Anyone have experience w/ the CNG/Propane prep package (and subsequent upfit)?

Been reading about this and am intrigued about adding bi-fuel capability. I'm aware of the economic payback period calculations as well as the ~20% hit in power, torque, and fuel economy.

Questions:

1) In the event of power loss (hurricanes, tornadoes, devastating hail storms, etc.), can you still get CNG/propane fuel from the station's storage tank into the truck's tank? I assume the station's tank is >3600 PSI; while you couldn't necessarily get all 3600 PSI to top off, you could get enough to get to operational gasoline stations.

2) Aside from the tank, lines, filter, pump, and switching controller, what other modifications would be necessary to upfit to bi-fuel capability? Upfitters are charging about $10K and my gut is only about half is parts.

3) When Ford says "CNG/Propane," do they mean that the truck can run on any blend of either or are there specific requirements on % methane, % butane, % propane, etc.?

4) If a CNG station is unavailable, can you refuel at a regular old propane station (like the ones you use to fill BBQ propane cylinders)?

 

All I have on you is perhaps a bit more research...
1) No. You'd still need the electronic measuring/safety components at a commercial station.

2) you're missing (at least) regulator and pressure sensor from your list of needed parts, and most of the cost seems to be in the tank.

3) The ECU has to be flashed with the specifics for the CNG or Propane system, while I think it could take either in theory, I don't think there's any way for it to run an arbitrary mix of them, and I don't know any certified kits that can do both.

4) You can't put Propane into a CNG system. The tanks/regulator/lines etc are all pretty dramatically different, mostly the tank. LP is much easier to do.

Check out this pdf if you haven't yet:
https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas...Fuel_HiRes.pdf

 

This is super helpful - thank you!

I'll read up more on LP.

 

To clarify, LP == Propane (Liquified Propane / Liquified Petroleum Gas, depending on what I'm reading)

CNG is MUCH cheaper. Propane is domestic but is more expensive than gasoline, CNG, when filled up at home, and if my math is right, in the neighborhood of $1/GGE (Gallon of Gas Equivalent), Propane is more like $4/GGE. Both reduce emissions, neither are a total cure but they burn cleaner (How much cleaner seems to be a debate depending on what measure people use).

Propane setup should be cheaper (I haven't looked) because LP tanks are fairly straightforward.

Hope that helps.

 

That does help a lot - thanks, archerseven.

It kind of sucks that you have to pick one or the other and you cannot refuel if the CNG station doesn't have power.

Stupid question RE LPG (propane): in a real pinch (no power due to hurricane) can you refuel LPG out of standard propane cylinders (the kind used for propane BBQs)?

 

I'm not an expert, and I don't know for sure, but I expect yes. To be fair, you could refill a CNG w/o power, too, based on the same principal. In practice, nowhere is really set up to do this, and your bbq grill tank won't go very far when you transfer half its capacity to the truck, which is all the better you'd be able to do unless you found a way to leave it hooked up while driving.

On an LPG truck, however, forklift style tanks could totally be a thing, would even be an ideal way to set it up if there's a way to get the D.O.T. to approve it.

Another aside, a commercial station could probably power a CNG "pump" on a tiny generator, they don't need nearly the power, for the sake of refueling, until their reserve tanks emptied.

 

Makes sense. Is there any negative side effect associated with running the Ford cng/propane prep package (hardened valves, seats, bifuel manifold) on just gasoline in the long term?

 

Hope not Shouldn't be, on the V-10 it's standard now. I got the prep package and am hoping to be able to do the CNG conversion but depends a bit on how the next few months / year go for me.

 

You can't refuel a diesel truck without power unless you have some stored in gravity containers or have a tank with a hand pump.

 

If you can afford a home CNG compressor that is the way to go. However if it's like the previous Setups it runs 100% on LP/CNG until it runs out then it switches to 100% gasoline. It's all automatic but it means that you'll never use the gasoline if you keep filling the CNG tank. If they've added a switch then yes, 100% worth it if you have the infrastructure. Towing on 100% LP/CNG is a pain with the power loss.

 

Most I've seen (in person and online) have a switch, only about 25% don't. That's up to the installer, the truck (in this case) doesn't care.

 

Ahh, now I see we are talking about the CNG prep and not the factory install option from Westport. So yes, make sure your upfitter has a switch.

 

My concern is the volatility of LPG / CNG, especially compared to diesel. I'm not comfortable storing large amounts of those fuels at home, unlike diesel. Diesel, you can toss a match into and it basically won't light. Propane...look out.

If you are trying to be prepared for power outages, simply purchase a 275 gallon fuel oil barrel like those found in the basements of most homes in the northeast. Put a couple of filters and water separators on it, and install a hand pump. Problem solved.

 

Good point. How stable is diesel over time? I know gasoline is probably no good after about a month.

 

Diesel is good for at least 6 months in most weather, up to a year below 70*