Following this thread as it grows and progresses. Recently started a new job that has me commuting between 65-70 miles each way for work 6 days a week. Debating between a new superduty and an eco-boost f150. Good to seem many positive reports with trucks well over the 100,000 mile mark..

 

Sub'd due to interest in topic...

 

How do you like the new ridge grapplers? Are they noisy? Been looking at them recently.

 

I am new to these emission diesel engines. Looking at buying a 2012 F250 w/ 6.7. What are the deletes you guys are talking about?

 

Hi the new diesels all have more emissions which inlude, a diesel particular filter on the exhaust, and with that also have d.e.f that is added very once in a while to clean the d.p.f. out. The deletes are to take these off as thee have been know to cause most o the drivablity issues with any new diesel ford cev dodge all same. If a sensor issue happens it can shut whole truck off to save the dpf. I have had this happen became oe nox sensor thought the temp was to high. It hut e right off grrr, an after it was fixed a few months late I kept getting the code for a sensor issue and it was goin to be 450 $ fr the part plus at east a hr diagnostics at ford. So instead of doing that and a having more issues. I got a delete kit and had it deemed, te main expense of a dElee kit is the tuner . That tells computer it's ok to run with out the dpf ect. I I'd full determine in Ludington egr Cooler.

 

Not true - DEF (diesel exhaust fluid) is injected to react with a catalyst and reduces oxides of nitrogen (NOx).

Otherwise, mostly true.

Common-rail direct injection, fully computer controlled, reduces emissions substantially on its own compared to older, mechanically-controlled diesels or even those using hydraulic-electronic injectors, such as the 7.3/6.0/6.4 Ford diesels. Common-rail diesels are actually probably more reliable than the older HEUI designs.

A large EGR cooler is part of the emissions package. On the 6.7L engine, it sits right on top of the passenger side valve cover. Electronics control a valve which dictate when some of the exhaust gasses are diverted, cooled, and then re-introduced to the air intake for re-burn.

EGR coolers have been a problem in the past, but those on the 6.7L seem pretty reliable. The valves are on the hot side, reducing sticking and failures. The cooler itself is fairly easily accessed, can be taken apart and cleaned, or simply have the core replaced. Not the expensive nightmare it used to be.

The exhaust "aftertreatment" system includes the DOC (Diesel Oxidization Catalyst) which is basically like a regular car's catalytic convertor. It reduces some pollutants by a catalytic reaction. It also serves to function as a heat-increasing device during regenerations.

Next up is the SCR system (Selective Catalytic Reduction) which is where the DEF (diesel exhaust fluid) is injected. A special injector is mounted on the top of the exhaust aftertreatment system where, at certain times, it sprays a "dose" of DEF into the SCR portion of the tube. Inside the SCR tube is a catalyst agent and a twist-mixing tube where the exhaust gas and DEF can mix and react. The 6.7L trucks will have a separate DEF tank (5 gallons on 2011-2016 trucks) with the filler next to the diesel fill. The 5 gallons should last 5,000 miles or more, depending upon usage of the truck. DEF freezes at 12F, so the tank itself as well as the line over to the injector is heated electrically. There is a pump inside which supplies the injector. The same pump reverses direction after the engine is shut down to suck all the DEF out of the line and back into the tank to prevent freezing from splitting the line.

The last portion of the aftertreatment tube on the exhaust is the DPF, or Diesel Particulate Filter. It is basically a matrix which traps unburned diesel soot particles as it flows down the exhaust. This filter is what eliminates any smoke from coming out of the tailpipe, as well as fine particulate you cannot see, and reduces the smell as well. However, the DPF can only trap so much particulate matter (PM) before it begins to plug. A plugged DPF will prevent the engine from running, so it is critical to clean it as needed. This is done in the form of "regenerations) or regen for short. A regen utilizes extremely high exhaust gas temps to burn off the PM trapped in the filter. The burnt PM mostly is now so tiny or gaseous that it flows out the exhaust; the remainder of the burnt material falls as "ash" to the bottom of the DPF. Ash eventually accumulates to the point of needing the remove the DPF for cleaning or replacement, usually at 120 and 240k miles, respectively.

Regens can happen naturally, if exhaust gas temps (EGT) becomes high enough through heavy engine use (towing a heavy load up a steep hill, for example). However, the typical method is called an "Active Regen" in which the computer determines the DPF plugging. An active regen injects additional diesel into the engine cylinder during the exhaust stroke. There is no combustion in the engine - rather, ignition occurs in the DOC and creates artificial exhaust gas heat. An active regen may require driving for 20-40 miles at highway speed to fully complete. Obviously, extra diesel is used, lowering fuel economy, and this is probably the most hated part of modern emissions.

"Deleting" is a popular procedure to remove and reprogram the vehicle's emission control equipment. It is 100% illegal, but in states that do not inspect emissions for heavy pickups, it is very unlikely to be a problem.

To delete, the entire aftertreatment tube is removed from the exhaust system and a straight pipe is installed in its place. The EGR can be removed as well, but this is optional. In any event, an electronic tuner reprograms the engine computer to tell it to no longer attempt any regenerations, and no longer inject any DEF fluid.

Typically, a deleted engine will have slightly more power and achieve better fuel economy.

Hope this was helpful.

 

Wow, that reply is awesome. Thank you very much!

Does a dealer do this delete or would I need to find someone else?

 

Does the system still need the DEF after the delete or does it run without any?

 

Cowboy most dealers won't delete unless your out of warranty. I just caled around ro a couple local diesel shops and gt pics. I entered with the sct livewire ts which gives me gauges to monitor things. The sct x4 is another tuner that is popular but isn't used as a monitor. The rest is hich size exist and muffle or no muffler, and if just want to block the egr or take it off completely. Te one shop wanted 3hrs labour just to take erg Cooler off. Then mother shop only cared me 4 hours labour for whole delete. I went with 4 inch from downpipe back my 2012 was only 3,5 inch from downpipe to dpf. And I chose to o with a muffler I got the m.r.b.p full exhust. This makes it sound like deisel again, but still quite compared to Older diesels like a 7.3 was stock.

 

Any guesses as to how much this could cost?

 

Troverman, great post. Lots of people don't understand how the systems work. The one thing I will add is that the DEF does lower the amount of EGR needed. This helps both power and MPG. The Cummins 6.7 gained over 10% fuel economy and more power when it finally went to using DEF.
I deleted for reliabilty only, I did gain about 1 mpg combined hwy/city, 15 to 16 mpg, this is a 2011 F450 with 430 gears so I am very happy with that. Stright hwy might be 17+ mpg.
As far as cost goes, the programmer with the delete tunes start at about $750 and go up to $1500. I went with the SCT Livewire TS+ with custom tunes for about $950. The a delete pipe which only teplaces the emission section of the exhaust is $200 to $300.
I have not yet deleted the EGR valve, but will as soon as I have time. I plan on leaving the EGR cooler on the truck.
if you are handy with a wrench, or have a friend that is, all this can be done in 4 hours or less. No special skills required. Except for the EGR delete, the fasteners can brake easily

 

Cowboy my cost to do full delete was 2500$ I'm in canada so the tuner was 1500$ of that, if you look online you have to look for race tuner that says it can delete. Alot of the rest depends on shop rates for labour. Another shop wanted 3000 and another 600 just for the egr delete.

 

Once again, thanks for the info. Thanks for the time you spent bringing me up to speed. Have a great new year!

 

A dealer would be a fool to perform a delete...it would be a violation of Federal Law. However, it is easy and you can do it yourself.

Once the delete is done, no DEF is needed.

 

FYI, my truck sits at 134,500 right now but I'm headed out the door to do a 2500-3000 mile week. Can't wait to feel 6° when I get to Kansas.