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I think you are referring to the 4 1/2" starter that ford used on the big blocks which had the solenoid attached. They did indeed use a jumper between the battery terminal and switch terminal. However they were conventional starters with field coils. The PMGR starter works a lot differently. A jumper wire used on these starters will make them hang engaged because as the starter winds down it will act like a generator and produce current which backfields through the solenoid. There have been other posts that will support this.
I think you are referring to the 4 1/2" starter that ford used on the big blocks which had the solenoid attached. They did indeed use a jumper between the battery terminal and switch terminal. However they were conventional starters with field coils. The PMGR starter works a lot differently. A jumper wire used on these starters will make them hang engaged because as the starter winds down it will act like a generator and produce current which backfields through the solenoid. There have been other posts that will support this.
And the PMGR starters installed on the 7.3 IDI's were done exactly as posted. Yes they will stay engauged for like an extra second or so but that is it not different than hanging on the key for an extra second..
If you want to switch the starter solenoid then wire from the I terminal on the relay to the starter solenoid and use that as the switch It is an easier as you just run one wire down the existing battery cable and it's more reliable Yes you can double lug if you have the IGN stud occupied.
Do NOT use the main relay contacts as the switch. The contact area is large and does not scrub clean it needs the high draw from the starter motor to insure proper continuity.
Who ever did the PMGR wiring to utilize the main contacts initially did it WRONG, it created more work than was necessary and made it LESS reliable.
Below is the proper way to do it if you want to utilize the existing start relay to switch the starter solenoid.
I agree that it will work that way. However if you’ve ever taken a Ford solenoid apart you’ll find that the contact for the I terminal is much too small to handle the pull in current reguired on the pmgr starter solenoid. The I terminal is there to bypass the ballast resistor on a conventional ignition system. I still agree with the first wiring diagram
I agree that it will work that way. However if you’ve ever taken a Ford solenoid apart you’ll find that the contact for the I terminal is much too small to handle the pull in current reguired on the pmgr starter solenoid. The I terminal is there to bypass the ballast resistor on a conventional ignition system. I still agree with the first wiring diagram
I have, that "I" stud contacts same plate as the main contacts that is why it is copper in quality relays it is more than cable of 30 amps. Which is less than the starter solenoid draws.
And the PMGR starters installed on the 7.3 IDI's were done exactly as posted. Yes they will stay engauged for like an extra second or so but that is it not different than hanging on the key for an extra second..
If you want to switch the starter solenoid then wire from the I terminal on the relay to the starter solenoid and use that as the switch It is an easier as you just run one wire down the existing battery cable and it's more reliable Yes you can double lug if you have the IGN stud occupied.
Do NOT use the main relay contacts as the switch. The contact area is large and does not scrub clean it needs the high draw from the starter motor to insure proper continuity.
Who ever did the PMGR wiring to utilize the main contacts initially did it WRONG, it created more work than was necessary and made it LESS reliable.
Below is the proper way to do it if you want to utilize the existing start relay to switch the starter solenoid.
You have it almost right!
Move the red cable that is on the starter from the stock relay to the other side of the relay that the batt. cable is on.
Then run a 10 a. wire from the large post you just removed the starter cable from on the relay and run it to the starter where the yellow wire is connected to.
That is the way you wire a PM starter and the way my drag car is wired and I never had any run on of the starter.
Dave ----
I checked and the switch wire is definitely getting voltage from the starter relay. I removed the wire from the starter and The starter did not crank Below is how it is wired on the starter relay? Am I missing something?
Ok lets start on the left side of the relay.
You have 3 cables hooked to it where do they go to? BTW put something around that nut & bolt connection before it shorts out and burns your truck down.
You have 3 wires, purple/red/black on the S lug where do they go to?
Nothing on the I lug that is ok
1 wire, red, on the large lug on the right side where does it go?
Once we know what each cable & wire does we can then guide you what needs to be done but as a guess it has to do with 2 of the 3 wires on the S lug.
Dave ----
ps: did you follow my wiring post above on how to wire a PM starter?
The three large cables on the left Terminal of the relay are the starter, the battery, and the alternator.
The three wires on the S terminal are the electric fan coming from the relay, the solenoid power wire, and the ignition power wire coming from the Neutral safety switch. The ignition switch is not connected at the column, as I am still trying to figure out what each wire is.
The red wire on the right side is the switched wire on the starter.
As far as something to cover the nut and bolt connection, I assume you are talking about my fuse on the alternator Cable? If that is the case, have a cover for it. Right now I don't have anything connected to the battery, I just touch it off or hook it up when I am testing something. I will make sure its covered before I am actually starting the truck up.
You should only have 1 wire on the s terminal of the pictured solenoid and it should only be hot in the crank position
^^ What he said ^^
Originally Posted by Gigemags05
The three large cables on the left Terminal of the relay are the starter, the battery, and the alternator. You are ok with all them
The three wires on the S terminal are the electric fan coming from the relay, the solenoid power wire, and the ignition power wire coming from the Neutral safety switch. The ignition switch is not connected at the column, as I am still trying to figure out what each wire is. As KH said there should be only 1 wire on the S lug and it will only be hot when the key is turned to start all other wires need to find another home.
What does the fan wire do? If it is power to the fans it has to go on the batt lug side. Either way not on this lug.
What is this solenoid power wire? Is this hot only when the key is turned to start and if so that can stay other wise remove it.
Or is this ignition power wire coming from the NSS the hot key to start? I can see this from key to NSS to the S lug.
The red wire on the right side is the switched wire on the starter. can stay.
As far as something to cover the nut and bolt connection, I assume you are talking about my fuse on the alternator Cable? If that is the case, have a cover for it. Right now I don't have anything connected to the battery, I just touch it off or hook it up when I am testing something. I will make sure its covered before I am actually starting the truck up. Ok but I think I would still have it covered even now, don't want it to short out.
See my answers in red above but it has something to do with the 3 wires on the S lug.
Dave ----
The fan wire is the power to the fan. The fan is wired as shown below. Do I need to move it to the lug with three wires already on it? I guess I can move that to the battery itself. Also, yes the neutral safety switch goes from ignition to neutral safety switch to solenoid and is only hot when the ignition is turned to start. I honestly am not sure what the solenoid power wire does. It may be an unneeded wire and could be the culprit here. I am new to wiring and the harness I am installing has solenoid power on it so I thought it needed to be on that lug. Could it possibly need to be on the same terminal as the switched starter wire?
Alright,
I removed the solenoid power wire and the issue went away. Now I just need to figure out where that wire goes and what its function is.
**Edit** From a little more research it looks like the red "solenoid power" wire is not needed in this instance. It serves the same purpose as the switched wire from the starter to the battery. They just run it through their harness for some reason (according to what I am seeing).
Ok that fan wire needs to be removed from that lug. DO NOT put it on the batt side lug!
What they want is a spot that is hot when the key is turned on / run. The S lug is only hot when key turned to start. Find a fuse that is hot when key is in run and hook the fan wire to it.
That other solenoid power wire I don't know what it is. Remove it also as I don't think it is needed being you have the NSS wire to power the solenoid.
Once you have the wires fixed as above you should be good with the starter working as it should.
Dave ----
Thanks again for your help. I’m still a little confused on the fan wire though. All the diagrams I’ve seen are like the one above and show the switched fan wire from fuse block going to the relay and another wire going from the relay to the battery. Doesn’t the relay break the circuit when the ignition switch isn’t in run?
Thanks again for your help. I’m still a little confused on the fan wire though. All the diagrams I’ve seen are like the one above and show the switched fan wire from fuse block going to the relay and another wire going from the relay to the battery. Doesn’t the relay break the circuit when the ignition switch isn’t in run?
Yes it does break the circuit at the key but that is not how you have it wired.
That S lug ONLY has power when key is turned to start it SHOULD NOT HAVE power any other time.
You need to find a circuit on the fuse block that has power when key is in run as that is what that fan wire needs.
I also don't know what that other power wire is for so I would unhook it too.
Dave - - - -
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