so i did some research and thought icm no sweat well i got my timing off i guess because it wouldnt start and backfired a couple times so then i tried to set the base timing to 10 deg. btc still no luck it wont even try to fire, when i set the timing all i did was put the pointer of the h bal on 10 btc and adjusted the rotor to the number 1 plug? am i missing something ? does timing hafta be exactly perfect to even start it? any suggestions would be appreciated

 

Did you get it firing on #1 compression stroke before lining up your pointer to 10* btdc?

 

hmm i guess i thought that when the balancer was at 10* it was on the compression stroke
well i guess that could explain my problem
thank you for lining me out i know these simple (stupid) questions seem like a waste of time but i appreciate it

 

ok im really confused i turn the engine with the nut on the h bal. until the No.1 is compressed then i turn more until the h bal. is at 10*? y would it matter then if i checked the no. 1 plug if im just gonna keep turning the engin till 10* anyways
is there a way to set/adjust the h bal. when i get the 1 cyl. in the right spot?

 

I don't have all the proper words and terminology to explain it right but here's my take on it. being that it's a 4 stroke engine. The mark on TDc of the balancer will go past the pointer twice. Once on the compression stroke and then on the exhaust stroke. So if you line up the mark on the balancer at 10 degress before top dead center when the roter is pointing to number one plug wire on the distributr cap while the engine is on the compression stroke it should be close enough to run. If you do all of that when it's on the exhaust stroke your timing will be 180 degrees off and it will backfire, snort, pop and not run.
The best way to dtime it is to remove the right side valve cover so you can watch the valves to see which stroke the engine is on.
Hope this helps some
Clint

 

well i got it set and so now i have spark and fuel but .....https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/s...d.php?t=270619

 

When you have the pointer lined-up with the balancer at 0 TDC, is the rotor contact pointing directly at the # 1 plug wire?

EDIT: You can pull out the #1 spark plug when you are set at 0 TDC and the rotor contact directly under the #1 spark plug tower on the cap, and lightly put a clean screwdriver into the spark plug hole to make sure that the piston is all the way up...

 

BTW... If I am reading your post correctly, you set the balancer pointer to 10 BTDC, pulled the distributor up, and then set it in, placing the rotor contact to the #1 plug wire?

If so, you will need to pull the distributor back out, and set the balancer back to 0 TDC. Put the distributor back in making sure that the #1 piston is up. Make sure the rotor contact is directly under the #1 plug tower on the cap.

Hook-up your timing light, pull and block the vacuum advance hose from the distributor, loosen-up the distributor hold-down just enough to be able to turn the distributor, start the engine, point your timing light at the pointer, and turn the distributor a little at a time until you see it lined-up at 10 BTDC .... Then tighten the distributor hold-down, and re-connect the vacuum advance hose...

 

ok i tried to i manually set it a 0 btc -didnt start then manually at 10 btc - didnt start
then i used the light and got the No.1 plug actually firing on 10 btc - still wont start
when i did this i pulled the spout connector however it wouldnt even start so what would be the point of pulling the vacuum advance

other timings to get it to start at are 5-10 atc, 0btc, 8 btc, currently 10btc, 20 btc
and it never started

im not so sure it is a timing error anymore

 

When you had it set at 0 TDC, (Top Dead Center) did you pull the #1 spark plug and stick a screwdriver in the hole to make sure the piston was all the way up?

EDIT: No matter what, you want the balancer pointer set at 0 TDC with the rotor contact pointing directly under the #1 plug tower on the cap. (when you are sure that the #1 piston is all the way up)

The timing is then set by pointing a timing light at the balancer pointer and running the engine... You turn the distributor until the desired timing is set. (with the engine running)

 

i couldnt tell when the piston was exactly at the top but i know it was atleast close to tdc as i could feel compresion building then leveling off around tdc
however the engine would not start so i just used a light to tell when it was trying to fire and it seemed to be firing really late so i advanced it to 10*btc (with the engine turning over but not actually starting)

im not sure how to explain it im pretty confused myself
let me step back and line things out
ok the No. 1 plug wire triggers the timing light as the h. bal reads 10*btc
fuel is 30-50psi at the rail and ticks(injectors i assume)

hmmm what could it be? is the timing light flashing but the plug actually not getting spark? should the plug be firing at some other time than 10*btc? or did having the timing off foul something else up??

thanx for all the advice so far
im learnin alot

 

First thing is to start over with a fresh set of properly gapped plugs, they can short out and not fire properly, and can get fouled by gas etc....

Are the plugs dry or wet after cranking?? Dry= no fuel Check the plugs after cranking to look for unburned fuel.

Next, try squirting some starting fluid down the throttle body when you are turning it over. This will confirm that something is trying to fire in there. Fuel pressure will not guarantee fuel going into the engine!! If the engine fires then dies, you don't have fuel going in.

What happened to make the no start in the first place??

You should confirm the TDC with a piston stop, then confirm that the TDC mark on the balancer is correct. The outer ring can move and give a false TDC mark.

The timing chain could be fairly stretched, that does not usually cause no start untill it breaks.

Run compression test on all 8 cyls, make sure the valves and pistons are creating proper pressure. Bad valve timing (worn chain) or burned valves will show up here.

Are you sure the computer is working? The MIL should come on when KOEO, any codes stored? running the KOEO test will throw some hard faults as the motor is cold, but this will confirm the computer is alive.

Remember you need spark, compression and fuel to start and all at the proper times.

 

alright the plugs are 2weeks old
i will be using some intake cleaner to try and start it when i get home(i let it sit so if it was flooded some gas could dry out)
i replaced the icm is what got this whole thing started
i know that the marks are atleast close and i tried a whole range of timings when i was adjusting it
i dont see how i coulda lost compression or a timing chain since it was running fine on monday
i believe i have spark because of the timing light flashing
and i have fuel pressure on the rail that ticks as the injectors work and smell gas in the exhaust

 

the computer is the next thing i need to test i read somewhere that it could be the eec relay causing this

i appreciate you guys

 

ok well i tried it with TB cleaner and it didnt help so i think i can rule out being fuel related
i tried my old icm that didnt help and started testing things with the volt meter here is what i got
10-12 volts from coil to dist. cap seems normal enough
-3 yes (-) negative volts from the dist cap to the No. 1 plug that doesnt seem so normal?? what do yall think the plug wires are new so is the dist. cap?