Still trying to get my E450 to start. Going through the No-start checklist in the Tech Folder. Some simple questions:

This work included an EGR delete. I left the valve sitting on the intake plugged in to the harness. Could that make it not start? Should I take off the blocking plate provided with the EGR delete kit and reinstall the EGR valve?

Could a leaky EGR delete blacking plate cause a no-start?

I'm assuming that since I register oil pressure on the dash gauge and ICP sensor exceeds 500 that I'm getting adequate pressure to start. Is there anything I could have done in re-assembling the new oil pump (omit an o-ring, have one fall out, bung up a gasket, not tighten cooler to upper housing enough, etc.) that would still allow OP to register/sufficient ICP but still not start?

How can I tell if something is draining my batteries while it's sitting overnight? The batteries are supposedly good according to multiple load tests, and I charge them fully, but if I don't leave the charger on, they're weak the next day. Is is the batteries, a power leak, a bad charger, a bad starter, or something dragging on the engine? Even fully charged, it seems I can't crank too many times before it's weak. But, I haven't been cranking too many times since it doesn't start and nothing is changing about that and I don't want to burn up a FICM.

How many times/how long should I be able to crank with newly full batteries?

How many rpms should I be able to crank with full batteries?

To be sure, my no-start isn't because of bad batteries, I'm pretty sure since I've had them fully charged and have seen rpms over 300.

I haven't removed my IPR since I get 14.8 at KOEO and no where near 85 while cranking. Could it still be causing a no start?

While disassembling, I broke tabs off a couple of connectors to sensors on the top of the engine (not sure their names), but they seem to be snugly connected now and all my SG gauges are reading as well as a good Vref. Could they still be causing a no start?

Could something have fallen out of the fuel regulator housing when I removed it during disassembly? Had to take off all the fuel lines. Maybe there's a ball bearing or float or something in one of those ports that fell out when I set it aside?

I posted the pic of that plastic piece that came off my ICP sensor pigtail. Truck doesn't start with the pigtail disconnected so I don't think that's my problem. Could I be wrong?

I'm getting cam sync and FICM sync, and not getting any codes, although the truck has not run since the batteries were disconnected for a long time. Does that suggest a chafed harness is not the problem? Would codes show up just from cranking?

 

Are you getting fuel to the upper bowl? do you have any way of measuring fuel psi?

 

Thanks for responding. definitely got fuel in the bowl, fills up just fine. haven't tried to measure pressure since it was running fine before the work. My garage is in shambles due to moving. Not sure where my pressure gauge and fittings even are. Guess I'm being a bit lazy but this Eseries is a beach to do anything on. just trying to access the regulator enough to hook up a gauge would be a lot of work - not even sure I could do it without taking off/leaving off the upper CAC housing, oil fill tube and both CAC tubes. Hoping fuel in the bowl means that's not the problem.

 

Have to run do something (at work), I'll try to be back later

 

my gut says it's something electrical/sensor related. I had to move all the harnesses out of the way, which meant a lot of twisting and pulling in this Eseries. Had to disconnect all the sensors, most of the injectors. On the other hand, if I crank long enough, the truck kinda sorta tries to start and will sputter for a few seconds after I let off the starter, which does sound like a fuel issue from my old gasser days. But these diesels are a whole different game.

 

Woohoo, thanks.

I'm assuming that since I register oil pressure on the dash gauge and ICP sensor exceeds 500 that I'm getting adequate pressure to start. Is there anything I could have done in re-assembling the new oil pump (omit an o-ring, have one fall out, bung up a gasket, not tighten cooler to upper housing enough, etc.) that would still allow OP to register/sufficient ICP but still not start? Are you reading ICP_DES or ICP_V? If ICP_V is over 1.45V then (assuming the sending unit isn't messing up) HPO is fine. It should at least TRY to start if the PCM is seeing 1.45V, meaning coughing, spitting, smoke, some sign the engine is fueling. If it's not fueling at all and ICP is over 1.45V, likely not the problem


I'm not sure. It's the IPV command on my SG. Reads 0.23 KOEO, then goes up as I crank. After about 5 seconds of cranking just now, and right after the engine started sounding like it was trying to start, it was at 1.64.


How many times/how long should I be able to crank with newly full batteries? Based on cranking after major work to refill the HPO system, at least three 30-second cycles with rest periods in between

To confirm, this is how long it should be ABLE to crank, and not how long I should NEED to crank in order to refill reservoir, delete air, etc? I've not ever let it crank as long as 30 seconds, probably not more than 15, being fearful of burning up starter, FICM, whatever. And probably never cranked it more than 3-4 times in one session. Yet, I'm still ending up with weak batteries seems like. Not almost dead, just kinda weakish. For example, should it reach 150 rpm immediately? It doesn't - takes a few seconds to build up to that.

To be sure, my no-start isn't because of bad batteries, I'm pretty sure since I've had them fully charged and have seen rpms over 300. 300rpms cranking with a stock 6.0 starter seems high to me? 6.4 starter only bumps up to ~220rpm. Even compression while cranking?

OK, I only recall seeing that one time early on, and my SG wasn't working well at the time. Now, I'm not getting much over 165.

I haven't removed my IPR since I get 14.8 at KOEO and no where near 85 while cranking. Could it still be causing a no start? Could, but if ICP_V is in the correct range IPR shouldn't peg to 85%. If you do an air leak test and get the IPR fitting to do it, you can inspect and bench the IPR valve at that time. Bad answer for an E-Series though

Well, the IPR is a whole lot easier to remove on this Eseries with the doghouse off than an Fseries. And I have the socket. Just haven't done it since my IPR readings were fine. What the heck, I should check it out.


CMP or CKP

I assume these are the cam and crank PIDs. Since I'm getting sync, I think these are fine. Didn't mess with them to replace cooler, unless inadvertently pulling on them while moving harnesses out of the way.




Could something have fallen out of the fuel regulator housing when I removed it during disassembly? Had to take off all the fuel lines. Maybe there's a ball bearing or float or something in one of those ports that fell out when I set it aside? Maybe, but it'll run on really low fuel pressure. It seems like you'd see signs of fueling versus just flat cranking

I think I am. It sounds like it's trying to start after a long crank (after about 5-7 seconds, and continuing until I let off the key), and I guess actually starts if sputtering qualifies. If it were a gasser, I'd think it might be getting some fuel but not enough. Not sure if there is really that "in between" stage with diesels.

Based on what you've told me, I'm going to crank it much longer - up to 30 seconds. Is that a risk of burning up the FICM?

 

I think all my ICP_V values were wrong. PC-ED manual has 0.85V = 580psi, so roughly the reading you have to see to commond the injectors to start. No idea where I pulled 1.45V from, that would be more like 1800psi, but IIRC that was the spec for something.

You might actually have a fuel pressue issue if it sputters. That means the FICM is commanding the injectors to fire and they aren't putting out enough fuel. Or the injection pressure is jacked up and the pulse width isn't right, this could be because the ICP sensor or pigtail is messed up, but then it should start when it defaults with no HPO reading.

Right, ABLE. I was using that example because it's the most common reason I see for long repeated cranking. Fresh batteries should be able to give you at least three 30-second intervals without going flat. Probably more, but if you can't even get that the batteries through that then they might be going flat. Mine spins up pretty quick, it doesn't take time to build up to RPM really.


The link I found to the FICM guide was broken, not sure if you've seen this:

 

When you come back in the morning with that 8a charger hooked up all night, you need at least a 25a btw, is the glow plug module warm? If it is there is your current loss.

 

So this 8amp charger is useless? That would make sense, it certainly seems useless.

I just ran out and felt the GPCM. Stone cold. The charge is plugged in but the green light is on like it's fully charged. It does that all the time after leaving it connected a little while. I unplug it for a few seconds and the green light finally fades out, then I plug in again and the yellow charging light comes back on. I'm going to run to WM and get a bigger charger.

 

Do you have a voltmeter first?

Can you take a picture of all 4 battery terminals?

 

So that 1.64 value I'm getting after a long crank should be fine?

This last time I cranked, it hit 160rpm pretty fast. I'm going to get a better charger, but I'm still thinking I got enough juice that this should start.

I just gave it a longer crank. Still didn't make 30 seconds though. After it gets to the sputtering point another few seconds of cranking it kinda has a little knock. Not like a crank bearing or something, but it changes sound, and quits sputtering as much.

The other thing is after that longer crank, some smoke comes out of the engine. Not billowing smoke, more like it's just rising off the engine. Between holding the key and looking at the SG, I can't/haven't noticed where the smoke comes from. Since the engine isn't starting, it can't be oil residue burning off. And without fuel, it can't be exhaust I wouldn't think. Wouldn't that mean fuel or coolant? It comes from towards the front of the engine, not from the exhaust there at the rear where I'm sitting.

Off to WM for a charger.

 

Yeah seems fine, it means the PCM is seeing sufficient ICP to start the engine the IPR is regulating since it's between 15 and 85%.

 

Here's the battery terminals. I have a cheapo voltmeter somewhere. Dang GF cleans up and puts stuff who knows where.

 

Hmm, went to WM and the local auto supplies. Most of the chargers are no better than the one I got. I did see a 15a and 12a charger, but nothing at 25a. They all put higher numbers in big letters about "starting amps" and "booster amps" but the smaller numbers are for charging. Gonna look online.

 

Hold on the charger, but with your vehicle situations somewhere you need more then 8a. I get by with 25a

Ok so there terminals and cables at that end look pretty good. The reason for the voltmeter is so you can see the drop in voltage during your cranking time. Going on that the batteries check out good and at the battery termination the cables are good, you need to figure out if that is truly a deep voltage drop of some other issue. Next start attemp, see how the voltage acts. The smoke coming from the motor, could it be off the starter?