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Propane Injection????

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  #16  
Old 12-24-2004, 08:49 PM
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quad im about to buy a chip for my 97 soon what chip are you running? can you run the chip that is setup for propane without propane? i was looking at the 6 pos chip

i got a 97 5 speed. open intake, soon to be tymar downpipe 3-3.5-4 ceramic and have 5" on the truck now. gauges galore......and some new lifters....
 
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  #17  
Old 12-24-2004, 09:00 PM
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I was kind leaning twards the 'pane first cuz I didnt want to get a chip, then have to have it reprogramed.

My new interest is these "box codes". I am assuming these are the diferent computers that were installed. can you please elaborate more on these, where can I find out about them, and how does this affect a chip. my thinking is that a chip works with your stock computer, or does it completely reprogram the computer??? is this why the "box code" is so important.

last note. the exhaust and intake are already to go, been reading up on that 1.0 ar housing you have to. seems like another good idea soon.


Diesel Rod
 
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  #18  
Old 12-24-2004, 09:53 PM
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when you guys say chip, do you mean just a chip, or a programmer also like the edge evolution
 
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Old 12-24-2004, 10:04 PM
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A programer plugs into the diagnostic port under your dash, you go through a series of instructions that come up on the screen of the programer, and your set. A chip plugs into your computer box, or taps into it, in the case of a flip chip. you physicaly have to find the computer, open up a few things, and put it back together.


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Old 12-24-2004, 10:43 PM
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DR

theres a code on your computer that tells you what program is there so with a chip it modifies certain areas of your computer depending on what you already have. its all little things like i noticed my 94.5 f450 has more power but not as good mileage as my 97 f250 and the f250 gets better mileage (considerable 450 gets 12 on a good day, but the body is really heavy and the bigger rear end and duals....f250 gets 18 when im nice to it 15 in reality. and my 97 has always started cold much better than the 94.5. theres a guy on ebay selling the ts 6 pos for $400 new and ive seen the ps2k's on dieselstop used so i think i can manage both for a little more than what the ps2k is going for new. think chip and propane all at once now that would be a new experience. thinking 1.0ar turbine but im gonna intercool before that cause how much i tow.
 
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Old 12-24-2004, 10:51 PM
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forgot to ask earlier

quad how are your egts with the propane, chip, 1.0ar housing?? i know with the 1.0 they go up. with no intercooler how are you keeping them down? do you tow with your truck?
 
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Old 12-24-2004, 10:51 PM
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You guys are doing it to me again! I tow 8K with my 96, I have done the gauges, down pipe, cat cut out, HX, 6637 air filter and ccv mod. I was thinking about a intercooler but after reading this thread I don't know. Is there any benefits of pane when towing? I also have a superchip set on safe towing mode. I would think that the pane would be a clean burning set-up. Also, what does it do to MPG? I'm probably just dreaming because pane probably is just for putting the rice burner in the rear veiw miror!
 
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  #23  
Old 12-24-2004, 11:01 PM
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im wondering the same thing it has to lower egt's cause if quad is able to run all that and a 1.0ar housing it must lower them. i tow 12-14k regularly so i gotta make sure, wont have my 4400 till late 2005
 
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  #24  
Old 12-25-2004, 05:27 AM
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So many questions, so little time...
quad im about to buy a chip for my 97 soon what chip are you running?
i got a 97 5 speed. open intake, soon to be tymar downpipe 3-3.5-4 ceramic and have 5" on the truck now. gauges galore......and some new lifters....
I'm running a DieselPower 4 position chip that I bought from Dale Isley at TYMAR. The programming was done by Bill, generally regarded as the best in the business.
can you run the chip that is setup for propane without propane? i was looking at the 6 pos chip
If the chip is programmed for use without propane, there are two things done to increase power. One is to increase the amount of fuel delivered to the injectors. The other is to advance the fuel timing, similar in concept to advancing the ignition timing on a gasser. Since propane advances the fuel timing, this part needs to be left out of the chip programming. You can run a propane chip in a non-propane truck, but there isn't as much increase in power.
My new interest is these "box codes". I am assuming these are the diferent computers that were installed. can you please elaborate more on these, where can I find out about them, and how does this affect a chip. my thinking is that a chip works with your stock computer, or does it completely reprogram the computer??? is this why the "box code" is so important
The box code is the total program that was loaded into the pcm. Over the years, Ford has changed the box code that is installed in trucks. The box code controls the operating parameters of the engine, so glow plug operation, torque convertor lockup, etc., are controlled by the box code. A 4 bank chip overwrites the information in the pcm, and causes the truck to operate with the parameters of the chip. If you drive an OBS truck with an automatic, for example, you'll likely find that the TDE0 or TDE1 codes are the ones that will make your truck operate in the most user-friendly way. Think of the box codes as the personality of the truck. Within each of the box codes, there are several power levels that can be attained through the chip: tow, race, extreme, etc.
Is this explanation helping at all?
forgot to ask earlier

quad how are your egts with the propane, chip, 1.0ar housing?? i know with the 1.0 they go up. with no intercooler how are you keeping them down? do you tow with your truck?
By replacing my 1.15 turbine housing with the 1.0, I've effectively moved the boost curve lower in the rpm band. At any given rpm where boost was present before the switch, I have approximately 10% more boost now. Increased boost does two good things for my truck: First, the chip sees more boost, so more fuel is added. Second, my propane system is triggered by boost, so more propane flows at a lower rpm than before. The result is that there's more power through the midrange than with the stock 1.15 turbine housing. However, the payback comes when the rpms exceed a certain point, where the boost tops out slightly lower at the top end. I used to be able to hit 31psi boost @ 3200 rpm. Now, my boost levels off at 27psi @ 2700rpm, and won't go higher as the rpms rise. Since I don't regularly exceed 2700 rpm, it was a great move for me. If you're interested in top end performance, you might want to consider the "downside" of the 1.0 before installing one.
Since there's more boost and airflow through the midrange, my EGT's are actually lower than they were before, until you get into the higher rpm's. I've towed with my truck after the installation of the 1.0 housing, and have decided to install an intercooler. But, that's because I like to keep a bigger margin of safety regarding EGT's, not because of the 1.0 housing.
You guys are doing it to me again! I tow 8K with my 96, I have done the gauges, down pipe, cat cut out, HX, 6637 air filter and ccv mod. I was thinking about a intercooler but after reading this thread I don't know. Is there any benefits of pane when towing? I also have a superchip set on safe towing mode. I would think that the pane would be a clean burning set-up. Also, what does it do to MPG? I'm probably just dreaming because pane probably is just for putting the rice burner in the rear veiw miror!
Judicious use of propane will actually improve mpg slightly. It isn't enough to justify the expense of the system, but if that helps you convince the wife that you need it on your truck, go for it. Propane burns cooler and cleaner than #2 diesel, so it improves efficiency, which reduces temps, and improves mpg.
One last note, I don't know if programmers give you the option of increasing fuel without advancing the fuel timing. If you don't have that option, I'd recommend that you look into a chip rather than a programmer. As Spiderman said: "With power comes responsibility." There are some dangerous downsides to getting careless with propane. If any of you want to investigate further, I'll be glad to tell you what they are, and help in any way I can to help you make the right decisions.
Right now, I've got presents to open. I'll get back to you later.
Merry Christmas everyone.
Scott.
 
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  #25  
Old 12-25-2004, 08:56 AM
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Thanks Quad!!!!!
 
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Old 12-25-2004, 11:15 AM
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I was just reading up on this post and had a question. I have the edge juice/attitude setup stacked with a Bulldog 6-bank flipchip. I know id probably have to send the bullydog chip back if i went with propane and get it reburned, but what would I do with the edge system? Do you think stacking the two chips is overkill? should i just sell my bullydog chip and stick with the edge? thanks!
 
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  #27  
Old 12-25-2004, 01:17 PM
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with what quad said about fuel timing getting advanced i would find out if the edge can handle that. i would run with the chip though....
 
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Old 12-25-2004, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by barebackjake
DR

theres a guy on ebay selling the ts 6 pos for $400 new and ive seen the ps2k's on dieselstop used so i think i can manage both for a little more than what the ps2k is going for new. think chip and propane all at once now that would be a new experience. thinking 1.0ar turbine but im gonna intercool before that cause how much i tow.
Just yesterday I was looking over at the stuff that for sale on TDS and I prolly saw that same PS2K setup that you saw. I was kind thinking of jumping on it since it was so cheap. like you said, I figured I could by that set up, and a good chip for less then a new PS2k. looks like we might end up fighting over the same PS2k pretty soon . all this propane talk, and christmas bonuses coming in, leads to many good things.

thanks for the info on the Box Codes. have to go look at mine someday.


Diesel Rod
 
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  #29  
Old 12-25-2004, 01:22 PM
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barebackjake, I fergot on the last post.

what year is the truck that your thinking of doin all these mods to.??? is it your 97??? just curious cuz it kind seems that you and I are about the same place and doin the same mods at the same time, to the same trucks.


Diesel Rod
 
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  #30  
Old 12-25-2004, 01:28 PM
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yeah mines a 97 truck also. got a 5 speed in mine too. im going to go with the bills chip from tymar after what quad said. think it might be worth the extra $$ and quads happy with it. you'll probably get that ps2k before i do i gotta intercool before since i tow 75% of the time. im gonna see if i can get a chip that will have stock, tow and race, and tow and race with propane. gonna put the hpx mod, coolant filter, new tymar 3-3.5-4 ceramic coated downpipe, the 1.0ar housing, intercool, chip and propane. in pretty close to that order, should have the intercooler done mid january.....propane mostlikely in febuary
 
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