[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 03-Apr-01 AT 12:10 PM (EST)[/font][p]Spoke to some guys at vortec, and you can convert to a 302 computer, but it must be a stock 302 not the 302 HO which uses a 351W cam and firing order. A stock 302 like in a lincoln has a firing order of 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8, the 385 series 429/460/514 uses, 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8, they are the same, on the 460 wiring harness mass air flow pins are 9 and 50, same as a 302 equipt vehicle, only tricky part now is the 80 mm factory mass airflow meter i had from a CA truck is calibarated to 19/lb injectors my federal truck has 24/lb injectors. There is suposed to be a company that makes a plug in unit that allows you to use one mass air flow meter and adjust for changes in injector sizes. Supposedly it should all fit, if the computers are all EEC-IV's be careful ill post more latter. Let me know if anyone has any disagreements. Oh by the way anybody know who makes 9.5 or 9.8:1 pistons to fit F3TE heads?

Thanks Dusty

 

The 302 firing order you listed is for old speed Density 302's (and 460's). Ford changed the order when they added mass air. You knew that right?

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Apr-01 AT 08:44 PM (EST)[/font][p]Actually i didn't, im learning more and more through helpful responses that correct my errors. i did get a 6/1997 mass air 460 computer for a CA truck today though. but the information given to me was that there were still two computers one for the old firing order and one for new, the old order like the 460 was put on lincolns and a few other cars with mass air 302's supposedly, and they are out there but few and far between. not sure how reliable this info is but thank you for the corrective dirrection.

Dusty

 

Why would the firing order make much difference to the EEC? I had a '86 F150 302... I swapped in a 302HO long block. I used all original covers and manifolds with all original sensors, wiring and computer. I switched the two plug wires so that the right cylinders were firing... and never looked back... except once to see the front end of a Chevy with a blonde at the wheel.

I suppose it would make a difference if the injectors are pulsed sequentially like in the Mustang, but, this was not the case with the computer in my '86. Are newer MAF systems sequential?

Perry

 

Hey Perry, How ya doing. Long time no hear. As far as I know only the California/New York Trucks are sequintal and Yes 96 Cali/NY E/F 460 equipped trucks have MAF from the factory. I was told recently by a mechanic that if the PCM is mounted on the fender on a 95 to 97 then it should be sequintal also. Still checking on this one. I have a harness # but no computer yet. It seems all Cali and NY equipped trucks have 4 O2 sensors and 13 different computers on the 460 setup with MAF

Should be a easy conversion once figured out?

I'll keep you informed. I haven't been in a hurry though.

Xaviar
96 F-250HD 4x4 460/E4OD 4.10
Banks Power Pack, Banks Trans Command
MSD 8227 Coil, MSD 32199 8.5 Wires, MSD 6A

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 10-Apr-01 AT 11:29 AM (EST)[/font][p][font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 10-Apr-01 AT 11:28 AM (EST)[/font]

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 10-Apr-01 AT 11:24 AM (EST)[/font]

I recently got to look at one of those 460 mass air CA trucks, they had 19/lb injectors 2 air sensors, one on each manifold bank and virtualtually all the same wiring. the head was a F3TE now can anybody tell me what compression ratio or cc this head might have? even ford doesn't know, thier books stop at 94 with the previous design. the old one they claim is 8.9:1 the new one they think is 8.0:1? if you know thanks.

As to the mass air it seems easy, and i think that you could probably get an overlay harness from motor sport for a old 302 speed density to mass air convert and buy the CA MAF computer which is readily availible, i know because i just got mine in. That would probably cover all the parts but best to get a wiring diagram and double check to confirm all the pins are the same.
Ford said they were but some times, actually many times lately for has been incorrect. To many variations in thier systems to keep track. Also to get a little more power the guy had plugged his intake air temp sensor into the intake hose and plugged the intake manifold.

Dusty
97 F250HD now F350 front and rear, ext cab SB 4x4 w/460 , 5 speed conversion from e40d, Doug Thorley headers, no cat, K+N, and now done this weekend are ported heads, roller rockers, big valves(2.19I and 1.76E, and a pissed off speed density computer (hopeful to do cam and bring up compression to 9.5 or 9.8:1 when i change computers and rebuild this fall.) 182,000 miles as of this month. doesn't burn more than 3/4 -1 qrt in 2800 miles.

 

Hey Dusty,

Can, will you send me your email address.. Mine is meshaffer at mindspring.com... Thankx I wuld like to ask you a few questions about your MAF conversion..

Mike
95 F350 Dually

 

Hey Mike

My email is ddestruel(No Email Addresses In Posts!). if you do have any questions feel free. Im actually rethinking my whole approach to this MAF convert. I may return the computer and Order a 302 MAF standard firing order computer, supposedly they are not as effected by mods because they are after market. I heard from a guy in CA that has the MAF 460 that his truck de-tunes itself a little with each mod. Know he may just be blowing smoke up my pipe but i am going to research this. The wiring harness is OK though.

Know in my last posting i mentioned caming and then bumping up compression, as you saw on the other posting Im looking for 9.5 to 9.8 :1 domed pistons. as to the cam i think I will probably go with th police cam 268/270 or the performance cam at 284/284 both at .50 if i do the later i will have more power but at the cost of my first 500-1000 rpms the first cam is 800-4500. So any help on these two items would be helpful.

Thanks and ill keep you posted
Dusty

 

Hey Dusty,

Got your email, Thankx for the part number.... Sounds to me a bit like that gentleman may be blowing smoke up something (his or yours may be in question??)..... The way I understand MAF and the whole reason we are going to all of this trouble is to take advantage of power adding additions to our motors... If the MAF computers "De-Tuned" themselves then we would be better off with Speed Density... Wouldnt We? Keep me in mind when you get the rest of the numbers, and I would be very interested in hearing the result of the computer search. Talk to you later

Mike
95 F350 Dually

 

Dusty,

Better check with your supplier, before you spend more money... most electrical components, including computers and harnesses are not returnable. You may be okay if packaging has not been opened.

Good luck.

Perry

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 24-Apr-01 AT 08:32 PM (EST)[/font][p]Hey Perry and Mike,

You guys are right, but with this kind of a project i can only be careful to a point then it's time to take the dive and if i loose 500-700 dollars..... oh i don't even want to think about that, im already skeptical and thats all i can do. The 302 cuputer truck does run i rode in it but im sticking to factory, his way involved alot of his own wiring harnesses and it is not as powerful as it should be.
Has anybody really fooled w/ the fuse box under the hood where the accessories and the computer harness are intertwined? What might i be confronted by in there? If worse comes to worse ill just plug in those wires one at a time.

Parts needed to do 460 MAF w/ the CA MAF from a mid 97 F-350 5 speed or E4od Depending on what you have.

1. Computer
2. MAF meter calibarated to 24 lb injectors
3. Main Harness
4. Engine Harness (including:injector harness)
5. 2 O2 sensors
6. Tube assembly (now you can build your own)
7. alot of luck.

Supposedly those are most of the parts needed now ill let yall know because my inclinition tells me that more will pop up. Well the green monster will get parked on May 1 hopefully to begin the conversion which we hope to complete in two weeks.

Dusty

 

All-right Dusty...

Go for it buddy. I also am parking my big white beast this Friday night right after work.. Differant project, I have a set of slotted ART rotors and pads as well as a air dam from a Lightning, a Billet grill and a second battery (with isolator) I am going to install all of these parts as well as attempt to run cooling tubes from the air dam intakes to my brakes and ##### a set of fog lights and for the topper I have a set of F-350 emblems into which I installed a set of lights (see F-150 Board)... I have been saving up parts for a few weeks and it is time to put them on.... Don't forget to update us on the MAF project

Keep Wrenching dude,

Mike

 

Hey Mike i will keep you posted.

As to the Dual batteries, i moved my coolant/ washer fluid 90 degrees to right and down below the old tranny cooler line, worked great fit a second battery snug. Hey i never asked if you where running one of those K&N open element air chargers to replace the box? Mine made a huge difference
Have you tried to make more space under your hood? moving vaccume box or wiring harnesses either? just curious, always interested in what success others have had.
How many miles are on the White beast? is it 4x4 or 4x2, have you tried any motor modifications? like porting? That was huge too, but the larger valves don't do those they allowed too much air to flow for the speed density i think. the porting is ok because a friend of mine did it with no problems on his 96. Also Comp make a cam that is Speed Density compatible. It makes the motor run hard, ill look up the number if you have any interest, otherwise wait till MAF and then cam it, look out V-10's here we come, acctually we'll be looking at them behind us on the passes.

Dusty

 

Dusty,

I answered most of this via an email but..... So everyone here dosent feel left out! (Grin-Grin) I am going to wait until MAF and a supercharger befor opening up the heads. Speed Density really dosent take to well to flow changes. Outside of adding a K&N and opening up the exhaust other mods just make the SD try and counter act for the extra flow. At least this has been my experance. Now after a MAF conversion and the addition of a Vortec set to around 9lbs.... Ummmmm I think possibly porting and adding a set ove oversized intake valves may be of benifit... As for the cam change that isnt up on the top of my list of todo's. I do have to pull a trailer from time to time and to compromise between torque and HP with an aftermarket cam normally ends up with a basically stock grind (I think). I have heard that some of the companys make good RV cams that may help I will look into that at a later date.... For now I have MAF on the brain to be my next big modification... C-Ya' all later


Mike
95 F350 Dually

 

Hey Mike

As to the Cam im just looking for something with a little longer duration and lift, the factory cam is so de-tuned in these trucks it is rediculous. a 9:1 460 should at least be pushing 300Hp with a low end torque cam in it. I think.
Got another Part ordered today;
Main wiring harness: F7TZ12A581-DC don't ask how much but itll be close to $300.00 It is the same for both the E4OD and the ZF 5speed so the computer claims, im not worried, splicing into the reverse switch wire is not hard.

Just thought i would list the part # before i go to work, because when i get back it'll be gone.

Injector Harness is next.

Dusty