Nope, completely untrue when said ratings are based on marketing instead of physics. There are plenty of examples of this. How about a SRW F350 that's ordered with the 10k GVWR package. It's 100% physically identical to the SRW F350 with the full 11.5k GVWR. How important is that rating? How about a 2016 F250 with the camper package that is 100% physically identical to a 2016 SRW 350 but yet rated 1.5k less? Bottom line is certain ratings are marketing based and mean absolutely zero physically and therefor mean nothing when considering safety.

 

Perhaps the Dodge dually driver went on the hitch OEM forum to get validation that his 9.5K rated hitch was "good to go" pulling that 15K 5er.

 

I could chime in here captcolour, but Rodney has you under control. I may be back later.

 

No, he's just a dangerous DA who drives a dually thinking the world is A O K because all his ratings exceed his payload. I don't know the full story but trailers don't fall off hitches just because they want to. Short of some statistically impossible mechanical failure, that event happened because he didn't hitch properly or he didn't maintain it properly. THAT is dangerous behaviour. According to your previous definition of safety, you would have been completely happy driving behind him when his fifth wheel fell off.

You're not paying attention and are ignoring the valid points about towing safety. Simply spouting off that being overweight makes a person dangerous is a stupid oversimplification of the realities of towing. Why ignore the far more effectual things like stated above? It looks silly when someone stands there stamping their feet with eyes closed and hands over ears saying, "Door stickers are number one!"

 

I am also in the camp of watching the axle and tire ratings and not the published GCRW. Trucks have been way underrated for years. I have driven about 800,000 miles towing high end fivers and gooseneck trailers loaded with equipment over the last 15 years all over the country, and have never had an accident (or even a close call).

 

Ok......gotta do it!!!!!🤠🤠 Ya better watch out!! The internet camper cops are gonna get you guys saying that the 250 is OK!!! The next thing ya know, your insurance won't pay if you are over the ratings!! Somebody's grandma's uncle's husband's boyfriend was overloaded and was in a wreck and the insurance found out and did not pay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Have a great day, folks!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Ok campers...check my math....weighed the truck today:
(Full tank of gas, loaded normally, all numbers include my butt in the seat, 5th wheel hitch NOT included and would be added to kingpin weight for final determination)

Total weight: 7945
Rear Axle only: 3140
Front Axle only: 4820

Stickers Show:
Payload: 2178
Rear GAWR: 6340
Front GAWR: 5200
Listed GVWR: 10000

Tire are rated at: 3750 lbs x 2=7500
Wheels rated at: 3590 lbs x 2=7180
Spring pack = 6340
Rear Axle = 6200 (per the spec sheet) (have seen higher numbers posted on this forum)

Based on the above and up for discussion: First, the the spec sheet number for the rear axle is BS...the published number on the truck for the Rear GAWR is 140 lbs over the spec sheet. Let's assume the axle will support at least 6340 lbs (most likely much higher.) That means the spring pack is the next lowest, which can be improved by use of multiple add-ons, easiest of which is air bags. So the true limiting factor is the wheels at 7180 lbs.

Let's go back and revisit the GAWR (and here is where you get to check my math). Using the weighed rear axle weight and subtracting from the sticker Rear GAWR, 6340-3140=3200lbs, which should be my max king pin weight! After adding wife and giant dog, max king pin would be 2950 lbs. Correct? Now, assuming that the rear axle is at least rated the same or higher than the wheels at 7180 lbs and the addition of air bags, I could push the limit to 3790 lbs. The biggest unknown is how much of the king pin weight is transferred to the front axles, I wouldn't expect it to be much at all.
As stated previously, my max intended king pin would be 2450 lbs, with me, wife and dog (and maybe a bag of Funyuns).....The math appears to check out that this is safe, even though it conflicts with the payload sticker on the door.

Thank you to all who have replied, I greatly appreciate your input/concerns.

Regards,
Eric

 

Eric, as Josh pointed out earlier in your thread... your rear axle is rated to 9750#.

 

Rodney,
I believe that to be true....I was trying to be conservative to show that there is plenty of room and no point in going any higher than 7180 lbs. Makes you wonder how conservative the other numbers are?

Eric

 

I don't think it's a safety issue at all at the weights you're taking about. Personally I only worry about liability. It's very easy to get into a silly crash and the other person can argue it wouldn't have been as bad if you weren't over the legal limits. There's not a lot of defense there since it's your responsibility to know beforehand the rated weights.

Can the truck do it, sure. Are you comfortable exposing yourself to that liability, that's just a personal perogative.

 

The OP lost me when the words "5th wheel toy hauler" and "F-250" were in the first two sentences. I agree the truck can easily pull and stop this load with some extra air bags, however, we see these threads all the time where buyers, for some silly reason, won't spend an extra 1.5% of the purchase price to buy a 350 instead of a 250. I've got far better things to worry about than the liability of getting in a crash and being technically overloaded. I've personally driven overloaded a few dozen times, but certainly didn't enjoy the experience, so I know the feeling. Yes, you might save a few bucks in registration depending on what state you live in by driving an F-250, but I'd rather enjoy the driving experience not spend the entire drive knowing I'm again, "technically", over the limits and will be found culpable and negligent by an astute attorney in the event of a crash, whether or not I actually caused the crash.

For the trailer the OP is looking at, an F-250 should have never been considered. Can we start a sub-thread titled, "Wish I'd bought an F-350?"

Adam

 

No need for the "Wish I'd brought an F-350" thread...

- Price difference between the F-350 and F-250 had no bearing...I can easily afford either
- Don't care about the registration fees difference...in fact didn't even know till after I purchased that there was a separate category
- Biggest factor in selecting the F-250 - daily ride quality

I have lost count of the number of 1-ton trucks that I have owned, both SRW and DRW. We test drove 3 different F-350s, and yes, due to the fact that the great state of California spends our tax dollars on everything but repairing the roads, we did notice that the ride in the F-350 was stiffer. Granted, the 2017 F-350 was softer than the 2016 F-350, but both were noticeably stiffer than the F-250. We purchased this truck for 90% of the time as a daily driver and 10% of the time for towing.

As to "overloaded", that is the whole point of the math, to prove it isn't. Do you believe every label??? Why do you bring plastic bags home from the grocery store, they are clearly labeled that they can cause suffocation!!!! How can you let such a killer loose in your house??!! Ford clearly had ulterior motives for undervaluing the tow ratings on the F-250 in order to meet registration/certification in various states. The whole discussion is based around what the truck is safely capable of, not, can it tow the monster 4000 lb king pin toy hauler. I am willing to accept the risk assessment of slightly "exceeding" the artificially low yellow label while remaining within the physical capabilities of the truck.

As to the lawyers, they can, and will, sue for any reason (do you ever drive over the speed limit?) I prefer to make informed decisions based on factual, supportable data, not live in fear of the ambulance chasers. What a sad way to live if every decision you make is based on "will a lawyer sue me for this?"

 

Look, everyone, or at least nearly everyone, agrees that the truck can do the job. I know it's a silly door sticker, but try explaining your decision to LE or the prosecuting attorney. You are going to lose 100% of the time, based on Ford's factual data, trying to defend why you were knowingly overloaded (again, based on that silly door sticker). Do you think OTR truckers get a pass when they are 100 lbs overloaded?


Unfortunately, the practical and legal answers are intertwined here. If you have had countless trucks, how have you become so sensitive to the best riding 1 ton truck Ford has ever produced?


Do what you want, but the general consensus is that you should have bought the F-350 and if you've had countless numbers of previous 1 ton trucks, how did you not know this before you bought the truck?

 

Any why would you be here asking inane questions when you've already made up your mind?

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EXACTLY what Tricon said.