotta chime in here-------------Apples to Oranges!----------------------

What you are refering to in JD's Engine ratings charts based on industrial used such as running a pump or generator. Constand RPM's with constant HP output avail.

You are presuming that JD can up rate their motors 71% and 78% for intermittant usage applications such as automotive. I'd like to see a JD motor chart reflecting your presumed numbers. I don't think they have ever rated their motors for automotive use. Significant changes would be necessary in fuel pump, injectors, oil, coolant accessories, and on and on. You can't just stick a combine or tractor motor in a pick-up and crank up the fuel setting screw and go. Well you can, but I'd rather have a motor designed and tested for the application I was using it for.

I'm sure Ford's HP rating for the Internat. motor is within the motor mfg's specs for automotive use. If it were put on a generator or pump it would have to be significantly changed.

Nice try, but it don't fly!

 

You're not reading it close enough... They're both apples.

You wont see any JD chart reflecting any numbers that are attempting to show what I'm trying to show. That's because the JD motor was never used in an automotive application, that's why I had to extrapolate the numbers based on an existing engine that is used in both applications. Not the most accurate I know, but should provide a good indication.

And yes, ANY industrial motor would have to have to have major changes to be used in an automotive application. No question about that. Thing is, the same thing happened when the VT365 was transformed into the PSD. Granted it was easier, since the VT365 is used in the International 4200 truck. This has never been done with a JD motor to my knowledge, and therefore, it's hard to say what the numbers for a automotive application of a JD motor would be. I simply did the next best thing, which is took an existing motor used in both applications (the 6.0L PSD) and compared it's numbers to the VT365, which the PSD is based on. The numbers might not be totally accurate for a JD motor, but it's the best approximation available.

 

Thats all it is......is your approximation.

User 4wd beat me to it, what he said is exactly right. You can't assume that those JD motors could be changed and produce that type of power. Your approximations are quite easily flawed.

I was simply saying that particular engine has low hp which isn't good for a pickup. Your assuming you can just change it and make it have 350hp...

 

And you'd be exactly right. We cant assume they could be modified to produce that kind of power. It could be more, it could be less. We simply dont know. The only reason I compared it that way, was for lack of any better way to do it. If anyone can think of a better way, by all means, share!

Edit: Let me add this... How much horsepower are people getting from modified (aftermarket parts) PSD's? Yeah. I think these JD motors could be "modified" to produce pretty much however much HP Ford wanted them to have.

 

Ya, it could, but reliably? The engine wasn't designed to do that, and may not be able to reliably do what you would like it to do.

 

This is true. I'm sure whatever engine Ford decides to use, they would ensure reliability and do plenty of testing before they put it into their trucks. Like I said, it may take some modification. Being an industrial / tractor motor, it should be built heavily and have a lot left in it.

Oh well, you have your opinion, I have mine. That's why we're on here, to discuss this stuff.

 

haveing spent many years working on them and cummmins, i can't. it's 2, 6v71's bolted together back to noise and had a short life span of around 2000 plus hours. it's a great marine engine but road wise not so hot. last year i did a full out of the hull major for a close buddy, on one of his boats 12v71's. cost $35.000 to rebuild. just for oem parts, 12 piston kits, 2 new blowers, 2 new turbos, 4 heads machined and r/b'd, one big long crank machined.12 injectors,plus you name it. mind you the top rpm for that motor no load is only 2300 rpm full load 2100.plus they pull 45 gals a hour each
remember cat also has the 3114 and 3116 a 4 and 6 inline the are great light motors. i would love to see the 3114 in the ranger and either 3116 0r 3126 i6;s in a pickup . i can see the big chrome piece on the side like a big rig.powered by cat or cat powered. that would almost kill dcx's truck line.

 

This poll is not closed, yet there seems to be trend that has me wondering. Right now it appears that 59.15 % FTE members would like to see some form of I6 diesel in there truck and 31.19 % FTE members would like to see some form of V8. If you apply the above ratio to the other catagory, you get 64.86 % I6 and 35.14 % V8. Granted some of the other catagory included wishes for a I4, V6, and V12. But all same the ratio of 64.86% and 35.14% Imo seems to be true, so why has Ford missed the boat on this one? If you add all of the Navistar %'s, they are still less than Cat or Cummin's I6 precentages. Is it the poor R&D of the 6.0 that hurt them? As of now on this poll one could say that Ford should be switching from Navistar V8 diesel to someone elses I6 diesel. What all do you think?