Ram pickup sales up 14% in Q3.

Ford pickup sales down 6% in Q3.

Nothing like a decreasing share of a growing market. Actual unit sales may be holding up, but only because the market is growing.

Ram even whomped Chevy again (but not if you include GMC numbers) 161,635 Ram units to 153,853 Chevy units.

Those of you who say "trucks are trucks" are being shouted out by the market, which is saying "I want my truck to do truck stuff, but I want a nice cushy ride and premium interior materials".

I have said many times before, there is no excuse for a $60k-$70 truck having an interior that would be embarrassing in a $20k car.

The market seems to agree with me.

And yes, I know that the "Super Duper, Diamond Coated Platinum F-150 and Super Duty have nice enough interiors. But Ford's XL, XLT and, to some extent, Lariats have interiors that would not pass a Rubbermaid QC inspector.

 

The truly embarrassing thing is, if you want a nice cloth interior, you are limited to one level above base trim. But the first leather trim tier is mostly "premium vinyl". If the Ford Lariat, Ram Laramie, Chevy LTZ, or GMC SLT trims offered a high-end cloth interior as a choice with the leather/premium vinyl, I would actually consider it. Instead, as someone who prefers cloth, I'm limited to Ford XLT, Ram Big Horn, Chevy LT, or GMC SLE - and usually blocked from some key options.

 

Speaking for myself... Q3 numbers doesn't surprise me. Just about every manufacturer has something new for 2020. The only person buying in Q3 is the one trying to get a 19' that's on sale. Regarding interiors - I've got an XLT. I also have heavy duty rubber floor mats, cloth seats (with covers) and a lined truck bed, because I have a wife, 2 dogs and we go camping every other weekend. Honestly, the interior is holding up pretty well for "vanilla". I'd hate to see what nice leather seats would look like after the dogs sat in them or scratched them up. Being an animal person, I prefer a heavy duty synthetic material if I can get it.

 

The Ram 1500 was out last year and no significant changes for 2020.

The F-150 has been out a couple of years with no significant changes for 2020.

The GM 1500s were new earlier this year with no significant changes for 2020.

HD trucks may be new(er) for 2020, but they are not the volume leaders.

Ram sales are helped by continuing to sell the older model at "modest" prices.

Trucks are trucks is one thing, but the strong pickup numbers the last few years is not because people such as yourself going camping, but because pickups have become the "second" car. These people could care less about massive towing and hauling numbers, as mulch from Home Depot is the heaviest thing the truck will ever haul. But these buyers do want all the creature comforts and a ride smooth enough not to spill their Latte on the way to work. My friend's wife has been driving a pickup for over 10 years. Never had anything heavier than a lawnmower in the back and has never even been hitched to a trailer.

Ram figured this out, and spent some money on the interior and gambled on the coil spring suspension.

GM put all its money into fancy towing cameras and trick tailgates, so the only thing that it could afford for the interior was recycled plastic. Fancy cameras are great, but personally, I might only use them once a year. A cheap interior, I have to live with everyday.

BTW - Have you noticed that the GM pickup commercials do not even talk about the trucks themselves? All the commercials feature is GM showing off the cameras and tailgates. No mention of engines, transmissions, interiors, etc. Just cameras and tailgates. It's like they are embarrassed for you to look at them.

Ford is sort of in between. Interiors not as cheap as GM, but not as nice as Ram. Ride and handling better than GM, but not as nice as Ram. Better powertrains than Ram and better payloads, but at the price of a rougher ride over the Ram.

Ford sales are still to be envied, but down YOY, while Ram's sales are way up.

Looks to me like the market has validated Ram's approach. Maybe Ford and GM should get on board.

 

The 2020 Ford Super Duty has a new 7.3L with more HP/Torque than the older 6.2L, the 6.7L Diesel has more HP/Torque and they're both mated to a new 10 speed transmission. But I guess that's not significant enough to mention.. LOL

 

If you read my post carefully, you would have seen this:

So once again, HD trucks are not the volume leaders at roughly only 25% of overall truck sales.

So about 75% of overall truck sales are 1/2 tonners, which have no significant changes for 2020.

 

I had an F-150 before. It was fun and sporty but it wasn't built like my F-250. That's like comparing a body builder to a power lifter. I guess for those of you (cough - jschira - cough) that have half tons, you can talk it up on your way to getting groceries. I'll be hauling my 5th wheel.

 

Second car for those who can afford such, but the reason crew cabs with very small beds have become the configuration leader for half-tons is simple: there are no more full-size cars. Crown Vic, Grand Marquis, the old RWD Caprice... the Town Car and deVille for the luxury buyers... and Chrysler hasn't had a full-size car in almost 40 years. People who remember those cars have nothing to buy today - except trucks. Lack of large cars is hurting those who need them... and livery services are really feeling it. The car service I use had a fleet of primarily Town Cars just 5 years ago. As the TCs died off, they went with Chrysler 300s. Now that the 300 is rumored to end soon, I was picked up last week in... a Nissan Maxima. Because that's what the owner told me is the closest in rear seat room and price to the 300s he had been buying, so he figured he'd try a couple.

But the family with the two high school three-sport players can't fit in those "midsize+" cars, so a half-ton crew cab with the 5 1/2 foot bed fits the bill.

 

I miss the day's of the land yacht cruisers. I've always had an affinity for big, boat like cars with 4 doors, a back seat that looks like the couch in your house and enough trunk storage for all your vacation luggage AND Jimmy Hoffa! My personal favorite is the 69' Lincoln Continental with suicide doors. I managed to get my hands on a 68' Mercury Monterery sendan - all original for about $4K and then had to restore most of it. The good news was it didn't take too much to make it a weekend driver. Had it painted, new tires, brakes, oil, plugs, etc - all the basics. Then it was a matter of elbow grease and driving it with the respect it deserved. The thing was so heavy, you could make a left turn - wait for the delay and then it'd turn. Like driving a bus. At highway speed, if you slammed on the brakes (drum), the tires would lock up (no abs) and you'd "slide" about 100 yards to a stop. All that aside, it was a dream to drive. Floated down the road like a big cloud. Great weekend casual driver.

 

If Ford goes the route of the Ram 1500 with rear coils and a car like ride, then I'll buy the last year that they build a truck before implementing the change.

You get what you pay for, you want a quality built truck then stay away from the Ram 1500. Or, pay for a stem to stern warranty that will cover you for 10 years or 150K miles. You'll dang sure get your money's worth out of that purchase.

 

That is what a lot of people say, at least on this very pro Ford board.

But statistical evidence is lacking.

For example, JD Powers scored the Ram 1500 within a point or two of the F150.

And Consumer Reports, if you choose to listen to them (which personally, I do not), scored the Ram "Well Above Average" in 14 of 17 categories and "Above Average" in the remaining 3 categories. The F-150 scored "Well Above Average" in 13 of 17 categories, "Above Average" in 3 of 17 categories and "Below Average" in the remaoning category.

 

I wish Ram all the success that they can muster.

 

Don't have a 1/2 ton (in fact, if you bothered reading my signature, you would have seen that), but have owned a Ram 2500 and 4 F-250s, a 1997, 2000, 2010 and 2016. I needed them, (cough, cough) to pull my 12,000 trailer.

And you make a good point, despite the inflated tow ratings, a gasser 1/2 ton does not pull like a diesel 3/4 ton, not at 10k lbs. and above. That is why I have a Titan XD Cummins to pull my trailer. Personally speaking, the "mine is bigger" diesel war between Ford, GM and Ram is stupid, as 310/555 pulls my heavy trailer effortlessly. In fact, my 2000 F-250 with 275/525 had no problems at all. If I had a complaint, it was the 4R100. You either got 2000 RPMs or 2800 RPMs, nothing in between.

Of course, none of this has anything at all to do with the sales decline at Ford and the sales increase at Ram. But an interesting discussion.

 

do you still have that 80s truck with the 300 six?

 

No. Sold it to a buddy's dad, who drives it everyday.