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My ZF6 clutch change adventure thread

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  #61  
Old 02-16-2019, 02:44 PM
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So close to being ready to drive - interested to hear your impressions, Wesley. My only clutch R&R experience is with a 2WD '87 toyota p/u, a 4-speed mated to a 22R. Many recognizable parts and steps from what you did, but oh man, what a difference in heft and complexity with the 1 ton 4x4 beast!
 
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:46 PM
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Drove it home! No phones at the dinner table rule is in effect tho. Will update later
 
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Old 02-17-2019, 09:57 AM
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So Saturday morning after working my 12hr shift friday night night i continued my futile search for 12m 1.75 bolts to use as alignment guides when stabbing the transmission. Needless to say finding metric anything sucks. Especially long enough bolts. After 2 hours i finally found 2 bolts 1/4" longer than the OE mounting bolts and decided to call that good and quit wasting assembly time looking for the unicorns.

Got to the farm, brought in my bag of goodies, and remembered i didn't grab my boost leak detector, aka 3" pvc cap. Oh well, add it to the list for tomorrow.

So first up was chucking the M12 1.75 x 100 bolts in the lathe and cutting the hex heads off and into a round end. Then cutting a groove in the end to be able to use a flat screw driver to remove them, and ran them into the transmission mounting holes in the engine block about 1/2" deep


Bolts with hexs turned down

Next up was putting in the new updated clutch fork


Original on the left, new updated South Bend on the right

Added a touch of synth grease to that silly plastic pivot bushing and snapped it in place on the bellhousing, then some grease to the shoulder of the fork where the throwout bearing would go and slides back and forth a little in it's travel, snapped the fork onto the pivot, and wiped a dab of grease on the back of the TO bearing shoulder and slid it onto the input shaft sleeve and into the fork


Hey look! Thats what a TO bearing should look like

Triple checked that it was time to finally stab the transmission, cleared all the tools and loose bolts from under the truck, and swept everything clean from the jack to the front axle with a shop duster. Next we took a chain and ran it thru the front tow hooks and down under the front axle, hooked on the come along and hooked onto the transmission jack. Then we rotated the jack's wheels the correct direction to roll it forward to the engine, cranked on the come along and eventually that heavy sum bish started to roll forward. Then we slowly guided the jack forward about 3 feet till the bellhousing was about 1 inch from the clutch pressure plate then up up and away it went. Cleared that stupid firewall pinch weld by a good inch this time.

Lined up the guide bolts with the bellhousing holes, and rolled it forward by hand. Once we felt the input shaft splines make contact with the splines in the friction disk i grabbed the output shaft and spun it back and forth till i could feel the splines were aligned and we rolled it forward till the input shaft sleeve made contact with the pilot bearing. We kept watching the gap between the bellhousing and engine block (stupid spacer messing with the veiw) to figure out whether to push or pull the rear of the tranmission left or right, and raise or lower it from the transfer case. Once we had the gap down to 1/2" we knew the sleeve was halfway into the pilot bearing, so we grabbed the 4 mounting bolts and started sucking them up a little at a time. The longer 4 bolts go on the sides, shorter 2 bolts up top. Once we could see the ends of the guide bolts poking thru the end of the bellhousing we removed them and replaced with the 2 long bolts. Eventually the bolts were all snugged up so the transmission and engine were married again.

Easy words to write or read, but that above paragraph took about an hour and a half, possibly 2 hours.

Then i started removing those bolts 1 at a time and putting locktite on them and grabbed the torque wrench and made them officially secured.

Next up while i was torqueing the top bolts thru the shifter hole in the cab (yay for a beaten up pinch weld!) Dad reattached the transmission cooling lines, so when i finished with the wrench i added an extra quart of synthetic ATF thru to the top of the tranmission thanks to a suggestion by @Sous

Next while dad reattached the transfer case shifter and ZF6 shifter i jumped up on the passenger side battery and started reattaching the intake piping and 6637 air filter.

Once the shifters were on we put everything in Neutral, then we lifted up the rear driveshaft and bolted up the carrier bearing, then grabbed the 12 point bolts, spun the output shaft to line up the marks i had made on the driveshaft and started to put locktite on the bolts. That's when i saw it. Red. Those stupid bolts had red locktite on them. No wonder it so freaking hard to bust them loose! So, rolled out for red loctite, and came back to torque those dudes down.

About that time dad's phone app for the Ring doorbell chimed and we saw mom had returned with pizza from Casey's. After generous amounts of soap n water to our hands and my face, we sat down for a few slices and reminiscing comparing the ZF6 job with the ZF5 on dad's OBS, the Corvette, and the 1971 F100 we had done together. I shouldn't have sat down. Realized i had been awake and after it pretty hard here or at work for the past 25 hrs, and that it was getting hard to keep my eyes open sitting there after a slice. I think we chatted some but can't really remember. I remember waking up 3 hrs later tho.

Found out dad had managed to put on the crossmember, bolt down the transmission mount, remove the jacks, put on the starter, plug in the reverse light and transfer case position sensor, and reattach the front driveshaft on his own while i was out.

Not to be outdone by a 65 year old, i got up and went back to it. Reattached the cooling fan shroud that had somehow managed to pop up and out of the bottom tab on the passenger side, put some loctite 223MS on the top mounting bolt, and did the same to the new DS shroud bolt. Thanks @brian42 for taking the pictures of that bolt. While i did this dad rolled under and bolted on the inspection plate

Double checked every clamp and bolt up top, and rolled back under and inspected the progress i had missed. After i hooked up the starter wires dad reattached the batteries, and i started moving tools out from under.

Started getting texts asking how long till I'd be home for dinner. Soon dear, soon

After eveything looked good, and the only loose bolts found were the old pressure plate and flywheel bolts i rolled under again to individually inspect everything that had been touched in this journey. Got up top and checked over everything under the hood, even checked the oil for the first time in months. Yay to a clean & dry valley! Sat inside and worked the shifter thru all the gears, almost brought a tear to my eye after driving dad's 5speed OBS. Put the transmission in neutral, and then shifted the transfer case in neutral as well just in case the clutch wouldn't disengage for some reason. Cycled the glowplugs till the vaccum pump shut off and fired it up for the first time in too long. Ahh the sweet sound of HUEI injectors! Shut it down and rolled jacks out from behind the truck, opened the shop door. Flipped out the mirrors and got back inside and fired it up. Went to back up, nothing. Hmm, Low gear? Nothing. Nothing in any gear. What the heck? Doh. Reached down n yanked the transfer case into gear out of neutral. Put it in reverse and things worked much better this time.
Felt like a tractor clutch. Firm gripping, solid holding. After the truck was out of the shop we led the 2 Great Pyrenees dogs inside and shut the shop doors then opened up the big cattle gate and rolled out to the street. Shut the gate, let the dogs outside, handed dad keys to his truck and said see ya at church in the morning. Got back inside and went for a slow cruise down the road getting a feel for this fancy new clutch. Very solid, but not what I'd call grabby. By the time it got to the highway oil was at 140, why not switch tunes & see how the new turbine wheel does? Grr, new clutch. Better not beat on it yet... Headed home for dinner.

So initial thoughts are, remove the pedal spring. It pulled the clutch rod out of my 6 month old master cylinder on the way home.

Shifts soo smooth, hard to describe the difference in the OE flywheel/clutch and this setup, kind of like the stock one felt like a big spring compressed/engaged after a shift, this one feels like other old school clutches I've driven. Engages solid, no springy feeling in the shifts or bouncing felt thru the shifter handle.

Barely any gear whine in low rpm turns! Not sure if it's the clutch or extra quart of fluid.

I wouldn't call it grabby, i have that with the Corvette clutch. It's defiantly a nice solid engagement tho, didn't try and slip the clutch or anything, just get it home for dinner.

No road noise heard thru the floor. Guess that sound deadner helped a bunch. Well i guess i know it helped, i turned the radio down one volume bar.

Can't really comment on the KC drop in turbine yet. Gotta get some break in miles on the clutch before i test out the high boost #s and work it. Like when i tow a new 12,500# 5th wheel home for 3 hrs later this week...

Gotta head to church n lunch catch ya after some miles
 
  #64  
Old 02-17-2019, 10:33 AM
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You'll definitely feel that trailer behind you. Great job on the clutch and various updates.
 
  #65  
Old 02-17-2019, 05:02 PM
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Well brethren, if this 5"11" 148# lil guy can change the clutch with tranfer case still attached to trans, using only harbor freight tools (minus my Kobalt torque wrench) with help mostly just lowering and raising the transmission for safety reasons, you all should be able to handle it too if the need arises
 
  #66  
Old 02-17-2019, 07:44 PM
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Not grabby, but very solid and inspired confidence is how I would describe the SB clutch too.

It has not let me down one time and I pulled our 12K lbs 5th wheel across the country with it.

Nicely done sir!

Let me know your thoughts on the pedal feedback once you remove the spring, I was thinking of doing this as well, but my winter modification session was put on hold.

I look forward to your follow on updates.

 
  #67  
Old 02-17-2019, 07:49 PM
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Great work Wesley! Very nice write up and pictures. Thank you for the time and effort it takes to put this all together.
I feel like I could tackle this job myself after seeing your posts here.
Reps sent.
 
  #68  
Old 02-17-2019, 10:40 PM
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Well, the initial 50 miles tells me i either have a boost leak, or the much heavier turbine wheel spools up slower than stock. Haven't really had it above 2200 rpm tho, or under a real load. Making 2 less pounds cruising 60 on hwy. Will have more to report on that later.

Clutch is noticeably different/better than it normally was tho. My actual friction surfaces were in excellent shape on original clutch, really just the grenaded TO bearing, and worn fingers that were bad in the last 2 months of driving, so it's not like i was replacing 150k mile $0.15 spark plugs with new $$$ exotic metal ones and it magically runs better mainly due to new parts.

Unfortunately i can't be 100% certain the insulation helped or not, the black shift boot's plastic base fell apart and crumbled on reinstall, so depending on what gear I'm in and how well the inner and outer boots line up over the hole for that shift the noise level changes. Been sliding the black boot into position on longer stretches of road to block the engine noise. New Motorcraft boots "should" be here day of or after i leave to pick up trailer. If it isn't here b4 i'll probably wrap a large towel around the boot for the long drive. Think I'll try n put the original white boot under the new one that comes with the new black one for extra insulation. From what i can tell when it's all lined up well there is less road noise, but it's too soon to officially recommend it for certain to you all.

Now for ibuprofen after mounting up that heavy 5th wheel hitch and changing out tailgates
 
  #69  
Old 02-18-2019, 02:54 PM
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I can tell you for certain that the white and black boot reduce noise and heat dramatically if they are in good shape and installed properly.

 
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Old 02-18-2019, 06:10 PM
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So before i attempt it, since I've actually never read of it being done before, boost leak test (pause for effect) on the uppipes? In my head its the same concept as the pvc cap on post CCV turbo hose.

Remove EBP tube on passenger side manifold, attach fittings, remove 1/4" npt EGT probe on DS manifold, attach fittings, run 2 air hoses to 50g compressor set regulator to oh, 60psi, spray soapy water/simple green on manifold to uppipe connections, uppipe to collector, collector to turbine housing. Thoughts?
 
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Old 02-18-2019, 08:18 PM
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I think it'll blow out of the exhaust pipe.
 
  #72  
Old 02-18-2019, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Wesley Green
Well, the initial 50 miles tells me i either have a boost leak, or the much heavier turbine wheel spools up slower than stock. Haven't really had it above 2200 rpm tho, or under a real load. Making 2 less pounds cruising 60 on hwy. Will have more to report on that later.

Clutch is noticeably different/better than it normally was tho. My actual friction surfaces were in excellent shape on original clutch, really just the grenaded TO bearing, and worn fingers that were bad in the last 2 months of driving, so it's not like i was replacing 150k mile $0.15 spark plugs with new $$$ exotic metal ones and it magically runs better mainly due to new parts.

Unfortunately i can't be 100% certain the insulation helped or not, the black shift boot's plastic base fell apart and crumbled on reinstall, so depending on what gear I'm in and how well the inner and outer boots line up over the hole for that shift the noise level changes. Been sliding the black boot into position on longer stretches of road to block the engine noise. New Motorcraft boots "should" be here day of or after i leave to pick up trailer. If it isn't here b4 i'll probably wrap a large towel around the boot for the long drive. Think I'll try n put the original white boot under the new one that comes with the new black one for extra insulation. From what i can tell when it's all lined up well there is less road noise, but it's too soon to officially recommend it for certain to you all.

Now for ibuprofen after mounting up that heavy 5th wheel hitch and changing out tailgates
It should come with a new white piece if you bought the whole shifter base assembly.

https://shop.broncograveyard.com/Sup...yABEgKk1PD_BwE

Interested to hear more about the turbine. I took mine out for a real drive today after putting it back together yesterday and it seemed to have a lot more power, but I went to a van turbine housing, 5/5 billet wheel and the KC/SXE turbine all at the same time so any comparison to the stock truck turbo wouldn't tell much. It spools fast and moves the truck in a hurry if cruising along at 1500 rpms or so and lay into it. I don't have a boost gauge but do have a finely tuned butt-o-meter.
 
  #73  
Old 02-19-2019, 05:31 AM
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It's odd, reviewing yesterday's log the MAP is either 2psi above or below the EBP, but it takes about 4-5 seconds at a set rpm to build boost. Once it builds it's there. Very laggy. Not sure if it's the heavier wheel, or a leak. Switched from "stock" tune to DD and got on it, and cue the coal rolling for a few seconds. B4 it had a very light haze if at all, built boost at 1600rpm, now it's a Dodge with stacks. Have zero boost below 2k rpm now.

I can't tow heavy like that. Gotta find the smoking gun

No butt meter will tell you Boost #s or EGTs while towing....

And part # F81Z-7277-BB is the one i ordered, i'm saying i would trim the clip ridges off my OE white boot, and put it under the white boot on the new one to double it up
 
  #74  
Old 02-19-2019, 07:10 PM
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That doesn't sound right. It does warn against using it with a stock compressor wheel but you have a billet one right? Very laggy...wastegate issues? Leaks...maybe if the up-pipe collector wasn't seated right but you'd probably hear something amiss. I have a leaking outlet-to-downpipe connection and it makes quite a bit of racket under heavy throttle, but that is post turbo at least.
 
  #75  
Old 02-19-2019, 08:04 PM
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Yeah the billet 4+4 i run is probably the lightest possible wheel to even have mounted. Probably a good thing since that turbine weighs more than twice the original.

Wastegate is very closed. Did the "7 turn" mod but did 9 turns years ago.

Won't be off work during daylight till Thursday to look for soot on uppipes, will do boost leak test then too. Then maybe swap TS6 chips. Then debate swapping back to original turbine to see if it all gets back to normal before the tow
 


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