I can only speak to functionality of the Predator just like Daryl can only speak to the functionality of the SC....
I respect Daryl's opinion since I've seen his post for a long time....
from what he's said, we both like ours...
both do GREAT things to an already good engine...
the differences may be minute when it all comes down to it...

a comparison will only help those that don't have one yet...
since neither of us SELL these things, it is only important to us to help others get by the "politics" and try to keep ONE area of life a tiny bit more honest
(of course "My daddy can beat your daddy in .... " is incentive enough )

the fact of the matter is the 6.0L has tremendous potential that will really make you grin with either of these tuners

which one is "best" has not yet been resolved... even with MULTIPLE attempts on some of our parts to get information...
nor looks like it will....

And the latest post on the other thread seems to show it's a "bother" to others
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/s...64#post2053664

 

Well I can tell you that the Predator makes a considerable improvement on the 65hp setting. I have not tried the 100hp setting since I don't have exhaust modifications. I just returned my truck to stock so it could go to the dealer this morning and have some work done on it and it's night and day difference when it goes back to stock. I am sure the SC tuner is an excellent tuner also. I think it's all about personal preference.

 

Dr. Pain - If you are a Dr and own a 6.0 (neither may be true) buy both tuners and pick the one that is best for you. Maximum horsepower/torque ratings may not be the most important thing unless racing is all you care about - driveability in more normal situations is far more important to most of us. If you don't like the Predator send it back for a refund (which would be a "cheap" thing to do). Are you a medical doctor and do you own a Ford 6.0 diesel? After reading many pages on this topic with all kinds of opinions and comments if you can't make up your mind put your money where your mouth is!

 

I believe Matt (PSD 60L Fx4) recently got a Predator and has had a SCMT for some time now, and I think he even has a Edge chip. He should be able to offer some input on the performance of both. Maybe we could even talk him into some comparision 1/4 mile times or dyno runs.

PSD 60L Fx4, please don't upset, I just think you may be able to offer some of the best first hand knowledge of BOTH products.

 

Well Dr...I have to think that you are a very quick study...gees...way to much reading for me.

IMO, you will never achieve a measurable consensus, here at FTE, regarding these two very good products. Both products deliver the goods so to speak and the differences between the two are insignificant to the average 6.0 owner.

If you have a special need or desire that one fullfills then there is obviously no need for debate. If not...just pick one...install it. Buckle your seat belt...and let 'er rip.

FYI: The biggest problem you will, have either way, is convincing people that you have not had any Botox injections...'cause that smile on your face will be stuck on there for quite a while.

 

Kurt,
Such harsh words!!!!. I did recently finish a doctorate in physical therapy and am in the process of defending my dissertation on the subject of manual therapy as a treatment of cervicogenic headaches, and did recently buy a USED 2004 F-250 6L PSD. I appreciate your concerns in the veracity of my claims but be reassured that I have nothing but respect for FTE members and do not suffer for the "short man syndrome", SOOooooo untruths are not necessary. Now that I have addressed the first point, let me answer your suggestion. Having read several threads on the subject in FTE, one line of posting comes to mind to answer your suggestion to buy both and return one. Being a business owner I can tell you that I share Ken's (our FTE master and owner of MotorHaven.com) sentiment with regards to unneccessary charges. For those that are not aware, the businesses accepting credit cards have to pay a fee for using the service, plus depending on the company they are dealing with have to pay a monthly rate or pro-ratum on the charges for the month, and if that is not enough have to pay again when processing a return. Something to think about when dealing with small businesses... it definitely puts a financial strain on the bottom line. In my practice, I do not accept cerdit card but have the benefits of dealing with insurance companies etc.. the big cash cows, but for small business owners such as Ken, the bottom line counts and unnecessary returns are eating at his profits. Having said all of that, I know for a fact that several FTE members have had the opportunity to test both and can readily give us their unmarketed views on the subject. Unfortunately threads go for days with emails like yours and mine and for the newbie trying to get information it is almost impossible to digest the tons of posting to read what is important.

My goal with this thread is to start anew and hopefully avoid lenghty disclosures, like the one I just did, which have no reason for being and detract from the real purpose. Stick to the issue, please!!!! For the sake of helping little newbies like me. It is much easier to go through a thread which contains the info you are looking for.

Claude

 

Here is what I read in another thread. GREAT INFO and the kind we should carry!!!!

This was a reply to Vic_Ferrari (programmer for SC) "So I had a dyno test done with both products. Diablo and SCT were very close in gains. Diablo had more power from the start, SCT more on the top. I couldn't publish the full report because something was screwed up on the torque plots. I think the axle ratio wasn't set so the torque numbers, while the graph curves looked correct, showed numbers about the same times higher as the axle ratio. Although it's simple math to correct them I couldn't publish something like that. I planned to redo the test with the ratio corrected so I could show everyone the surprising DiabloSport numbers but have gotten busy, and frankly, things tend to get forgotten." Ken Payne FTE Site Administrator.

The info helps but what does it mean for overly educated idiots like me?? I am looking for streetable HP and will be towing once in a while. Is it better for me to have a tuner that give me low end gains or top end??

Claude

 

Dr - thanks for answering my questions and my apology for being abrupt! I didn't really recommend sending back the Predator - I agree that would be "cheap" as I stated. I have seen very few report dissatisfaction with either programmer on this forum and agree with kw - either will make you smile! Again, sorry for the nature of my comments to you and best of luck with your profession - you should be able to upgrade to an 05 before long! Kurt

 

OK group hug....

 

Gees...that was close Tim...I thought you said GROPE hug there for a minute. Made me nervous. If you know what I mean.

 

Leave me out......of the one you thought

 

You have mail..(PM)

 

As noted previously I have the SCMT.

90% of the time or more I'm driving around unloaded 4 miles to work and back each day plus the odd errand around town. Towing of the toy hauler is done every so often, and now that fall / winter is here I'll be going out more regularly.

In towing here in So Cal there isn't much flat driving on cruise control, there are plenty of 6% grades everywhere you look with sections much higher and greater than 10% aren't hard to find.

I think that good low end torque is very important for generally cruising around and pulling on the flat and into moderate hills. When the climbs start to get steeper however, having the extra power further up the RPM range will definitely help out.

My truck tows great stock, but on climbing some of the steeper hills there is a point where the truck wanted to shift back to high gear out of 3rd/4th? At that point there wasn't quite enough power in 5th to accelerate any more and I'd be stuck holding 50 to 55 mph - this is a steep hill remember (I went up I-70 into Denver faster than that at 10,000+ ft with less problems). I've noted that the EGT also climbs a bit more pulling hard in 5th versus spinning faster in 3rd.

With the SCMT in tow safe (the lowest power setting), the truck still makes a fair bit more power than stock and definitely revs further with good power. Stock the trucks power drops like a rock after 3600 rpm and with the tow safe tune installed it revs to 3900 easy and is still pulling well. It is set to shift above that I think.

So on the same hill where I'd be running out of steam at 3600 rpm in 3rd/4th? and having to shift into 5th the truck has more power and easily revs to the point where when it does shift into 5th the truck holds the speed better. The net result was better fuel mileage as well. EGTs were also quite good and never got out of line - maybe better than stock but I'd have to do some more towing to make that claim for sure.

My trailer is 10,000 - 12,000 lbs loaded typically and given the EGTs that I'm seeing I could probably bump up the tuner to the mid level setting and just keep an eye on them. I'm sure that on that setting I could run them up to unsafe levels on some of these hills if I really tried to hot rod up them.

The SCMT does have significant gains over stock even in the lower RPM ranges, but without comparing the charts, but given the comment from Ken, perhaps not as much as the Predator.

So assuming that this is true and without having towed with the Predator, my gut feeling is that for towing on flat to mild to moderate hills the Predator may be more comfortable loafing along on cruise control with less shifting to the lower gear. When hitting the steeper hills, the SCMT will then begin to do better.

A comparison test using the same truck/trailer and route with flats and hills thrown in is really the only way to go. Truck should be topped off before and after each pass and fuel economy should be part of the test.

 

The plots on the website are INERTIA.

Loaded runs have not been yet released.

 

Darryl you are the man.

Love the information. We just need more people like you describing their personal experiences. Even if a concensus is not reached at least we may have enough first hand accounts, with enough variety, that members may be able to mirror what ever needs they have. This would most definitely make it easier to discriminate between tuners.

Claude
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'04/'04 F-250 6L PSD 4x4 Harley Edition #2299 Black/Gray