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Old Aug 22, 2022 | 09:24 PM
  #16  
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I learned a long time ago that if you wait for the Next Big Thing®, you’ll be in the grave before making a move. There’s always something better on the horizon, which is the great part about living in such a fast-moving tech landscape.

For me, it’s all about whether the product fits my needs at the moment when a purchase makes sense. Ten years ago, EVs were niche vehicles that imposed a significant compromise for those who replaced ICE cars with them. Today, it’s the opposite where EVs are far more convenient for 99% of the average buyer’s daily use. That’s a bit lower for truck buyers, but still the majority in my opinion. Automotive NMC and LFC batteries are already demonstrated to last for the life of the vehicle while proving to be a relatively minor inconvenience for road trips along major routes. It only gets better from here.
 
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Old Aug 22, 2022 | 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Sous
Welcome to the FTE!

We appreciate you sharing your thoughts and comments with us. I too have been following the development of solid state batteries, mostly by Toyota. They have taken a strong business stance in filling for patents as they develop the technology.

I don't know if a consumer version of a solid state battery will be ready in 2025, but that is exciting to think about. Similarly, I had read about EV range being increased to the 500 - 550 mile range around 2025, so perhaps there is some insight there to ponder.

Today we went shopping and drove about 120 miles since we live in the country. As we stopped at a fuel station on the way out of town, it took me 198 seconds from the time I opened the door to the time I closed the door to fuel up to full from 1/8th tank. This brought the range of our 2016 Escape back to 450 - 500 miles.

I am not naive enough to think solid state batteries will get us to ultra fast (5 minutes or less) recharge rates in 2025, but it is a start.

Again, good to have you with us.
Thanks! Glad to be here. Ford and BMW (funny partnership) are now both board members of a solid state mfg company (bought in board members) as well has major stock holders, Both have stated the 2025 year, which is funny because that is the same year Toyota says it will bring out the hybrid with solid state bats. It looks like 2025 may be the magic year. Toyota (i'm sure you've read the articles) spokesman made a "slip-of-the-tongue" comment to Car and Driver, something along the lines of ",...2025 maybe sooner" Everyone picked up on the "maybe sooner" (it even effected trading). My take on it is Toyota has over 1000 patents on solid state bats, and has committed over 16 Billion dollars to the solid state mfg plant-I don't think they are still in development. That "aint" the kind of money one spends on a Pilot Plant! Ford is ready to "convert" to solid state, as soon as. My heart goes out to those guys buying wet tech, it reminds me of the old eight track tape/players. It really did not matter how good they were, when cassettes hit the market, you couldn't give an 8 track away (for those of us old enough to remember). I'm not one to "bet on the come line", but as Toyota has numerous prototypes driving all over Japan now, it can't be considered a dream of the future anymore, it's coming like a tidal wave. BTW, the Toyota solid state prototypes, 10 min charge (or so they claim). Ten minutes for me isn't a problem, plug in, get coffee, pay, done, Two or more hours would be a problem, for me, I can't speak for other people, but I'm sure I'm not alone.
 
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Old Aug 23, 2022 | 06:22 AM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Tom
I learned a long time ago that if you wait for the Next Big Thing®, you’ll be in the grave before making a move. There’s always something better on the horizon, which is the great part about living in such a fast-moving tech landscape.

For me, it’s all about whether the product fits my needs at the moment when a purchase makes sense. Ten years ago, EVs were niche vehicles that imposed a significant compromise for those who replaced ICE cars with them. Today, it’s the opposite where EVs are far more convenient for 99% of the average buyer’s daily use. That’s a bit lower for truck buyers, but still the majority in my opinion. Automotive NMC and LFC batteries are already demonstrated to last for the life of the vehicle while proving to be a relatively minor inconvenience for road trips along major routes. It only gets better from here.
Tom, your thoughts on waiting and being in the grave before attaining are wise. Although, finding that sweet spot between waiting, desire and availability is a trait that only the individual can decide on and learn. I worked in the IT world for over 15 years responsible for everything from keyboards to firewalls to servers across 12 networks at one point. In IT, the technology moves so fast that what you have mentioned is somewhat gospel.

We are fortunate enough in my family to wait to see what is the next best thing, all while evaluating the current best thing.

Perfect statement!

Originally Posted by Tom with my changed for your
It's all about whether the product fits your needs at the moment.
Right now, the KIA EV6 is the only EV that comes close, but there is still a shortfall for our needs and that is range. Either range needs to increase or recharge time needs to decrease. That is a product that fits our needs due to our use of vehicles. The "on the horizon" technology may be able to satisfy both or one of these "needs" in the next 2 - 8 years. We as a family are willing to wait for that. Your family or desire may not be and that is OK. I have no hard feelings for someone that jumps at a product that fits their needs, but I expect the same respect for our optimistic look toward future products that may fit our needs.

As always Tom, it is a pleasure to be engaged in a discussion with you.
 
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Old Aug 23, 2022 | 06:31 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by solidstate
Thanks! Glad to be here. Ford and BMW (funny partnership) are now both board members of a solid state mfg company (bought in board members) as well has major stock holders, Both have stated the 2025 year, which is funny because that is the same year Toyota says it will bring out the hybrid with solid state bats. It looks like 2025 may be the magic year. Toyota (i'm sure you've read the articles) spokesman made a "slip-of-the-tongue" comment to Car and Driver, something along the lines of ",...2025 maybe sooner" Everyone picked up on the "maybe sooner" (it even effected trading). My take on it is Toyota has over 1000 patents on solid state bats, and has committed over 16 Billion dollars to the solid state mfg plant-I don't think they are still in development. That "aint" the kind of money one spends on a Pilot Plant! Ford is ready to "convert" to solid state, as soon as. My heart goes out to those guys buying wet tech, it reminds me of the old eight track tape/players. It really did not matter how good they were, when cassettes hit the market, you couldn't give an 8 track away (for those of us old enough to remember). I'm not one to "bet on the come line", but as Toyota has numerous prototypes driving all over Japan now, it can't be considered a dream of the future anymore, it's coming like a tidal wave. BTW, the Toyota solid state prototypes, 10 min charge (or so they claim). Ten minutes for me isn't a problem, plug in, get coffee, pay, done, Two or more hours would be a problem, for me, I can't speak for other people, but I'm sure I'm not alone.
As I just wrote above in the response to Tom, our needs dictate that either range increases or recharge time decreases. The technology Toyota is developing shows great promise in one or both of those categories.

Another more modern analogy was the laser disc to DVD evolution... Same thing, you could not give those LD players or discs away.

As for BMW and Ford being in bed, business deals will bring about some interesting partnerships. After all, it is just business...


 
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Old Aug 23, 2022 | 01:43 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by Sous
As I just wrote above in the response to Tom, our needs dictate that either range increases or recharge time decreases. The technology Toyota is developing shows great promise in one or both of those categories.

Another more modern analogy was the laser disc to DVD evolution... Same thing, you could not give those LD players or discs away.

As for BMW and Ford being in bed, business deals will bring about some interesting partnerships. After all, it is just business...
Thanks for the response! You couldn't be more correct when you state, "...it is just business..". Job One at Ford (and all other auto mfg's) is Making Money. Your observation regarding the DVD situation is 100% correct; however, there is one addition I feel should be made, and I'm not discounting your statement at all, there were those people that knew of the 8track tape situation, the CD situation, etc. Before it happend, not years but 6 months in advance (yes, in some cases years), they paid attention to the markets, etc., then there were those that bought a "top of the line" 8 track player, paid for professional installation 6 months prior to the tidal wave of cassettes/players. The big difference between "those days" and today isn't so much the peoples mind set, but the WEB! It is much harder to keep new tech "secret" until it's unveiled. The best current example I can think of would be the 5G cellphone. Nobody paying attention would have purchased a "non 5G capable" cell, no matter how great the deal (huge discount) 6 months prior to the only thing available being the 5G, sadly there were those that did-if they had been alive and well during the "old days" they would have been one of those getting a "great deal" on a new 8 track.
 
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