i have a 300 6 and i need to know how to put the plug wires back on
i know the order is 153624 with #1 being the cylinder closest to the froont and the distributor is clockwis4e but where does the #1 wire go?

also what is the tool used to unbolt the distributor mounted ignition module

 

On a 1987 and later #1 is the center terminal of the 3 between the mounting points of the cap on the side fartherest from the engine. The tool to remove the module is a socket of sorts that has a longer thin nose to get in to the hex screws. This is a special tool that can be purchased at many auto jobbers. I know NAPA has them. Not too expensive, used to be about 7 dollars.

 

its a 5.5 m socket
i replaced the ignition module plug wires and coil but still have no spark
the coil is hott on the output side but it doesnt make it through the wire wtf?

 

It could be the pickup coil(stator) inside the distributor. Mine went dead on my 88 F-150 with the same engine.

 

Pick up would be my guess,too. Rebuilt dist. is $100 or less and probably would be less work than replacing the stator/pickup/Hall effect sensor. You need an arbor press to get the dist. gear on and off to replace the stator. The time saved would probably outweigh the money spent.
My two cents.



guzzler96

 

The negative side of the coil will be +12 volts except that it will be momentarily grounded by the TFI as the engine turns. Unlike mechanical points, you won't find any point on the engine rotation where the negative side will be held at ground statically -- the engine must be spinning to ground the coil primary.
The easiest way to test it is with a $2.00 test light. It should be on with the engine stopped, and flash as the engine cranks.

You can test the wiring by verifying +12 volts at the coil negative. Pull out the gray TFI connector and check for +12 volts on the "TACH" wire on the harness side of the connector. If there is not +12 volts here, there is an open circuit between the coil and the TFI module.

 

i replaced the distributor and hall effect sensor today and still no spark
all the wires going into the coil are 12v + im not sure where else to look

 

Just to recap. You have replaced the distributor, new or reman.?, TFI ignition module, new?, spark plug wires and the coil, new? Theres only one thing left that you haven't replaced, but I would hesitate to think that the PCM might be a problem. I think I'll bow to to the more knowledgeable powers on this one. Chime in here fefarms or anyone with more ideas. What do you think??



guzzler96

 

new coil
new plug wires
new battery
reman distributor with new pickup coil
new cap and rotor
new ignition module
new fuel pum relay

 

Before doing anything else, be sure all the grounds are solid. The battery negative post, the cable connection to the block, and the small post right in front of the battery should all be checked.

It is possible, but fairly unlikely, for the PCM or wiring to SPOUT to interfere with spark delivery during crank. You can eliminate this possibilty by temporarily removing the SPOUT jumper. Try to start the engine. See if you have spark. The TFI can and should fire the coil on its own even with a dead PCM.

If this fails, it is time to try to isolate what is (not) happening.

Remove the distributor cap and move it out of the way. You can leave the plug wires attached. Crank the engine. Verify that the rotor turns as the engine is cranked. If the rotor does not turn, you have timing chain or distributor problems. If the rotor turns, put the distributor cap back on.

Make up a small grounding wire. Connect one end to a convenient ground. Get a spare spark plug wire and an old spark plug. Connect the spark plug to the coil tower with the old plug wire, and ground the spark plug to the engine.

Turn the key on. Use the free end of the small grounding wire to momentarily ground the coil primary negative terminal. Each time you remove the ground, you should see a spark on the spark plug. If this works, you know the coil is being fed by a solid 12 volts and is capable of creating a spark. If this fails, you know the problem is confined to the coil and the feed to same.

If the rotor turns and you've proved the coil is capable of creating a spark, it is time to trace the wiring to the TFI connector.

Remove the gray connector from the TFI module. Observe which way is "up" on the connector. With the harness connector oriented "up", the pins from top to bottom are:
PIP
SPOUT
HOT IN START
HOT IN RUN OR START
TACH
IGN GROUND

Turn the key on. Probe the "HOT IN RUN OR START" pin on the harness connector. It should be +12 volts. Probe the "TACH" pin. It should also be +12 volts.

If all these tests pass, the TFI module and Hall Effect sensor remain suspect. But run the tests and let us know.

 

the tfi module is distributor mounted right?
i need to wait till it stops raining and then ill go **** with ti some more
i know the rotor is turning so its not that
and its safe to assume there is enough ground because im using the motor as my test light gound

so im assuming the wiring is dead somewhere
ill have to check the tfi plug
Andy

 

Yes, I'm describing the connector for a distributor body mounted TFI module.

It is NOT safe to assume the grounds are OK just because the starter speed is acceptable or the engine block seems to sort-of be ground as measured with a test light. I learned this the hard way.

The grounding from the distributor body back to the battery is particularly critical. The current path is from the coil, through the TFI module, through the TFI mounting screws, to the base of the distributor, to the engine block, through the battery ground cable, and back to the negative battery post.

As the TFI tries to ground the coil negative lead, current will pass through the distributor body. If there is too much resistance back to the battery, the TFI's ground will "float" up above zero volts. This will upset the analog circuitry (that conditions the Hall effect pickup), resulting in a loss of PIP signal and no spark.

The wire on the TFI connector labled "ignition ground" is actually more of a reference output -- it is not a grounding path. This wire is tied to the distributor body and is sent to the PCM along with the PIP signal. This acts as a reference level for a differential amplifier in the PCM in order to help the PCM cope somewhat with shifting grounds. The actual ground path is through the distributor body and engine block.

Since you have a test light, touch it to the coil primary negative lead. Crank the engine and see if the test light flashes, glows steadily, or goes out. (It should flash).

 

when you say coil primary negative lead which wire are you talking about?
the output side of the coil is positive and all the wires going into the coil read positive on the test light
i thought the coil was grounded on by the bracked it mounted to

Andy

 

If its like mine one of the (2) main terminals on the coil where the harness plugs up is actually marked negative. I unplugged mine and looked with a light and I think the left terminal on mine was neg. and the right terminal was pos. When I checked the resistance on the coil, I read the two terminals at the plug for the primary and read the neg. at the plug and the output terminal(where coil wire attaches) for the secondary.



guzzler96

 

The ignition coil is not grounded by the bracket. The RFI suppression capacitor may be grounded to the bracket, but this capacitor is only to make the radio reception marginally acceptable -- it has nothing to do with generating spark.

Your ignition coil is a transformer. Just like the ones you see hanging on the power poles along the road. It has a primary winding and a secondary winding. (Not really, it's an autotransformer, but this is detail you don't need to know). The primary winding is connected with the plus side to the "hot in run or start" feed coming from the ignition switch. The negative side of the primary winding is momentarily grounded and ungrounded by the TFI module on the distributor body. Both the plus side and the minus side of the primary winding are low voltage (12 volt) terminals with spade lugs.

The secondary winding is connected between the negative side of the primary winding and that big tower on the top of the ignition coil -- the one connected to the distributor cap. The secondary side of the ignition coil can show voltages in excess of 50000 volts, due to the turns ratio of the transformer. That's why it needs a fancy wire with a ceramic tower and a big rubber boot, instead of spade lugs.

When checking the negative side of the primary winding, we are verifying whether the TFI module is sucessfully conducting current away from the coil during crank, and that the coil is not an open circuit. Hence we should see +12 volts with the engine stopped, and a flashing light with the engine cranking.

The positive primary ignition terminal should be 12 volts all the time (with the key in start or run).