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1990 f150
351w stock e4od stock
hello!
i am building my own efi system to run along side the stock one so that it will still control the tranny (e4od) and i can control fuel and eventually spark. ive been looking into the pip sensor (for like 12 hours straight) in our trucks and it seems like a hall sensor since there is a wheel with teeth ( i think i havent looked yet!) but at the same time it puts out ac current like a vr sensor. I need to know which one it is and how it works to tell my diy ems system. I get things quick and can build a motor no problem but i educate myself so i dont know MANY things. my questions are:
1: is this a hall of vr sensor?
2:This measures crank speed right?
on the wheel the pip sensor uses to get reference
3 how many teeth are there?
4 does it count every tooth or is it a missing tooth sytle?
5 whats Trigger angle - The angle of the crank, After Top Dead Centre (ATDC), when tooth #1 passes the sensor on the primary (crank) input ( i know our stock timing is 10 btdc and i dont know if this can be used to find it)
thanks in advance
Fords from early 80s to late 90s use Thick Film Integrated (TFI) ignition.
1: is this a hall of vr sensor?
The distributor itself uses a Hall effect sensor.
2:This measures crank speed right? on the wheel the pip sensor uses to get reference
Wrong. The Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) measures the cam location. Crank speed (RPM) would be a calculation done in the EEC.
3 how many teeth are there?
None, there are tabs, with one different than the others.
4 does it count every tooth or is it a missing tooth sytle?
It is a 'Hall Effect Sensor', no toothes or teethes to count.
5 whats Trigger angle - The angle of the crank, After Top Dead Centre (ATDC), when tooth #1 passes the sensor on the primary (crank) input ( i know our stock timing is 10 btdc and i dont know if this can be used to find it)
thanks in advance
You answered your own question. Your setting base timing to 10 degrees, that is your Trigger offset.
Advance and Retard is done by the EEC, that is why you always set timing to 10 degrees.
I am thinking the above is correct, I may be wrong, I've been wrong before.
1990 f150
when tooth #1 passes the sensor on the primary (crank) input ( i know our stock timing is 10 btdc and i dont know if this can be used to find it)
thanks in advance
You mention teeth on crank input, that would be a Electronic Distributorless Ignition System(EDIS).
Are you building an ignition system with a distributor or one without?
The part that triggers PIP, is called the 'Rotary Vane Cup', not a wheel with teeth or tabs. I has 'vanes'.
Here is a great image of the PIP being scoped(credit to www.corral.net forums):
I will be for now keeping the distributor and taking control of the tfi input from the ecu by using a speeduino set up. future plans are using Chevy ls coils and independently control spark.
Thank you everyone! this is the exact information i needed. however im still slightly confused. i read on the forums that the pip sensor signal was in ac voltage. hall sensor would mean it would be dc voltage right?
The signal in the PIP above is a square wave. We cannot determine if it is AC or DC because there is no reference to where 0-zero may be.
If the signal alternates positive then negative with zero in the middle, Yes it is AC.
If the lower half of wave is at zero, and the wave is all positive, then it is not AC.
Lets assume the wave goes from 0-volts to positive 5-volts.
This is not AC, since it does not go to negative(reverse polarity). This is also not DC, since it is not a constant voltage.
The PIP signal is a Digital Signal(Square Wave), since it has 1 of 2 states, it is either at zero volts or at 5-7volts, Off or On.
perfect guys! and all the graphs from the oscil help me. for now i think this thread will be done. i get my board in a week or so and will start to build my new ecu. i will make a thread in the builds section if anyone wants to keeps tabs. thanks alot
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