You will just about ALWAYS get more money selling it outright. We take trades in order to make money on them, not to break even on them. It's just a matter of the hassle, and many states you get to take the trade value off before taxes, which may make up a chuck of the difference.

When I do a factory order for folks with a trade, I give them my number and then encourage them to sell it on their own for more, but at least they'll know the bottom dollar to take. So long as it's not your only transportation, or your only truck which you need often, it works pretty well. Generally they keep it and trade in to avoid the hassle though.

 

You don't need to find someone with an X-Plan pin. Just join the EAA. (Experimental Aircraft Association.) It's $40 a year and you can generate two of your own X-Plan pins. Very easy.

 

What does the X-plan give you on say an ordered truck? I have ordered at just over invoice in the past, is the X-plan going to improve on that?

 

X-plan is .4% under invoice plus a $275 admin fee. It also limits doc fees to $100. Then when the truck comes in, rebates still apply. There likely won't be rebates for a while though...

 

Sounds a lot like a normal fleet order.

 

It's just an easy way to get invoice pricing in areas that don't offer it. You can't get near invoice at any Ford dealer within 80 miles of my location especially on a special order. Bigger markets are a lot easier but that's not a reality for many of us.

 

So Tedster, I'm going to be ordering a loaded out 2017 Lariat Crew Cab F350 Diesel long bed when the load banks open. I'll be putting $45k down (money I've been paying into an account specifically for a new pickup for 8 years now). From 2010-2015, I made close to $4k on CD interest in my "pickup account".

I currently own a 2005 F150 Supercab 5.4L which I brought brand new in 2005 and paid off in 8 months. It has 140k miles on it and while it's worth maybe 5-6k trade-in, I will be holding on to it for my son's to drive as they come of age.

I plan to finance $25k for my new truck ($45k down plus $25k financed for a total of $70k). I need a heavy duty hauler for the boats and trailers I own and thus why I'm upgrading. Plus the new options on the Super Duty are awesome.

So here's the rub. I can easily afford $1k per month truck payment, but I like to carry very little debt. So I'm going to finance my purchase over (here it comes) 6 years! OMG. My bank will finance it at 2.7% for 72 months at a monthly payment of approx $376 per month with a total interest paid on the loan of approx $2100 over 6 years. If I financed it at 3 years, I would pay double the payment and save around $1050 on interest for the life of the loan.

Does this make me stupid for financing it longer and paying a little more in the total interest over the life of the loan? Because I don't see my decision to finance and borrow money to buy a depreciating asset as "just plain stupid". I somehow don't think that people who can afford something with excellent credit and years of forethought as being "dumber than they used to be".

Frankly, I find your post rather insulting.

 

How many people do you know who are able to save forty five thousand dollars ($45,000) for a down payment on a pickup? Nobody, that's who. That ain't the norm. Not even close.

A lot of people can't scratch up even a hundred bucks in cash. Sorry if you're offended by all the stupid people out there but, you should be, lol. Granted, they've had help. Still. Americans in aggregate have racked up over $900,000,000 (nine hundred billion dollars) in revolving credit card accounts. Student loans is even higher? Jeeze Louise.

And for the first time, auto loans have exceeded 1 Trillion dollars. That's a crapload of money.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/total-u-...ime-1439478198

Yes, people are arguably, objectively, dumber than they used to be. Americans for one thing, used to save their money. Were a creditor nation.

You know, back when we all had jobs and industries, welfare was almost unheard of, along with all the other social ills taxpayers are forced to subsidize. People weren't confused about what bathrooms to use, etc. On top of all this, the national government has borrowed over 9 Trillion dollars and (surprise!) won't be able to pay that back either, and has promised another 100 Trillion in exchange for votes on top of that. They can't ever raise interest rates or the whole thing blows up in their face, and all the money will go to debt servicing. Oops.


Isn't that kind of insulting?

 

The majority of the guys I work with make large down payments on new vehicles or just pay cash and don't finance at all.

My point was that calling people who finance vehicles stupid and dumber all the time is inflammatory and stupid in and of itself.

You're obviously better than those of us to borrow money within our means. Good to know.

 

I understand your point about the total debt and the number of people who borrow outside their means. Is this the person's fault or the lender? Obviously the person borrowing makes the decision to borrow the money, but borrowers are loaning money at near historically low rates and our economy is driven by consumerism instead of industry. Back when industry ran the nation, interest rates were high and it didn't make sense to borrow.

My whole point was that you can't group everyone who borrows money for a loan into a category of stupid and dumber. The people who I have as friends and my co-workers never default on car loans. We are a group of smart buyers who maintain low or no credit card debt (last time I added it up I have 130k of credit available on cards and I NEVER carry a balance). We also have car loans. So don't act like you know what everyone's situation is and judge us all. Otherwise it makes it look like you're pretty stupid yourself and getting dumber all the time.

 

But, that isn't the norm. The standard seems to be, borrow money you don't have, to buy things you can't afford, to impress people you don't like.

You're contradicting yourself. But anyway, borrowing money to buy a depreciating asset IS stupid. I know pointing out the obvious isn't popular these days, but thems the facts. Maybe it's time again for people to get called out on dumb ****.

Part of the problem, to some folks a car represents the largest single purchase they will likely ever make. To others, it's the equivalent of buying a pair of shoes or something. IN GENERAL, though, financing a $70,000 pickup - you know, for the people who can't even make a meaningful downpayment - IS ****ING STUPID!!

I never claimed to be better than anyone else. Now putting words in someone elses mouth, THAT is insulting! The reason I mention ed all this, is because I MYSELF did STUPID stuff just like this and (eventually) learned my lesson.

Take a listen to economic programs like Dave Ramsey sometime. Virtually every person in trouble - bankruptcy- has a big ole car note (or two) that they can't afford, is getting repo'd, their credit is shot, getting evicted from "their" home. It's a HUGE problem and ruins relationships, ruins marriages, busts up families. A lot of times, for a 4X4 that will never leave the road, never carry anything in the bed other than a loaf of bread. See this a lot.

Let's be clear here - we're talking about a guy who is making $15 an hour and going to school. In this case, borrowing money to buy a $50,000+ truck is stupid. Call it what you want. But it's dumb.

Folks who have good credit, who don't want to unwind assets or whatever, and can borrow at decent rates - sure, whatever.

Don't try to conflate the two or act as if these are remotely comparable. Apples and Aircraft carriers. I'm sorry if you misunderstood my postings, I'm quite certain we agree on more than we disagree.

 

If you listen to, or better yet, read Dave Ramsey, then yes we agree more than we disagree. I've grown up understanding and living a lifestyle where I always lived within my means and have built a substantial retirement and savings by the age of 35. I also surround myself with people who are of the same mindset.

The biggest problem we face when considering debt in this country is that we don't give our children enough guidance and allow them to be poisoned by the spending habits of our government and the people who are in charge. If it wasn't for low interest rates and the consumer driven economy we now have, there wouldn't be the plethora of lenders so eager to give money to anyone with a heartbeat. While I definitely blame the individuals who take out the loan who aren't capable of paying it back, I also blame the lenders for their role in the equation. Look at the sub prime bubble that burst in 2008. It had to do with traders getting drunk on moving sub prime bundle mortgages for huge profits, while the individuals who were taking out the loans didn't understand the financial complexity of the loans they were getting. Someone with an economics degree who was a smooth talking salesman would sell them something they couldn't afford in order to collect their 1%. It's a travesty.

In any case, I agree about a kid making $15 an hour not being able to afford a new truck. I never considered a new truck when I was making that much money. There are plenty of us out there though who can afford huge down payments and small, low interest, car loans who aren't stupid or dumb.

 

Just to clarify; not 9 Trillion in debt, 19 Trillion in debt.

I am sure it was just a typo, but that figure just really disturbs me. And more entitlements are on the way.

I think AK & Tedster are actually saying nearly the same thing. Be responsible about your debt.

 

Yes I believe we are on the same page. And I saw that typo, but knew what he meant. And the 19 trillion in debt isn't even the big issue. Its the near 100 trillion in unfunded liabilities and federal pensions that are out of control.

 

As more and more states pass the $15.00 minimum wage, 12 weeks paid family leave (vacation in Europe soon to be here), college loan forgiveness and affordable healthcare I wonder when each will be issued a $70K vehicle on their 21st birthday. I have worked my entire life to afford a "luxury" truck and have never thought anyone owed me anything or that I should have the best of the best while I had other responsibilities, commitments and a desire to save enough to comfortably retire. Yes, there have been decent trucks and toys and recreation but all at an affordable rate. If you don't work, free tv, if you don't work free internet, if you don't work free housing, if you don't work free phones, if you don't work free food etc. etc etc. 19 trillion and climbing and multimillionaire politicians promising more and more. Lets bring in millions who want to get on the band wagon. If it were the mob the returns would be called money laundering. If you are a politician its called a platform to buy more votes and more excess monetary gain through hollow promises. So maybe those who can't afford should just go buy the truck of their dreams. The example on top in Washington and the various state houses are thinking they are Robin Hood. And I invite anyone who says those of us who have worked to achieve are not sharing enough to come pay my taxes for a year. Witness how "The Old Man and the Sea" (Ernest Hemmingway) watched his dream catch torn away by the sharks one mouthful at a time. Taxes paid would be a nice down payment on any of the rides discussed here. Sorry to get political, the thread was heading this way, I'll stop now.