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Old Apr 21, 2017 | 01:01 AM
  #16  
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I have an Excursion, and I bought the 5 piece set of stainless from Russell from Amazon. It made a noticeable difference in pedal feel over the 16 year old stock lines. I don't know if the same kit works for a pickup but I'd think it would.
 
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Old Apr 22, 2017 | 03:11 PM
  #17  
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Thanks for all the help and suggestions so far. Here is where I am today. I already had the wheel off, caliper off, bracket off, and rotor off. So I put the bracket back on and used that to bolt the caliper to. I then applied pressure to both pistons with my c-clamp vise grips. With pressure as tight as I could get, I opened the bleeder valve as suggested. Very very little brake fluid came out, leading me to believe the issue is within the caliper and not the hose itself. Correct me if I am wrong.

Next, I need to decide if I can use the existing pads and rotor. It did get hot enough to smoke, but I tried to let it cool before returning home, approx 5-6 miles back.

Lastly, a few weeks ago the ABS light would not go off, had it scanned and came back the left sensor was faulty. Do not know how this would be an issue, but I will need to replace it anyway.
 
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Old Apr 22, 2017 | 04:23 PM
  #18  
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Lastly, a few weeks ago the ABS light would not go off, had it scanned and came back the left sensor was faulty.
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Could be that the sensor is dirty. I had the light on after my truck sat for a long time, but after driving it a few miles all was good.
 
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Old Apr 22, 2017 | 04:49 PM
  #19  
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Thanks for the thought on a dirty sensor. I have read about that and watched videos on the way to test. So I tried to test both sides. Seems I can get a higher reading from the passenger side. I pulled the driver side and there was a glob of grease on the end. Probably from greasing the bearings through the abs sensor hole. I cleaned it off and reinstalled. The reading didn't seem to change but I am having a hard time keeping the meter probes in the sensor plug and I don't have the alligator clips. I'll try again in a bit when my frustration level goes down.
 

Last edited by 00Dave; Apr 22, 2017 at 04:51 PM. Reason: Spelling
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Old Apr 22, 2017 | 11:30 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by 00Dave
So I put the bracket back on and used that to bolt the caliper to. I then applied pressure to both pistons with my c-clamp vise grips. With pressure as tight as I could get, I opened the bleeder valve as suggested. Very very little brake fluid came out, leading me to believe the issue is within the caliper and not the hose itself. Correct me if I am wrong.
With the pistons clamped tight, when you opened the bleeder the pistons should retract into the caliper due to the clamping force. The clamp should have become loose anyway. If the pistons are stuck then you have your problem.

Originally Posted by 00Dave
Next, I need to decide if I can use the existing pads and rotor. It did get hot enough to smoke, but I tried to let it cool before returning home, approx 5-6 miles back.
I'd do new pads since it's apart anyway. Inspect rotor for cracking or checking, that's a mortal wound. Spots of discoloration can be from heat or cementite adhered to the rotor. Both can be cleaned up with a brake lathe but often new rotors are so cheap people don't bother resurfacing them. Post a pic of the surface for some second opinions.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 07:30 AM
  #21  
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In the OP a severe shaking was mentioned, that tells me that the rotor is warped, cementited, whatever it is and I'd just go for a new one like aawlberninf350 says...unless you're good with trying that one and taking it apart again if it is shot.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 08:33 AM
  #22  
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Thanks for the feedback on the pads and rotor. The rotor doesn't really look discolored. The pads have a lot of life left in them so I think I'll at least give it all a try. I can always take it apart and replace them.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 08:39 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by aawlberninf350
With the pistons clamped tight, when you opened the bleeder the pistons should retract into the caliper due to the clamping force. The clamp should have become loose anyway. If the pistons are stuck then you have your problem.

This assumes that the pistons didn't move while the clamping force was applied. More likely than not the act of clamping pushed everything open and retracted the piston.
I'd do new pads since it's apart anyway. Inspect rotor for cracking or checking, that's a mortal wound. Spots of discoloration can be from heat or cementite adhered to the rotor. Both can be cleaned up with a brake lathe but often new rotors are so cheap people don't bother resurfacing them. Post a pic of the surface for some second opinions.

Just to clear up some confusion. Cementite is a solid phase of cast iron. It's not adhered to, nor can it be easily removed from the rotor. Without annealing the rotor and then re-heat treating it, it's not going anywhere. You can cut the top layer off and smooth it out on a brake lathe. But without taking some serious mass off the rotor your unlikely to achieve lasting results.

To understand what a phase of a metal is think of a good knife. It holds a great edge yet it's flexible enough that it never shatters leaving you with a gaping wound. The reason it does this is because it's differentially hardened. The edge is harder than the back. The knife is the same steel throughout. But the steel molecules are arranged differently on the edge than the back. These would be two different phases of the same steel.

Secondly resurfacing of brake rotors is nearly never effective once they feel "warped". Again because at that point your problem with Cementite goes deeper than you can safely remove from a rotor.

Resurfacing of a "good"rotor only works if the lathe operator is able to effectively balance the cuts from the inside to the outside of the rotor and ensure that each side has a similar thermal mass to the other side. If one side gets thinner than the other, you now run the risk of the rotor heating and cooling unevenly. And you risk cracking. The surface finish left by the operator can also play a role in the performance and longevity of the rotor. Find an operator that hogs 20-30 thou off​ at a time and I'll show you micro cracking and other surface defects that will eventually lead to macro cracks or, you guessed it, Cementite.

.


Originally Posted by 00Dave
Thanks for all the help and suggestions so far. Here is where I am today. I already had the wheel off, caliper off, bracket off, and rotor off. So I put the bracket back on and used that to bolt the caliper to. I then applied pressure to both pistons with my c-clamp vise grips. With pressure as tight as I could get, I opened the bleeder valve as suggested. Very very little brake fluid came out, leading me to believe the issue is within the caliper and not the hose itself. Correct me if I am wrong.
.
Even with a bad caliper and bad hose a c clamp tightened as tight as you could get it would easily generate enough force to break everything free and invalidate your test, vice grips is too much pressure too. In hind sight, what you should do is take the wheel off when the brake is locked and then crack the bleeder. It may seem like adding pressure is a good idea but that's false logic. A very gently hanging brake will generate heat and wreck a rotor.

When you hit the brake pedal, depending on the system you could have hundreds or thousands of psi pushing the Pistons out. But when you let go the retraction force is very small, likely under ten pounds for the first. 001-.002" of travel. Remember the only thing pulling the piston back is the square cut washer trying to find it's way back to it's relaxed state.

In short if your dead low on cash resurface the rotor and roll the dice. Maybe it'll last another 50k. More than likely it'll start shaking again in 5-10k. But hey, I did it after dumping 65k cash into a forclosed home to make it livable. (Happy wife, happy life; unless your brakes fail and you die) But I wouldn't recommend it to anyone that had enough coin left to go guilt free grocery shopping without coupons.

And on a side note my rotor lasted about 5k after resurfacing, and the braking power was never what it should have been. Truck always pulled to one side under heavy breaking. (Cementite has the lowest coefficient of friction of any cast iron phase) Then it started pulsing again under normal breaking. And now I have all new rotors, pads, calipers, soft, and hard lines; for the entire truck sitting on a shelf waiting for the day I get my leg out of a cast and can install them. Excessive, maybe.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 09:31 AM
  #24  
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Thanks for all that information Joe. I'd like to do it all at once too, but here's the situation. I am currently in the middle of a remodel on a new to us house. Then will need to do a remodel on current house to sell. So just figure an average income for where I am and then consider double mortgage, bills, etc. So if I can squeeze life from what I have that'd be great. And your info at least makes me believe I can a little. And I don't know if they'd turn these rotors because they are drilled/slotted. They were more expensive. And just like the pads, they were pushing $90. So yeah, I'd like to get a little more out of them.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 09:43 AM
  #25  
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And let me revisit the c clamp test. They had pressure on the pistions and when I opened the bleeder valve very little fluid came out. The clamps didn't loosen. They remained tight. I couldn't see the pistons on the caliper move at all. Usually when putting on new pads and clamping you can see the piston go in. Now I'm no expert on brake systems that's why I am asking for input but it seems the caliper is stuck?
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 09:50 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by 00Dave
And let me revisit the c clamp test. They had pressure on the pistions and when I opened the bleeder valve very little fluid came out. The clamps didn't loosen. They remained tight. I couldn't see the pistons on the caliper move at all. Usually when putting on new pads and clamping you can see the piston go in. Now I'm no expert on brake systems that's why I am asking for input but it seems the caliper is stuck?
I would say, "yes, it is stuck", it should retract fairly easily.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 09:53 AM
  #27  
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Put a pair of channel locks and try to compress the caliper. You should have to squeeze pretty hard, but you should feel the piston slide back into the caliper. You will want to secure the other piston with the c-clamp otherwise you will just push it out.

On the other hand, if you're able to compress one piston and the other one doesn't move... it's a pretty good indication you found the bad one.
 
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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 12:20 PM
  #28  
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If you have a c clamp tightened on the piston and release the bleeder screw, you're only gonna get a small amount of fluid. The c clamp isnt spring loaded so the instant you release pressure through the bleeder there isn't any pressure on the piston.
 
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 07:40 AM
  #29  
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Ok, thanks for the description on the pressure. I just know I had the clamps really tight and couldn't see the piston move at all. I know something is wrong for sure.
 
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 12:10 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by 00Dave
Ok, thanks for the description on the pressure. I just know I had the clamps really tight and couldn't see the piston move at all. I know something is wrong for sure.
Just want to make sure you know that if the pads were relatively new, that the pistons would have very little travel before bottoming out in the caliper.

But I do believe you when you say they didn't move at all. Annndddd...... Ding, Ding, Ding, You're the winner of the worst stuck piston of the week! Your Fabulous prize is a round trip, self payed ticket to the local auto parts store; where you will have the option to shell out your hard earned money to......buy a new caliper!

They don't often get stuck that bad, but they sure can. On a side note I assume you had to pry / or beat this thing off the rotor, right? If you didn't it may have released before you'd gotten to it, again bringing the test into question. In 15 years of driving crappy cars and old trucks I've pulled out of fields I've only had one caliper that was stuck so bad it wouldn't move at all. It wouldn't come off the rotor with a 12lb sledge. It eventually came out when it was red hot from the oxy torch getting beaten by the sledge.

While your there it would behoove you to replace the rubber line with the capiliper. If money is tight the rubber ones are cheap at NAPA. I know it's more upfront cost but if you've got two houses to remodel it's well worth your time to know you're not taking that wheel off again anytime soon.

Also for safety sake check all the steel lines on the truck while your clothes are still dirty. Even if you don't live in the salt belt, brake fluid is hygroscopic and readily pulls moisture out of the air; eventually rusting your lines from the inside out. On that note it's a good practice to change out the brake fluid yearly or every other year.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out!

Joe
 
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