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I am going to be replacing my battery cables due to age and what appears to be melting casing. Will your common auto parts store 4 ga wire be sufficient? I see on my ground wire that it runs to a frame connection then continues on to the engine block. Is this a stock arrangement? I cant seem to find a cable like this. BTW the truck has had starter/battery issues when warm. Wont crank over even though it starts easily when cold. I have not done any voltage drop testing at this point, just figured it couldn't hurt to replace the 40 year old cables.
1980 F350 DRW 400 with single battery. Also, what is the wiring schematic for the starter solenoid? I only have one wire going to one of the small posts.
Will your common auto parts store 4 ga wire be sufficient?
No. My 96 Oldsmobile with a 3.8l v6 uses 4 gauge starter cables. The cables on my truck are 00 gauge grounds and 000 gauge positive; of course, I have a 6.9l IDI with 2 12V batteries in parallel. Get some good cables for your truck. Here are good suppliers for battery cables:
When did the cables on my 81 F100 with a 300 six I did use the auto parts store cables but when looking they had 2 different gauge cables, don't remember now what they were, I went with the larger.
Some will say hit a store like Tractor Supply as they will have better cable and can make them for you. I have not seen or even looked to see if this is so but worth a try I guess.
They also say hit a welding supply store and get welding cable. Only think I see wrong with this is you have to add battery ends and the cheap bolt on one are just that cheap and asking for issues.
Now it sounds like your ground is set up like mine was from the factory. The cable has a tab in the center to ground the frame and then goes to a starter bolt on mine.
I got a long cable cut the insulation away on the new cable took the tab off the old cable and put it on the new one so it looks and works like the factory one.
Now it is a lot of work to do that but I was going for a stock look on my rebuild and why I did it.
You could get a cable with a battery end & eye to the frame and a cable with 2 eyes from frame to motor ground to do the same thing.
New ground cable with tab installed
As for the starter relay yes some do only have 1 wire going to the small stud with the "S" the other is left empty.
You will also note that the side from the battery has all the smaller wires (fuse links) and is hot all the time.
The other side with the cable to the starter has just the starter cable and is hot only when the key it turned to start.
BTW I also replace all the battery cables as part of my rebuild and other than the crappy battery the truck came with I have not had any issues and why I did all cables.
Good luck
Dave ----
Some will say hit a store like Tractor Supply as they will have better cable and can make them for you. I have not seen or even looked to see if this is so but worth a try I guess.
Tractor supply or a big truck repair will have the right stuff. Auto parts stores (mostly) sell crappy imported generic cables in blister pacs made in you-know-where. Okay, I guess, for small 4 cylinders and stuff like that.
They also say hit a welding supply store and get welding cable. Only thing I see wrong with this is you have to add battery ends and the cheap bolt on one are just that cheap and asking for issues.
No no no, they often do this as a side business. They cut them to length and crimp the terminals and ring ends on 100% (the right way) they know exactly what they are doing.
Tractor supply or a big truck repair will have the right stuff. Auto parts stores (mostly) sell crappy imported generic cables in blister pacs made in you-know-where. Okay, I guess, for small 4 cylinders and stuff like that.
No no no, they often do this as a side business. They cut them to length and crimp the terminals and ring ends on 100% (the right way) they know exactly what they are doing.
Well I guess my little 4+2 cyl motor is ok with the crappy imported generic cables in blister packs made in you-know-where" LOL I did go for the larger of the cables does that count?
For me the hours I work and the "good" places only open 9-5 and closed weekends I had to go with the "crappy imported generic cables in blister packs made in you-know-where".
I will have to ask our truck parts mang. if they make battery cables or buy them pre-made? I am thinking the short ones at the batteries are bought.
Dave ----
I use the 4 gauge and the 6 gauge on all my cars and trucks and they work fine. It's not rocket science when it comes to replacing the cables you have. Just get ones that are similiar in diameter, they should work. For the ground cable, get one a little longer that you can route by the frame. Trim some insulation off, and see if you can re-use the old clamp on the old cable, Otherwise, see if you can find another clamp or make one out of a copper clamp from the plumbing section at lowe's, and clamp it down. Your other option is to forget the clamp, run the new ground straight to the engine block or wherever it went stock, and then buy another short battery cable, put both ground cables under the bolt on the block, and put the other end of the short cable to the frame.
Your other option is to forget the clamp, run the new ground straight to the engine block or wherever it went stock, and then buy another short battery cable, put both ground cables under the bolt on the block, and put the other end of the short cable to the frame.
I did this when I replaced my block to battery ground cable. Think I went 0 gauge on the main cable and used a premade 4? gauge from batt to frame. My local NAPA can make custom cables with crimped ends.
For me the hours I work and the "good" places only open 9-5 and closed weekends I had to go with the "crappy imported generic cables in blister packs made in you-know-where".
Fleabay! I can't find any better deals anywhere else really. Just type in "2/0 battery cables", there's a couple guys that sell them all put together in any wire gauge you want, crimped quality solid copper terminals and ring ends, delivered to your door. They are light years ahead of the scheisse sold in the parts stores.
I would add that since Ford used 6ga and 4ga cables on trucks like yours (different vehicles, different engines, different years, sometimes different size cables, but 4 and 6 were the most common I believe) they are "fine" for a basic replacement. Even a 6ga will get you home. It's just not that great if you're going to the trouble.
So I'm with the others saying go big and always recommend at least a 2ga cable. I say 2ga because they're readily available at the local parts stores and are a nice upgrade even if they are the cheap stuff. I'm not sure they're made overseas though, as some of the manufacturers still make the basic stuff here. But now Tedster has me thinking about it I'm going to have to check!
I have 1/0 on my '79 and 2/0 on my '71, but would not hesitate to use 2ga in a pinch and have on many others.
I make my own and also have bought specialty cables from the types of companies mentioned. Some use welding cable and those have worked out well too.
But I also still buy the "cheapies" at the local parts store (2ga), but I then run the good thick sealant-filled heat-shrink tubing on the ends to seal up the points were moisture can intrude easily. And then I even do something about the exposed conductor ends inside the crimped end where they go around the stud or bolt. Paint or di-electric grease or that nasty stuff they use to coat battery terminals. Whatever I can do to keep the corrosion at bay for more years.
This has worked out perfectly fine on many different vehicles.
You'll be happy you up-sized the cables.
And don't forget the additional ground. I like the store-bought ground cables because you can get them with the additional molded in 10ga "pigtail' ready to crimp a wire to extend to the body somewhere.
Ford had a body ground either clamped to a bare spot of the cable (earlier trucks) and by your '80 model were probably already using dedicated wires from the battery lug to the body in at least one spot.
Lots of people forget these when they install a new negative battery cable. It's important to retain them.
As said, you won't regret going even slightly larger. Going the route the others have suggested can be even more rewarding.
Even an expensive cable is relatively inexpensive in this day and age. Definitely cheap insurance!
One of the main body grounds that Ford used is from the back of the intake manifold or bellhousing bolt, to the firewall. The engine block is already grounded using the large ground cable, so they just ran from the engine block in the back to the cab firewall. The cab is mounted in rubber body mounts, so even if you ground the frame, it will not get a good ground.
Same with the frame. The priority and main thing sucking power is the starter. So it gets all of the large cables. That means the engine has a good ground, but it's mounted in rubber motor mounts, the transmission/transfer case mounts are rubber, even the rear leaf spring bushings are rubber. So the only way the frame is going to get a ground is going to be to run one from the engine block, or the battery itself. Like was mentioned, most of the time a 10 gauge wire would be good enough, the starter is the one taking all the power. But if you added a winch, a liftgate, or some other power hungry piece that is using the frame for a ground, you will need to upgrade your ground wire to the frame.
One of the main body grounds that Ford used is from the back of the intake manifold or bellhousing bolt, to the firewall. The engine block is already grounded using the large ground cable, so they just ran from the engine block in the back to the cab firewall. The cab is mounted in rubber body mounts, so even if you ground the frame, it will not get a good ground.
Same with the frame. The priority and main thing sucking power is the starter. So it gets all of the large cables. That means the engine has a good ground, but it's mounted in rubber motor mounts, the transmission/transfer case mounts are rubber, even the rear leaf spring bushings are rubber. So the only way the frame is going to get a ground is going to be to run one from the engine block, or the battery itself. Like was mentioned, most of the time a 10 gauge wire would be good enough, the starter is the one taking all the power. But if you added a winch, a liftgate, or some other power hungry piece that is using the frame for a ground, you will need to upgrade your ground wire to the frame.
My 300 six has a 10ga wire from the left side of the block to fire wall to ground the body and a ground from the fire wall on the right side to the hood.
Dave ----
