My wife and I are upgrading our exisitng fifth-wheel and I need advice. We have been talking with muliple RV dealers about purchasing a 34 foot fifth wheel and I am receiving conflicting and confusing feedback on whether my truck and hitch are adequate to handle the increased load and I would appreciate expert advise.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>

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I have a 2004 Ford F-250 4x4 6.0 diesel with exteended cab, single rear wheels, short bed, and automatic transmission. It is rated at a fifth wheel maximum loaded trailer weight of 15, 600 lbs and a hitch weight of 2,500 lbs. I also have a 16K sliding Reese hitch. If I go by the specifications in the trailer literature, I am over the limits at the 16,200 GVWR rating of trailer. However, if I look at the dry weight of the trailer and was careful in what I loaded, I have over 3,000 lbs between the dry weight and the truck rating.
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One dealer advises that my truck is ok, but that I must upgrade my hitch to a 20K to account for the GVWR. This makes no sense to me. A 16K hitch exceeds the rating of the truck, and my feeling is that if the 16K hitch cannot handle the trailer than the truck is inadequate for the job. Two other dealers advise that my truck and existing hitch would easily handle the trailer. Another dealer advises that I put in "helper springs". As you can see, I am confused and would appreciate feedback.

 

It has been my experience that at most dealerships both Truck and Rv's the sales people have limited knowledge when it comes to applying the correct interpretation of the varous factors invoved in selecting a truck to safely handle a given fifth wheel.

Take a look at this website and see if this helps you have a better understanding of the factors involved. If it does great, if not PM me and I will help if I can.

http://www.klenger.net/arctic-fox/weight/

I used the info from this site to figure out what truck I would need to handle our new Cameo 34CK3. The end result was an order for a Ford F350 with a PSD and SRW.

 

First of all, I think the dealer who advised you to buy a 20K hitch just wanted to sell you a hitch. Just as you wrote, the Reese 16K hitch should be fine--especially if you have a 3,000-pound safety margin!

Does your truck have the factory towing package? If so, I really see no problem with the trailer you are considering.

If, at maximum load, you are only 200-pounds over the rating, that seems to me to be no real problem. You see, most towing products--for reasons of safety and reliability and, of course, liability--are rated lighter than that which they are physically able to hold.

You can go to www.fordvehicles.com and go to the trailer towing interactive link and see what the new information there shows.

The dealer's suggestion to buy "helper springs" may have merit if you wound be over the recommendation by a fairly substantial amount. Which transmission does your truck have? Especially if it is the E4OD, it is the strongest automatic currently available from any manufacturer. Especially with the torque amplification of the converter and the total gear reduction an F250 has, that diesel should have no problem at all safely moving that load at a sustained speed. An F250 has stout componentry, no doubt. The weakest part of the whole package is the spring assembly--and it is not terribly weak at all. It is merely the weakest part of it all.

I hope these suggestions and thoughts are helpful to you to at least some degree.

 

That trailer is way too much for your truck. The GVWR of your F250 is 8800 lbs and it probably weighs at least 7000 lbs without any cargo. I can almost guarantee that you will be significantly over the GVWR. Adding helper springs will not increase the capability of your truck. I would suggest an F350 dually if you really want to tow something that big, or possibly an F450/550. That's one big fifth wheel you're talking about.

 

Hi,burkard9
I'm looking at the Frod 2004 RV&Trailer Towing Guide and it shows the truck you listed as a maximum Fifth-wheel towing load as 13,000#. There is a (*)at that 13,000#. Looking down to the Foot Note it shows * (For F-250/F-350 SRW models, F-350 trailer weights are shown. F-250 trailer weights are within 100 pounds, except for the F-250 SRW 4x4 SuperCab and Crew Cab applications indication with asterisks above. For these applications, Maximum loaded trailer weight is 12,000 pounds for F-250 SRW 4x4 SuperCab and 10,400 pounds for F-250 SRW 4x4 Crew Cab). I have the same truck but with a V-10. I weight in at 6740. You should be around 7500#. 7500# from 20000# leaves you at 12,500# for trailer weight. 7500# from 8800# leaves you with 1,300# for pin weight. I think Ford is using a weight of 8,000# for the Diesel truck and that would acount for 12,000# in the Foot note.

 

Safety is all relative. When in doubt always err on the side of safety. That's if money permits. If not, then you will probably be just fine with what you have provided you be careful and exercise extra caution on windy days or winding roads.

 

I agree with Johnsdiesel that 15,600 lbs of trailer with a 2,500 lb pin weight is too much trailer for an F250. I would upgrade to a dually (or better yet an F450 with 26,000 lb GCWR) or choose a lighter trailer. That trailer weight will put you over the 20,000 lb GCWR for a PSD (or a V10 with 4.30's) by about 3000 lbs and the pin weight *may* put your truck's rear tires over their max load capacity as well. Duallies have about twice the payload of single wheel trucks, which is one reason why they are so great for pulling heavy fifth wheels.

 

Welcome to the site!

Let's look at the numbers...

Truck GVWR = 8800 lbs, GCWR = 20,000 lbs.

Since we don't have an actual weight, I'd guess your truck weighs roughly 7500 lbs with a driver and full tank of fuel. Looking at GVWR, this 7500 lb value leaves around 1300 lbs for the weight of the hitch, trailer pin weight, tools, and other passengers and "stuff" you might load into the pickup. Looking at GCWR, the 7500lb truck gives you a 12,500 lb max trailer weight.

Trailer GVWR = 16,200 lbs, Pin weight @ 20% GVWR = 3240lbs, Pin weight @ 25% GVWR= 4050lbs.

It's pretty well accepted that "dry weights" are terribly incorrect for RVs. The more logical number to use (if you don't have actual weights) is the GVWR. Regardless of how carefully you load the trailer, I'd bet you're going to be closer to GVWR than the published 'dry' weight. Besides, why would you want to pull around a nice, big trailer but not have any propane, food, dishes, pots, pans, linen, etc.?

Analysis:
Looking at the above numbers, the trailer's pin weight (~3240 lbs) immediately jumps out as being significantly more than your truck's rated payload of 1300 lbs.

Adding 16,200 lbs to your truck's 7500 lbs gives a combined weight of 23,700 lbs- which is 3700 lbs higher than your truck's 20,000 lb GCWR rating.

Conclusion: you either need a bigger truck or a smaller trailer.

On a side note: With a possible trailer weight of 16,200 lbs, you'll want a 20K hitch.

 

I agree with the comments above. Look for a 5er around 10,000 GVWR to be totally legal. I'll be the first to admit that I am pushing my ratings a bit too far by towing a 11,000 lb trailer....but I'd never try a 16,000 lb unit, that's asking a bit too much for the F250. Ford makes bigger trucks for just this very reason, I just wish I educated myself a bit more BEFORE I purchased my F250. Be safe and good luck.

 

burkard9--if you are looking at a new or fairly new used unit, there is a label somewhere in the kitchen area on a cabinet door listing the GVWR and the "as shipped" weight. Check this label closely and DO NOT DEPEND ON THE DRY WEIGHT IN THE SALES BROCHURE--what counts is the 'out the factory door' weight without water or propane. I believe fivers hitch weight is 15-20% of the shipped weight, or more.

NoMo lays it out real well--you are going to be badly overloaded on the rear axle and the entire truck with a 250.