Engine build ideas
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Cross-Country
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 57
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From: Kalispell, Mt
Engine build ideas
All,
I have been trying to find a roller 351w for my '95 Eddie Bauer, but they seem to be getting harder to find in my area. So in the mean time, I have a good 302 roller sitting in my garage. I am debating just building this to replace the tired motor I currently have. My goals are somewhat simple.... Decent power, maybe pull a small (<5000 lb) camper to local camping spots in the summer, and drive daily without killing me on gas. The truck currently has 3.55 gears and the 4R70W trans. I dont want to have to get into after market tuners just yet. The goals for the engine are I think reasonable.... I would like around 280-300 HP, and maybe 300 lbf of torque. Can this be reasonably built with a 302? Im not opposed to machining the block to .040 over, but would like to try and keep the build under $3K. I will be buying aluminum heads, unless someone wants to part with GT40's for a song. Just curious what folks would recommend so I can start saving for parts. Other things with the truck, runs 31x10.50 tires, I MIGHT go up to 33's down the road, but not sure. Installing a saginaw steering conversion and red head box later this month, and installing an electric fan conversion this summer. Thanks for any input everyone.
I have been trying to find a roller 351w for my '95 Eddie Bauer, but they seem to be getting harder to find in my area. So in the mean time, I have a good 302 roller sitting in my garage. I am debating just building this to replace the tired motor I currently have. My goals are somewhat simple.... Decent power, maybe pull a small (<5000 lb) camper to local camping spots in the summer, and drive daily without killing me on gas. The truck currently has 3.55 gears and the 4R70W trans. I dont want to have to get into after market tuners just yet. The goals for the engine are I think reasonable.... I would like around 280-300 HP, and maybe 300 lbf of torque. Can this be reasonably built with a 302? Im not opposed to machining the block to .040 over, but would like to try and keep the build under $3K. I will be buying aluminum heads, unless someone wants to part with GT40's for a song. Just curious what folks would recommend so I can start saving for parts. Other things with the truck, runs 31x10.50 tires, I MIGHT go up to 33's down the road, but not sure. Installing a saginaw steering conversion and red head box later this month, and installing an electric fan conversion this summer. Thanks for any input everyone.
FTE Legend
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: Ottawa, Ontario
That's not to hard to do actually, GT40 heads as they are with the Comp 35-349-8 and a full exhaust system(headers and a single 3") will make 300hp and 350tq, you just have to rev it to 5000rpm to get all of it so 4.10 gears would be a good idea... especially if you're planning on bigger tires. The same parts on a 5.8 would make for a higher and broader torque curve but a different intake would be required, while the stock 5.0 pieces are good to go with a little bit of porting to open up the exits in the lower where the ports meet the heads.
Is that truck MAF? If so this should run pretty well, I had the same combo(minus the heads) in my '90 with MAF conversion. If you can't keep the A/F ratios safe at higher rpms then there are a couple things that can be done without tuning to get by.
Is that truck MAF? If so this should run pretty well, I had the same combo(minus the heads) in my '90 with MAF conversion. If you can't keep the A/F ratios safe at higher rpms then there are a couple things that can be done without tuning to get by.
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Cross-Country
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 57
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From: Kalispell, Mt
It’s a MAF truck currently. Finding the heads has been an issue so I was thinking edlebrock aluminum heads, although I am not sure what ones I shsould look at. I was thinking 3.73 on the gears just because I commute 38 miles a day with it, and I don’t know that I need to go bigger than the 31s right now. I just got them and I am 95% totally happy with them.
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2020
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As an example I've built quite a few 289 engines for a local Mustang shop. Very mild engines using the stock heads, a 4 barrel intake, long tube headers and a flat tappet hydraulic cam(205-214@ .050 on a 108 lobe sep in on 107 .457-.476 lift). I use the stock replacement 5.0 pistons with the metric ring pack to reduce friction but nothing trick at all. They will make 275 horsepower at under 6000rpm and around 300lbs/ft. Your engine is a little bit larger so I think that it should be able to make 280, 310lbs. A hydraulic roller of similar specs runs about the same for HP but picks up about 15lbs/ft around the peak.
i always built these very mild because a lot of the time the cars get fitted with a 5 speed that has overdrive. I don't want the enigne to chug-a-lug if somebody puts it in high gear at 50mph. They seem to pull the gear great.
The only problem I see is that the compression ratio is pretty high. It runs well on premium pump gas but I'm not so sure how we'll it would do in a truck. I think for that application I would drop the compression ratio a bit and make the cam a single pattern. Maybe tighten up the lobe sep a degree to 107 and put it in on 105.
i always built these very mild because a lot of the time the cars get fitted with a 5 speed that has overdrive. I don't want the enigne to chug-a-lug if somebody puts it in high gear at 50mph. They seem to pull the gear great.
The only problem I see is that the compression ratio is pretty high. It runs well on premium pump gas but I'm not so sure how we'll it would do in a truck. I think for that application I would drop the compression ratio a bit and make the cam a single pattern. Maybe tighten up the lobe sep a degree to 107 and put it in on 105.
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Cross-Country
Joined: Mar 2020
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From: Kalispell, Mt
I need to look at cam options, I know they have been discussed at length and the info is here. My biggest question is on the heads. Without having to hunt half way across the country I have not been able to find GT40's anywhere nearby at a decent price. What is a good aftermarket aluminum head for this application?
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Cross-Country
Joined: Mar 2020
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From: Kalispell, Mt
Just using a factory head? I was hoping to avoid a bunch of machine work.... I think I could do the port and polish myself, but honestly raisng five kids, it would take me a year to get to.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2020
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In this application I just don't think that there's much to gain over a good valve job and springs set up properly.
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FTE Legend
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From: Ottawa, Ontario
Anything that isn't chinese junk and flows more that the stock E7 heads... which won't get you there.
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Cross-Country
Joined: Mar 2020
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From: Kalispell, Mt
I guess I’m a little overwhelmed with the options on summit. Are the flow tech (cheapest option) junk? Should I be hunting for a certain combustion chamber size? I know, it’s a lot of questions. It’s been way too many years since I have built any kind of motor, and most of those were motorcycle motors
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2020
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I guess I’m a little overwhelmed with the options on summit. Are the flow tech (cheapest option) junk? Should I be hunting for a certain combustion chamber size? I know, it’s a lot of questions. It’s been way too many years since I have built any kind of motor, and most of those were motorcycle motors
FTE Legend
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: Ottawa, Ontario
The stock E7 heads have 64cc chambers, 1.78/1.45" valves and flow about 155/105cfm as cast. This head will make about 275-280hp, if that is good enough for you then you are all set.
GT40 heads have 62-64cc chambers, 1.84/1.54 valves and flow about 22% better at 190/128cfm. The difference in the port sizes is noticable with these two heads side by side. This head will get you into the 300+ hp range for sure.
Most aftermarket heads for the Windsor start with 1.90/1.60" valves and are usually available with a range of chamber sizes from 58-64cc, for truck uses you want static CR that is close to stock or in the 9:1 to 9.5:1 range. Heads like the AFR165 or TFS170 flow 35-50% better than the E7, the Edelbrock Performer(is it still made?) is somewhere in between the AFR & TFS heads and the GT40. All these heads will make 350+ hp without trying too hard and 1.90" intake valves will not present any clearance problems with a relatively mild cam.
Any brand you have never heard of is likely a china import, these heads aren't good value, poor quality machineing and parts can end up costing you more to fix that it would have cost to buy a brand name domestically produced head.
GT40 heads have 62-64cc chambers, 1.84/1.54 valves and flow about 22% better at 190/128cfm. The difference in the port sizes is noticable with these two heads side by side. This head will get you into the 300+ hp range for sure.
Most aftermarket heads for the Windsor start with 1.90/1.60" valves and are usually available with a range of chamber sizes from 58-64cc, for truck uses you want static CR that is close to stock or in the 9:1 to 9.5:1 range. Heads like the AFR165 or TFS170 flow 35-50% better than the E7, the Edelbrock Performer(is it still made?) is somewhere in between the AFR & TFS heads and the GT40. All these heads will make 350+ hp without trying too hard and 1.90" intake valves will not present any clearance problems with a relatively mild cam.
Any brand you have never heard of is likely a china import, these heads aren't good value, poor quality machineing and parts can end up costing you more to fix that it would have cost to buy a brand name domestically produced head.
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2020
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The quality of the China castings usually is very high and the heads can work well overall if you're willing to spend time getting the valve job, stem clearance, bowl shapes etc in shape. With that said for what you're doing the stock E7 heads will work fine and will cost no money.
Tuned
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 349
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From: NW LA
Edelbrock Performer Heads...https://www.edelbrock.com/performer-...-90-60379.html or https://www.edelbrock.com/performer-...pet-60329.html, but I could not tell which one is better that is why I read these forums. _ Tony.
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Cross-Country
Joined: Mar 2020
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From: Kalispell, Mt
I really appreciate everyone’s input. I have to buy heads no matter what so if I can get a set that is ready to go, rather then a used set of E7s that need gone through anyway, the brand new set is the way to go for me. I need to keep my truck on the road while I build this motor so Robbing the current heads isn’t an option. The roller block I have doesn’t have heads on it right now.
Conan, what can would you suggest for this?
im trying to build this motor on the side while I finish an engine swap in the ‘99 I got for my son...... I am
Not a fan of the modular engines at all....
Conan, what can would you suggest for this?
im trying to build this motor on the side while I finish an engine swap in the ‘99 I got for my son...... I am
Not a fan of the modular engines at all....