I see this all the time and figured I'd say something about it.

The standard battle cry I hear from morons that don't know what they're doing is, "The timing is off! The timing! It must be the timing!" That aggravates me to no end. Once you set the timing, THAT'S IT!!!! If the distributor is bolted down, it won't move again. EVER! Even if the chain is falling out of it, it will only mess with the ignition timing a few degrees. It's almost NEVER the timing! (unless of course, some idiot was in there fooling around with the distributor)

This is a HUGE pet peeve of mine and inspires instant rage when I hear it. You broke the distributor? Ok, fine. The timing is off. The chain is getting ready to slip off the sprockets? Yeah, that would make the timing off. You forgot to tighten the distributor down? That would do it for sure. .......but THAT'S IT!!!! There's nothing else that can happen to an engine to make the ignition timing off. Unless of course you have an idiot under the hood twirling the distributor around. That will for SURE mess up the timing.

A guy brought me his truck on a tow truck. He said he took it to an ASE certified shop. He was running down the road and the truck just shut off on him. The closest shop was this place, and their diagnosis was "The timing is off!" THEY TOOK THE DISTRIBUTOR OUT OF THE ENGINE AND RESET IT!!!!!! It was running before!!!!! WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT??!! After they couldn't get it to start, he brought it to me. I told the guy that I've seen vehicles do strange things over the decades I've been working on them, but I HAVE YET to see a distributor jump out of a running engine, spin 90 degrees and bolt itself back down while driving down the highway. After I reset the distributor to where it was before I found the initial problem. ......IT WAS OUT OF GAS!!!!

Stop twirling the distributor expecting something wonderful to happen and just use your basic diagnostic skills to troubleshoot your issue. If an engine is running fine and starts to run poorly after a while, IT'S NOT THE TIMING!!! Buy a timing light. They're cheap. If the timing is where it's supposed to be, leave it alone and check something else!

Ok, I'm done. I see this as the NUMBER ONE mistake made by so many people, I figured I'd help some people out by eliminating one of the biggest ghosts people chase.

 

You go man. I love it

 

ha ha ha ha .. hey alan if my truck dont start this morning ya wanna come over and re-set my timing..

 

Very funny, RC.

 

According to my wife my timing is impeccable, if you know what I mean. Well said Alan.

 

Actually, I DID see that happen one time...but that was when I was in Thailand and there's a lot of other stuff that happened that night that I don't remember too clearly either .

 

I bought a Toyota from a girl years ago that the mechanic said had "jumped time". I got the truck home, and called him for his exact diagnosis and what he said had happened. He claimed the timing belt broke. Well, anyone that had a Yota with a 22R already knows, it had a timing chain. The Jacobs electronic ignition module took a crap. A new one and the truck started first crank.

He was going to charge her $1250 for the repair. It cost me less then $50.

 

Epic timing rant! I love it!

I'm right with you man, it agrevates the hell out of me too.

"Dear internet, my truck sputters when accelerating."

Interwebs be like: mess with the timing.

"Dear interwebs, my clear coat is peeling."

Interwebs: mess with the timing.

"Dear interwebs..."

Timing!!

"Dear...."

Timing!!!!!!




Sigh...........

Lmao!

 

You go Alan !!

Dave that is epic!! I love it!!!

 

Ok Alan vent time is done, hope you feel better? Very well said and yes we all get it, do not always assume the timing it off, and ck it properly with a timing light.

How about a walk thru to do that for folks that just bought a timing light because you said so. That way we can take that possibility out of the "what might be wrong box".

Meaning this is a great thread to start posting your basic trouble shooting advice or at least the route you take. I know you have awesome automotive skills, I have see you in your technician/paint and body, modification and fabrication mode. I try to learn/pick up all I can when working with you and RC on anything. But how about helping the FTE folks on here? Your thread, so go 1st by all means, then the rest of the band wagon will jump in.

 

Well since it was my idea here, I'll jump. 1st we all need to have our priorities straight. Lift kit and tires much later. We want and need our trucks to reliably START, STOP, STEER. A truck engine needs 3 things to start and run, right? So lets discuss START first.

AIR: that is a gimme, air filter ck. Not clogged? Air/fuel mixture in the carb correct?...that is discussed later by the carb guru's, which I am not. lol

FUEL: Good gas in the tank, sending unit (in tank) pick up tube filter clogged? Lines from tank to fuel pump good or clogged? Any in line fuel filters, clogged or new? Fuel pump, does it work? Ck it be taking the carb feed line off the fuel pump,and then "by key" turn over the truck and look for gas to spit out the connection point. You can also rule out the tank and lines by seeing it the truck will run off a small gas can connected directly to the fuel pump.

Carb working, with truck off, manually work the throttle (by hand) and look down the throat of the carb, see a squirt of gas? Maybe all you need is an accelerator pump?

FIRE/SPARK: Battery ck for 12v, GOOD CABLES and ground points? All connections good to the starter solenoid on the passenger side inner fenderwell? Starter itself ? Ignition control box, aka (brain box) on dvrs side inner fenderwell. Orange Fusible link good? Distributor cap and rotor bug? Alternator, been bench tested?

Yes there is alot more elec, but I am going with the BASIC STUFF here. And yes we all are waiting on fmc400 and I can only hope mikeo0o0o0 will chime in.

 

Did you try adjusting the timing?

 

The carburetor takes a lot of blame to. Years ago in Auto mechanics class the instructor would say that 90-95% of the time the carb. was NOT the cause of the problem. Of course that was when we had good gas.
Of course if the spark does not occur at the right moment we have to adjust the timing.....

 

Ok, so you bought a light. These are so easy to use. You hook the red alligator clip the to positive terminal of the battery. You hook the black alligator clip to the negative battery terminal of the battery. Now that third clip that's weird looking, that gets put on the number one plug wire. Buy a shop manual and look up which cylinder is number one on your engine. (you didn't expect me to tell you EVERYTHING, did you?) Ok, now the light is hooked up. Remove the vacuum line from the distributor and plug it. (you want to set BASE timing here) Start the engine and let it idle. shine the flashy light at the timing marks on the crank shaft. That little timing tab that sticks out over the harmonic balancer has hash marks and numbers on it. When the line on the balancer is next to the 8* mark on the tab, guess what? Your timing is set at 8*. ....it's just that easy.

Now, there's going to be people that will tell you that you need to look for this vacuum, or that advance curve, ...blah, blah, blah. ....just keep it simple if you're new at this.

Your engine needs fuel, air, compression and ignition to run. It's easy to test for these.

Air. you can breathe, right? ....Your engine probably can too unless you put a plastic bag over the carburetor.

Fuel. Look down the carb and operate the throttle linkage by hand. See gas squirting in the carb? Yes? .....you're good. No? .....fix the fuel system.

Compression. Take a spark plug out and put your thumb over the hole. Have your friend crank the engine. Did it blow your thumb off the hole? Yes? ....you're good. No? ....man, you got issues. Go talk to someone that knows what they're doing.

Ignition. I suggest you go buy an inline spark tester, but you can use the screwdriver test. Place a screwdriver in the plug wire and hold it about a 1/4" from a ground. Did you get knocked on your ***? ....good. You have spark. No? fix your ignition system.

You'll notice nowhere did I say twirl the distributor around and hope the problem fixes itself. Good luck.

 

In defense of people answering questions on the internet.....

Most times someone comes in with a question like: "My truck runs badly, what do you think it could be?"

So the canned response is "Make sure the timing is right, the carb is functioning properly, etc."

I've also seen a bunch of people messing with their carb trying to get a proper result while the timing is way retarded. Certainly not a problem as you mention if it hadn't been touched, but I've worked on far too many vehicles where someone decided to essentially mess with everything trying to get the engine to run right. Like it or not, setting the timing is the first step in tuning the engine.

How to avoid having to answer all questions in this manner....
Well, for starters, ask a better dang question. A little information is often needed to help with an issue. Also learn basic tuning, until you have the fuel and ignition where it needs to be everything else isn't on the radar yet.

This post wasn't aimed at the original poster (who I totally agree with) but more at those that ask very vague questions and expect an exact response.