some of you may remember the recent two plus week no spark battle you all helped me with - which was extended due to a bad new ICM from the zone. But I did get that straightened out.

But I'm having a pinging problem, when putting a load on the truck, heavy with the accelerator going up a hill, especially when engine is hot. Motor rattles like crazy. The pinging is a somewhat new problem - but it did start a few weeks before the ICM death had me hooked to a tow truck. Started maybe two months ago - could get it a little better with 93 octane, but was still there. Now it's unbearable.

I had a mechanic look at it today, he set the timing to 10 ( I had it around 12), and said it ran ok, but i guess he didn't get a good test drive, because it still pings. Talked to him this afternoon, and followed his suggestion to back it down to 8, to see if that would help. Took it for a ride, and it was perfect - but I had left the spout OUT. oops. Plugged the spout back in, now can't take it up a hill without pinging like crazy. Still has decent power - better than when I had it at 12 degrees -- but the pinging is brutal. No check engine light, or pending codes to be found.

For the life of me, I can not understand how it has so much power with the spout out. It must be advancing some other way. Or the marks on the balancer are off, and I'm already way advanced at idle. I'm tempted to just drive around sans spout for a few weeks, until I buy a new truck. But would like to get this running right again. In early April I took this truck on a 800 mile trip, and it ran flawless through the mountains of upstate NY at 70 mph. Now I can ping it to death on a 1/4 mile hill that rises 20 feet in elevation.

Tomorrow I'm going to confirm with the timing light that it's advancing with the SPOUT out. If it is, I guess I need to start tracing wire to see why the SPOUT plug isn't doing anything? Anything else I can check? Maybe ignore the marks on the balancer, and set timing with a vac gauge - does that work on a electronically controlled engine? And then try it with and without spout?

truck is a 96 f-150 w 302, 4wd. thanks.

 

There is no advance with the SPOUT out. There is no physical or electrical way to do that. I would not suggest setting the timing with a vacuum gauge, you need empirical values to set the baseline. Verify the balancer outer ring has not slipped. Set #1 cylinder to TDC then verify the timing pointer is at 0 degrees. If that is good I would look at fuel pressure under load next. Pull a few plugs to see what they look like.

 

yep, my guess that timing was somehow advancing without the SPOUT was no good. Put the light on it in the driveway this morning, with spout out it was at 8 degrees at idle, and didn't budge when I opened up the throttle. I don't know how this truck runs so good with zero advance, but man it was running fine last night without the spout in. And then like crap when I plugged it back in.

So I put the spout in, near 20 degrees at idle, and total advance in the 35+ range -- according to the marks on the balancer. Take it for a ride, same two hills that were pinging like crazy both runs yesterday - and not a peep, running fine. WTF. An occasional pinging problem? Yikes. I did notice that my spout plug doesn't really snap into place. Some previous owner of this truck must of had an issue with plugs& clips, because many of them are broken. Maybe it's coming in and out? Although not sure if that would cause a ping/knock.

Anything else that could cause an occasional pinging problem? I put the vac guage on the line to the EGR valve - it doesn't move at idle, and barely budges when I lay on the throttle. but it does move.

 

Around 20 degrees at idle and around 35 total advance sounds about right. I would try to verify that the marks on the balance are accurate. Find TDC on the compression stroke and make sure it corresponds to the TDC mark on the balancer.

 

plenty of videos on how to find tdc, they all use a tool threaded into the plug hole, and take half way between the point the piston reaches the top, and when it starts to drop. Is that the way to do it? or is that over complicating things - and for my purposes a thumb over the plug hole is enough?

 

1. Use a piston stop, in cylinder #1, turn engine slowly by hand until the piston contacts the piston stop and mark where the timing pointer is pointing on the balancer.
2. Turn the engine slowly by hand in the opposite direction until the piston contacts the piston stop and mark where the timing pointer is pointing on the balancer.
3. True TDC will be half-way between these two marks.

If you have an old spark plug, you can knock the porcelain out of it and tap it for a long bolt to make your own piston stop.

 

 

Check your grounds. That would be about the only thing that could cause the ignition advance on an electronic distributor to act funny intermittently, unless *maybe* you've got a bad PIP. But that's not likely.

 

I use a plastic straw or wooden coffee stirrer to find TDC. No need to use a fancy tool IMHO.

 

Yep. That works. However, "... half way between the point the piston reaches the top, and when it starts to drop." (stated by the OP, not by you) is not how to find TDC.
It is half way between where the #1 piston is all the way up on compression stroke and when the #1 piston is all the way up on the exhaust stroke.

Just trying to keep the OP from finding TDC in the wrong spot.

 

We all can spend hours typing in our favorite procedure. As for me I'll stick to my trusty straw/stirrer like I have for the last 50+ years. That does not make me an expert, it's just what I am familiar with and has worked many times.

 

I'm not disagreeing with your method, and I certainly meant no disrespect. I'm no expert either... and I don't have 50+ years of experience.

 

thanks. my 'half way' recollection was not accurate - I thought I remembered a video from when I was assembling my boat engine that did it this way, but no worries.

I was on my way to the nearby speed shop ( yep, we have ONE left ) to pick up a piston stop at lunch. the truck was running perfect, as much power as it ever had, nary a ping to be heard. Of course I didn't adjust or replace anything, besides jamming the SPOUT in as well as I could. So I skipped the speed shop and headed somewhere else. And now it's throwing codes, too lean bank 1 & 2, and one of the DPFE codes, about the hose being off or clogged.....Still running pretty good though

 

Like SFaulken said, check grounds, they are hid everywhere, see link post #2 -->Ground Points - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums

 

I'm afraid to say this, but I think everything is good now. i could not get the knocking/pinging to stop, to save my life, until I electrical taped the loose SPOUT jumper plug into the somewhat damaged clip. I probably need to replace the female end of the plug, but this should be fine for now. I'm going to trust that the marks on the balancer are accurate, as it seems to be running fine based on 10 btdc ( with spout out). Sits near 20 btdc at idle with spout in. I don't know if the tape job fixed it, but it's running fine now, for first time in a month.

The system too lean codes were due to a huge crack in the intake hose, I must have broke that taking everything apart so many times. Have some duct tape on there now, will start searching for a replacement.

thanks again everyone for your help. Probably giving this truck to my son in a few weeks, so hopefully you will all be able to help him as much as you did me!