6.2L Value
#16
03-12-2016, 07:15 AM
#17
03-12-2016, 08:53 AM
Cargo Master
Fleets run this senario all the time, because it comes down to the bottom line. I have read and heard time and time again, that today, it will cost more to own a diesel in the long run.
I agree, it comes down to what you want to drive. I drove the 6.7 for awhile and liked it. My problem with today's diesel is being broke down somewhere. I have seen it with 2 friends and I just don't like that feeling. I also work out of my truck everyday as a General Contractor. I simply Can't afford downtime on a vehicle, it is just too much of an inconvenience for me. My working partner has a 6.7 and an older 460 for backup, which has used twice while his 6.7 was in the shop.
I know if my worked demanded heavy towing daily I would be more willing to drive a diesel again.
I also believe that the 2017 6.2 with specific designed tranny and power upgrade will improve the already solid gas option.
I agree, it comes down to what you want to drive. I drove the 6.7 for awhile and liked it. My problem with today's diesel is being broke down somewhere. I have seen it with 2 friends and I just don't like that feeling. I also work out of my truck everyday as a General Contractor. I simply Can't afford downtime on a vehicle, it is just too much of an inconvenience for me. My working partner has a 6.7 and an older 460 for backup, which has used twice while his 6.7 was in the shop.
I know if my worked demanded heavy towing daily I would be more willing to drive a diesel again.
I also believe that the 2017 6.2 with specific designed tranny and power upgrade will improve the already solid gas option.
#18
03-12-2016, 08:40 PM
I'm struggling with the 6.2/6.7 decision for a 2017 as well. I've concluded that the overall cost is lower for the 6.7.
It appears that most 6.2 4.30 rear trucks average 12 mpg and 6.7 3.55 rear trucks average 16 mpg for the type of driving I do. Some claim higher mileage (up to 16 for the 6.2 and 22 for the 6.7), but reading a lot on this leads me to the 12/16 conclusion.
In the 12 year, 240k mile time I keep trucks, the 6.2 will burn around 20,000 gallons of gas and the 6.7 will burn 15,000.
With today's prices, which will likely rise and make this a bigger impact, fuel cost:
6.2: 20,000 * $1.80 = $36,000
6.7: 15,000 * $2.05 = $30,750
That $5250 benefit for the 6.7 would be over $8k with last year's fuel prices.
Then you factor in $8k 6.7 premium, resale, DEF, more oil for maintenance, risk of major 6.7 failure (pessimistic view is 1% risk of a $15k failure = $150), etc., etc., the total cost of ownership seems to be in favor of the 6.7.
To me it comes down to which is more pleasant to drive. If the 6.7 spends much time in the shop, that greatly decreases its fun factor. I haven't come to an conclusion yet, but am still leaning toward the 6.7.
It appears that most 6.2 4.30 rear trucks average 12 mpg and 6.7 3.55 rear trucks average 16 mpg for the type of driving I do. Some claim higher mileage (up to 16 for the 6.2 and 22 for the 6.7), but reading a lot on this leads me to the 12/16 conclusion.
In the 12 year, 240k mile time I keep trucks, the 6.2 will burn around 20,000 gallons of gas and the 6.7 will burn 15,000.
With today's prices, which will likely rise and make this a bigger impact, fuel cost:
6.2: 20,000 * $1.80 = $36,000
6.7: 15,000 * $2.05 = $30,750
That $5250 benefit for the 6.7 would be over $8k with last year's fuel prices.
Then you factor in $8k 6.7 premium, resale, DEF, more oil for maintenance, risk of major 6.7 failure (pessimistic view is 1% risk of a $15k failure = $150), etc., etc., the total cost of ownership seems to be in favor of the 6.7.
To me it comes down to which is more pleasant to drive. If the 6.7 spends much time in the shop, that greatly decreases its fun factor. I haven't come to an conclusion yet, but am still leaning toward the 6.7.
Lets assume you do 5k oil changes like me.
48 oil changes right? (240k ÷5k=48)
Lets be generous and call it 50$ for the 6.2, assuming its done at your dealer.
2400 bucks.
The 6.7 is closer to 120 per change.
Thats 5760, more than double.
Then you have def fluid, which I am not familiar enough with to have pricing and usage.
Additives in the winter, as well as higher fuel prices in winter due to heating oil demand.
Fuel filters get changed every 10k I believe. Not sure how much they are.
Longer warm up times as well as cooling down means more idling and more fuel wasted.
God forbid there's a problem or you get water in the fuel. 15-18k.
Im not saying its not a reliable engine or even that I may not have one sometime, but I am saying realistically it is more expensive and I dont see how you're able to find it cheaper. Much much more goes into it then a few mpgs.
#19
03-12-2016, 11:45 PM
#20
03-13-2016, 07:10 AM
Cargo Master
Also when there is fuel contamination be it alleged suspected or confirmed the hot potato blame game starts big time. Nobody wants to cover it or accept responsibility.
I like my gas truck I don't have to wear rubber gloves or put a paper towel over the handle of the nozzle of the gas pump like I did with the diesel because it was covered in oily grime.
I like my gas truck I don't have to wear rubber gloves or put a paper towel over the handle of the nozzle of the gas pump like I did with the diesel because it was covered in oily grime.
#21
03-13-2016, 07:32 AM
From a risk perspective, the expected probability-factored cost of a major failure still seems low to me. Maybe I'm missing something.
Even if one in 1500 engines has the crazy $15,000 failure (and I'm sure the failure rate is way lower than that), the expected cost is only $10 per truck. I understand that isn't much consolation if yours fails though.
Even if one in 1500 engines has the crazy $15,000 failure (and I'm sure the failure rate is way lower than that), the expected cost is only $10 per truck. I understand that isn't much consolation if yours fails though.
#22
03-13-2016, 08:56 AM
I am not trying to start a war lol just so were clear. I love those trucks and engines. My only argument is someone claiming it is cheaper to operate.
If you had said you are regularly towing lots of weight I could see the argument there
#23
03-13-2016, 11:35 AM
For a motor replacement when the hpfp fails? Yup 15-18 and warranty doesnt cover it I believe if they can prove water was in the fuel (rust). If you're lucky the gas station may cover it, but from what I have read most guys have to file it through their auto insurance.
I am not trying to start a war lol just so were clear. I love those trucks and engines. My only argument is someone claiming it is cheaper to operate.
If you had said you are regularly towing lots of weight I could see the argument there
I am not trying to start a war lol just so were clear. I love those trucks and engines. My only argument is someone claiming it is cheaper to operate.
If you had said you are regularly towing lots of weight I could see the argument there
Diesel used to be cheaper to own and operate but not anymore.
#24
03-13-2016, 11:37 AM
From a risk perspective, the expected probability-factored cost of a major failure still seems low to me. Maybe I'm missing something.
Even if one in 1500 engines has the crazy $15,000 failure (and I'm sure the failure rate is way lower than that), the expected cost is only $10 per truck. I understand that isn't much consolation if yours fails though.
Even if one in 1500 engines has the crazy $15,000 failure (and I'm sure the failure rate is way lower than that), the expected cost is only $10 per truck. I understand that isn't much consolation if yours fails though.
#25
03-13-2016, 11:52 AM
I agree the risk is probably low. I had a diesel once & sold it after a year. My hands would smell like diesel & my shoes would smell after a fill up. It was hard to find diesel everyplace except the interstate, then I would have to wait for semi's to fill up or some dope blocking the only diesel pump while he was inside buying lotto tickets. My mileage was better but it just didn't offset the inconvenience and extra maintenance. Then to make matters worse we had one of those extra cold winters & I had drive-ability problems that left me stranded twice. The second time I called a tow truck & we went straight to the dealer and I've been burning gas ever since. All that was 20 years ago so I'm sure some things changed but I do know diesel still smells.
#26
03-13-2016, 02:57 PM
I've heard this a few times, but don't really understand it. Gasoline smells stronger than diesel, and comes from the same pump island most places I see it. Why would you smell like diesel after pumping it, but not like gas after pumping it?
#28
03-13-2016, 03:14 PM
Gas evaporates very quickly while diesel is more like an oil. The pumps are always soaked in diesel and it can get on your clothes and footwear, then you jump into the truck and it can transfer it to the interior finishes.
#29
03-13-2016, 04:18 PM
This is the problem. I kept some gloves and shoes in the back just for fill ups.
#30
03-13-2016, 04:53 PM
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