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**EDIT - this thread may end up being about add-a-leafs AND camber adjustment and maybe even replacement springs.
Hello all, I'm new here. I just acquired a 1985 F250 4x4 with (of course) a 6.9 IDI and Dana 44 HD TTB front axle. The camber is way negative on the passenger side front wheel and it's driving me crazy. The truck drives down the road really well, absolutely no ride or steering issues whatsoever. The ball joints look and feel tight. The theory is that years of carrying a plow and a 6.9 around have ruined the front springs which has caused such a negative camber.
I'd like to add a small add-a-leaf to pick the front end up just a bit and maybe correct some or most of the negative camber, then I could always go in and add a degree or two with an adjustable camber bushing if needed. I'd assume just the add-a-leaf will get me most of the way there, though.
My question is, can anyone recommend a good add-a-leaf and/or tell me how your experience went with them? I'm presently looking at these two options:
I don't know what to make of the "Dayton" brand springs. The Tuff Country ones look long and almost flat, and that seems like it would be better since I don't want too much lift.
Any input would be appreciated. And yes, I did search but couldn't find any recent content where somebody actually used add-a-leafs and discussed their experience. Thanks!
Welcome to FTE.
negative camber driving down the road, or when backed into the driveway?
these trucks with TTB will be all jacked up when backed into someplace, but once you move forward around 10 foot or so the front end ligns back up and tracks straight. it is the nature of the TTB beast.
if the front tires are no wearing funny, i would leave it be.
If you remove all that steel from the front of your truck, it'll probably ride 1" higher, and you'll get better gas mileage. Go find a stock style front bumper and brackets and it'll probably fix all your problems. I would avoid using an add-a-leaf; these trucks ride rough enough as it is.
If you remove all that steel from the front of your truck, it'll probably ride 1" higher, and you'll get better gas mileage. Go find a stock style front bumper and brackets and it'll probably fix all your problems. I would avoid using an add-a-leaf; these trucks ride rough enough as it is.
I'm not a giant fan of that bumper but it's welded to the plow frame and the truck frame and would require a good amount of fab and welding to remove and replace the plow frame and I don't weld nor is it in my budget to pay someone to do it. So I have to live with that thing. I'm waiting for it to grow on me...
I don't like the idea of an add-a-leaf anymore than the next guy but it seems like the most economical option right now.
Welcome to FTE.
negative camber driving down the road, or when backed into the driveway?
these trucks with TTB will be all jacked up when backed into someplace, but once you move forward around 10 foot or so the front end ligns back up and tracks straight. it is the nature of the TTB beast.
if the front tires are no wearing funny, i would leave it be.
In that photo, I had just pulled into my driveway after driving for a mile or so. Interesting info though. The front passenger tire is wearing funny on the inside edge. This photo doesn't really do the camber justice, it's quite marked when viewing the truck straight on.
This guy says it actually improved the ride, and he has no extra weight over the front. I personally don't have any experience, but saved this thread before I decided to Dana 60 swap everything.
If it was mine, I'd bring it to a heavy truck spring shop and have them do their worst. It may surprise you how cheap they can be. Those guys are really good at what they do and if they can't re-curve your existing springs for less than a new OEM set would cost, they'll hook you up with plenty of cheap options that are far better than an Add-A-Leaf as far as safety, cost, and how much it beats up every other component it touches.
If ya couldn't tell, in my view Add-A-Leaf is a poorly engineered product that's over-marketed to people who don't realize how terrible of an idea it is- and should be sold in the same WalMart aisle as Lucas Oil Treatment and other such products.
To answer your question about "OEM-equivalent" Dayton springs- I've bought and installed one set before and was pretty happy with them.
If it was mine, I'd bring it to a heavy truck spring shop and have them do their worst. It may surprise you how cheap they can be. Those guys are really good at what they do and if they can't re-curve your existing springs for less than a new OEM set would cost, they'll hook you up with plenty of cheap options that are far better than an Add-A-Leaf as far as safety, cost, and how much it beats up every other component it touches.
If ya couldn't tell, in my view Add-A-Leaf is a poorly engineered product that's over-marketed to people who don't realize how terrible of an idea it is- and should be sold in the same WalMart aisle as Lucas Oil Treatment and other such products.
To answer your question about "OEM-equivalent" Dayton springs- I've bought and installed one set before and was pretty happy with them.
Thanks for the input, and I do like the idea. We have a heavy truck/spring shop nearby. It just seems to me that places like that will charge me triple what a couple add-a-leafs would cost just to walk in the door, especially these days where shop labor is over $100/hour.
Thanks for the input, and I do like the idea. We have a heavy truck/spring shop nearby. It just seems to me that places like that will charge me triple what a couple add-a-leafs would cost just to walk in the door, especially these days where shop labor is over $100/hour.
That's likely gonna be the outcome, but I'd still call the spring shop first. Never know what their price is until you ask. Might also make sense to R&R the springs yourself then just have the shop work on the bare spring.
Did you measure the ride height & camber to be sure you do in fact have bent springs? Like Tom said the camber looks funny on these trucks sometimes but the tires still wear OK.
That's likely gonna be the outcome, but I'd still call the spring shop first. Never know what their price is until you ask. Might also make sense to R&R the springs yourself then just have the shop work on the bare spring.
Did you measure the ride height & camber to be sure you do in fact have bent springs? Like Tom said the camber looks funny on these trucks sometimes but the tires still wear OK.
Ride height is almost identical on driver and passenger sides front and back. Front - garage floor to bottom of wheel well edge is 35" and rear it's 37, both sides give or take a small fraction of an inch here or there. I have not measured the negative camber as I have't had the truck aligned yet but it's quite severe on the passenger front wheel, not so severe but still present on the driver front. The passenger front tire is wearing oddly on the inside edge in what is quite clearly a result of the severe negative camber. It needs to be addressed. At this point I'd almost prefer some positive camber without the load of the plow which would afford me somewhat of a normal angle when the plow weight is on the springs.
That said, I don't suspect the springs are "bent" per se, just worn out. They have a significant negative arch but I'm told that's pretty normal across the board for these trucks. The plow frame is very close to the ground in the front, and that's without the weight of the plow. Once I get the weight of the plow loaded on the springs, I bet that plow frame is damn near scraping.
Last edited by Prospect62; Aug 4, 2022 at 03:33 PM.
Ride height is almost identical on driver and passenger sides front and back. Front floor to bottom of wheel well edge is 35" and rear it's 37, both sides give or take a small fraction of an inch here or there. I have not measured the negative camber as I have't had the truck aligned yet but it's quite severe on the passenger front wheel, not so severe but still present on the driver front. The passenger front tire is wearing oddly on the inside edge in what is quite clearly a result of the severe negative camber. It needs to be addressed. At this point I'd almost prefer some positive camber without the load of the plow which would afford me somewhat of a normal angle when the plow weight is on the springs.
That said, I don't suspect the springs are "bent" per se, just worn out. They have a significant negative arch but I'm told that's pretty normal across the board for these trucks. The plow frame is very close to the ground in the front, and that's without the weight of the plow. Once I get the weight of the plow loaded on the springs, I bet that plow frame is damn near scraping.
I don't have access to the factory ride height specs, but that is well within the typical front-rear variation of light 4x4 trucks. You're allowed up to 5/8" side-to-side difference in wheel arch height for the 80/97 F-250 and F-350 w/ front leaf springs, so if you can't measure any variation at all it's unlikely there is anything wrong with the springs. If you're seeing a notable variation in tire wear and camber angle, most likely you have a bent or worn suspension component closer to the wheel end than the spring is.
Things I'd look into, in this order:
Wheel bearing play- are the retainer nuts tight?
Kingpin wear if your truck is equipped with them
Caster/camber cam on the right side, if your truck has one, is indexed correctly- not unheard of for someone to remove it to replace a ball joint, forget to mark it first, then install it wrong
Possibility the PO threw on a pre-worn tire before you bought this
Use a tape measure to take rough measurements, then see if you can get them closer to 1 or 2 degrees positive by moving the cam. Eventually an alignment shop should dial everything in with a Hunter machine, but until you find the problem a tape measure is perfectly adequate for your purposes.
I see what you're talking about BTW, just took a second look at Post No. 1 and the minus camber on the RH front wheel is hella off. If it's so bad you can tell just from a picture, something is seriously wrong and you're right to be concerned.
The springs get ruined from the weight of the engine, mine never saw a plow and they were shot. I replaced them with Dayton 43-498 springs, stock 3485lb replacements. 6 years later and no issues since.
The springs get ruined from the weight of the engine, mine never saw a plow and they were shot. I replaced them with Dayton 43-498 springs, stock 3485lb replacements. 6 years later and no issues since.
Did you have a camber issue like mine with the worn springs?
