Although I am of the opinion that 4WD with a heavy diesel truck is just a way to dig the front in faster I do need to occasionally need to take the Ex into soft fields. And due to the faulty equipment that exists between the driver's seat and the steering wheel I have been stuck in mud a few times.


I have been lucky so far in that there was someone nearby to give a tow but I can't count on that in the future. I am looking for a recommendation for the winch capacity. It will be a Warn brand. For the price range it looks like the choice is either slightly under 10k# fancy model or 15k# basic model. Has anyone here ever had to use their winch to get their Ex out of mud and if so do you think the lighter model will work?


Also what about synthetic line vs steel? Steel is such a pita to get rewound correctly.

 

Warn from their website recommends 1.5 times the GVWR when selecting a winch weight rating. Figure you have a fully loaded X with full fuel, and you are close to 9,000 pounds, or 13,500 pounds factoring in the 1.5 x rule. I would go with the bigger winch myself, and if you are not pulling around rocks are other abrasive surfaces, hands down go synthetic rope. I have synthetic on my Jeep winch and love it!

 

In general you can't go wrong having more winch then you need. As well many recommend a capacity twice the weight of the vehicle.

In the circumstance you describe it's quite important that the pulling capacity be twice if not more then the weight of the vehicle. Few things are harder on a winch then pulling a rig out of the mud, more so if a straight pull rather then pulling up and I gather it's unlikely you'll have a high point to pull from. Two reasons for this, the angle at which the tires must climb and the suction of the mud.

The next question then becomes how you will achieve enough pulling force. That you will likely need 15K of pulling force does not mean you need a 15K which. An 8K winch and a ****** block(pulley) will accomplish 16K of pulling force.

As important as the winch is the kit that you have with it and your ability to use it. This must also be considered. Few things are harder then sunk in the mud in open field. Not only are you sucked into the mud but also there are few pulling points.

As such I think it smart to prepare for the worse. IMO you must have and be prepared to use a pull pall Pull-Pal winch anchor, foldable land anchors for 4x4, Jeep, ATV, UTV, off-road, all-terrain-vehicles And be prepared to pull over your spare tire. This you'll want to look up to learn more but basically you take your spare and place it on end in front of the rig. You then drape the winch line over the tire. This raises the angle up the pull. I mention this now because when doing this only one line can be draped over the tire. This circumstance makes the heavier winch quite needed.

Synthetic vs. steel, synthetic is the clear winner.

 

I just wrote an article about recovery gear and touched on winches a little bit. I know it doesn't directly apply to your situation, but it might be worth glancing over:

http://exploringnh.com/home/recovery/

I have a lot of hours of use on my Warn 12,500 Powerplant winch. I think the capacity is decent for the Excursion. A higher capacity is nice to have on hand but usually that comes at a compromise of line speed. The Warn 12,500 is faster than most but it is no speed demon. The spec sheet lists it as only 3fpm slower than an M8000 at no load but for some reason it seems slower to me.





If you need more capacity, you can run a ****** block back to yourself.

The problem with a large winch, and even a 12,500lb winch, is that finding properly rated accessories can be hard and they are always expensive and heavy. Tree saver, ****** block(s), shackles...it all adds up, and you absolutely should not have a winch without the supporting equipment.

My only issue with the Warn 12,500 that I have is that I am seemingly hitting the thermal overload quite frequently. All of the times I have hit it have been on long hard pulls but it seems to kick in too early, and once it comes on, you are pretty much done for 30 minutes while it cools off. If you wait until the light goes out and try again immediately, you will get another 3 feet before it trips again. There may be something wrong with my winch and I've been meaning to write Warn about it but haven't yet. The last time this happened, the winch was packed with snow with an air temp of near 0F and there is no way it could have been overly hot for as long as it was.





As for synthetic, if you have the budget, absolutely get it. It is better in all aspects. The trouble you might face is finding a reasonably priced rope that is properly rated for your winch.

 

I have a 12,000 lb winch and have used it a few times. It works well. I got a ENGO very inexpensive and great reviews. have not had a problem with it used in wet and sandy conditions.

 

I have had a Warn M15000 on my Excursion for about 8 years. I have used it several times and it has always worked with no issues. Slow but plenty of power.

The main down side of this winch is that it is very heavy (135 lbs). When I bought it Warn did not recommend using synthetic rope because of the operating temperatures when doing extended pulls.

I would recommend using a bumper (ARB or other) designed for this winch from both a strength (weight and pulling power) and size point of view. I would also recommend fitting a power disconnect close to the battery on the winch power cable.

 

I'll go against the grain and tell you to get the much less expensive 8000 lb winch and use a doubler or tripler w/ ****** blocks. In my experience, these winches get used once or twice a year - save some $ and invest in dual batteries. I have yet to stall out when doubled. You will get good at anchoring yourself,when pulling someone else, learning to properly connect to the vehicle, use gloves, carpet over the cable, stand clear. On the bright side you're buying a good quality brand, not some $299 HF paperweight. Winch bumpers are great if well attached. It's not difficult to rip the frame horn steel on a heavy pull.

 

****** blocks work great - if you have enough extra places to mount them. Otherwise you're kinda screwed.... Everything else I agree with

To the OP, synthetic line is fantastic and saves a TON of weight, don't rust, and don't need to be fully unwound and 'stretched' when installed. However, they are more prone to abrasives when dragged over obstacles. This is offset by sheaths that are available for the lines.

 

I got a used winch bumper with a 9k superwinch so I'm sure I can tell you how it does eventually.
My brother has a 12 or 15k warn, one of the rather expensive ones. I've been with him when he used it on his Cummins (mention only because it has dual batteries) and it drew the batteries way down and stalled out, then fried a solenoid. I wasn't impressed. We were trying to winch a 77 f250 that was frozen in a field where it had sat for a year or two. He had his 26 foot Gooseneck hooked up and we tried winching the truck up after inflating the tires and shoveling the tires out. We then hooked up a more power puller by Wyeth Scott and took turns on a 3 or 4 foot pipe handle and it broke it loose and pulled it up on the trailer.

I'm inclined to agree that for very occasional use on a mostly street truck I would get a cheaper lower capacity one and use a swatch block when more power is needed. Just remember it halves line speed and line length. If you're looking for a specific recommendation, the warn vr series are supposedly very good and come in 8, 10, and 12k capacities and won't break the bank. The harbor freight badlands 12k winch is only $279 and has surprisingly good reviews given the junk that place sells.

Synthetic vs steel is personal preference. The synthetic line is damaged by the sun and damaged if it gets dirt in the weave (only the most expensive ropes have protective outer braid) and while it's lots easier to handle and weighs less, it does break more and needs replaced every few years. Not ideal for occasional use on the front of a daily driver. I run synthetic on my off road truck but I'm leaving the steel cable on my excursion. It also handles side pulls and being dragged over rocks or sharp edges much better. It also seems to handle blocks and sheaves better. Synthetic doesn't like heat so you can't use it in all winches unless they are made for it. You can get a heat sleeve for the first couple wraps that is supposed to help. Ideally if you want synthetic find a winch that comes with it though.

As for thermal overload, read your manual. Most people are surprised when they read what the duty cycle of your winch actually is. I think the ramsey patriot 9500 lb winch on my toy is 30 second on, 1 minute of rest, something like that. If you're really pulling that means taking a break every foot or two. That's one of the reasons so many people burn motors or solenoids. These things draw serious power and make serious heat. And as available voltage drops, amperage spikes and you get even more heat.

 

Wow! Great information! I have a Ranch Hand bumper with the winch plate. I was a little leery of the M15000 as I couldn't figure out why the M series models were so much cheaper than the latest and greatest. But I was worried that the smaller model would not have the capacity without rigging up a pulley system.


I was leaning towards synthetic as I don't plan on running it over rocks or trees and steel is such a pain to get wound correctly. But unless I am missing something I don't see the Warn M15000 selling with synthetic. Which based upon hasteranger's concern about heat makes me wonder whether it would be appropriate for that model.


Thanks again to everyone!

 

The m series have been around for a while. Personally I don't like the way they mount, if I remember it's a "feet forward" mounting which is a little funky. They are also very slow. My brothers is an m in fact the 15k may be the one he has.

The vr is their new "assembled in us" line.

They tested a bunch of 8k winches a few years ago. Despite, to most people I know, "losing" every test, they recommended the warn anyway. Warn is a huge sponsor of the magazine.... Not saying that I wouldn't run a warn, just saying don't skip straight to the results. http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/129-1107-massive-multi-winch-shootout/

Here is a quote from that article on the badlands winches:The Badland 9000 has a 5.5hp series-wound motor with a duty cycle of 5 percent. That means it can pull 9,000 pounds for 45 seconds followed by a 15-minute period of inactivity to cool down.

I'm sure other winches are similar and I'm also sure no one winches for 45 seconds and takes a 15 minute break.

 

I did look at the Badland. And there's a sale right now with an additional 20% off with a coupon. The impression I got was that of the low end products it was a good choice. The problem is that it tends to go out with no warning. What I consider funny is that if I was going to be using it a lot when others are around to rescue me I would give it consideration with the extra warranty. Just use it until it breaks and then exchange it. But since my need is more emergency where the product will just sit there for months or possibly years and then when I need it I need it to just plain work that seems to translate as Warn.


Warn has its critics, especially on price, but even its critics admit that they do just plain work.

 

My brothers sure didn't. Even my ramsey patriot (a $1200 winch btw) came to me with the paint burned off and the motor fried. Whoever owned it before just cranked on it till it died.

There is no guarantee that whatever you get will work every time.

 

4 Wheeler performed a test with 8 winches July 2011 interesting read. Warn #1 super winch #2 T-max #3 Engo #4 bulldog #5. Only two winches worked after the stall test. Engo and T-max. This article helped me decide what winch to get

 

Yeah I posted that a while ago.