Engine swap
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Mostly your own fab work. Everything I find is '53 and up pickups. You might be able to adapt something like this:
Engine Swap Motor Mount Kits
Steering box and shaft, and exhaust will be issues, along with a host of other smaller things.
You will overpowering the chassis. Unlike a pickup, there are no bigger brake kits easily available, so unless you are changing axles as well, watch out over 50 mphs. Steering geometry will cause some concern over 50 as well.
Engine Swap Motor Mount Kits
Steering box and shaft, and exhaust will be issues, along with a host of other smaller things.
You will overpowering the chassis. Unlike a pickup, there are no bigger brake kits easily available, so unless you are changing axles as well, watch out over 50 mphs. Steering geometry will cause some concern over 50 as well.
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Thanks for the info. I checked out the site. you are right in that they list only for 53 thru 64 with engine sizes 289 thru 351. But the 351 Cleveland is a big block so the cross member may work with a little finessing.
I was hoping to stay with the same front axel so I can continue using my 19.5 tires and wheels. Any suggestions with the steering? I will swap out the rear 2 speed axel for a Dana with 4:10 gears and wheel adapters so I can keep my duallys.
I was hoping to stay with the same front axel so I can continue using my 19.5 tires and wheels. Any suggestions with the steering? I will swap out the rear 2 speed axel for a Dana with 4:10 gears and wheel adapters so I can keep my duallys.
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351C is a small block, including the bell to trans pattern. Deck is little lower than a 351w, and just over an inch lower than a 460. Shorter too, so it's quite a bit smaller than a 460. You might get lucky...
Wheel adapters with duals? Not sure how that's going to work. Do you have 6 lug wheels?
So you are just making a big truck hot rod?
Your 19.5s, are those new tubeless?
Wheel adapters with duals? Not sure how that's going to work. Do you have 6 lug wheels?
So you are just making a big truck hot rod?
Your 19.5s, are those new tubeless?
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Engine swap
Thanks for all the info. It's all very helpful. I just want to say, the Cleveland is the big block, the Windsor is the small block.
https://www.google.com/search?site=&source=hp&ei=6GVOVKLDNIf3yQTp64KABA&q =which+is+the+big+block%2C+the+cleveland+or+the+wi ndsor&oq=which+is+the+big+block%2C+the+cleveland+o r+the+windsor&gs_l=mobile-gws-hp.12...5208.37133.0.39117.53.53.0.6.6.2.1307.2910 6.3-7j18j21j5j2.53.0....0...1c.1.56.mobile-gws-hp..31.22.8674.3.f02f-4n5C24
https://www.google.com/search?site=&source=hp&ei=6GVOVKLDNIf3yQTp64KABA&q =which+is+the+big+block%2C+the+cleveland+or+the+wi ndsor&oq=which+is+the+big+block%2C+the+cleveland+o r+the+windsor&gs_l=mobile-gws-hp.12...5208.37133.0.39117.53.53.0.6.6.2.1307.2910 6.3-7j18j21j5j2.53.0....0...1c.1.56.mobile-gws-hp..31.22.8674.3.f02f-4n5C24
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Engine swap
The truck is an F6 dump truck. I want to keep the big tires and dually s. I'm building a rat rod and intend to chop the truck up a bit. I've already lowered it almost 10 inches. I was told there are wheel adapters I can use to keep my 19.5 5 lug wheels. The Dana rearend I'm using is out if a 99 Ford 450. It's an 8 lug X 16". The tires are 8R 19.5's
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"I just want to say, the Cleveland is the big block, the Windsor is the small block..."
You might want to say it, but you shouldn't. The C deck height is lower than the W, and bore spacing is the same.
The 400/351m has the same bore spacing as the C and W, but the deck height is close to a 460. Maybe that's the motor you are thinking of. I couldn't open your search link, but it if says a C is BB and a W is a SB, then you should note the site and never go there for information again.
Anyway, 6 lug 19.5 wheels are fairly common. Sounds like quite a project.
You might want to say it, but you shouldn't. The C deck height is lower than the W, and bore spacing is the same.
The 400/351m has the same bore spacing as the C and W, but the deck height is close to a 460. Maybe that's the motor you are thinking of. I couldn't open your search link, but it if says a C is BB and a W is a SB, then you should note the site and never go there for information again.
Anyway, 6 lug 19.5 wheels are fairly common. Sounds like quite a project.
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engine swap
Lets agree to disagree! I do appreciate all the help thisforum offers
"The Ford 351
Ford offered two versions of the 351 engine, a Windsor 351 and a Cleveland 351. The Windsor motor is considered a small block. The Cleveland 351 is between a small block and a big block. Even though the Cleveland 351 came from the small block family, few parts will interchange.
First offered in 1970, the 351 Cleveland motor came as a 2V and a 4V engine. The heads and carbs were the difference. The 4 barrel 351 Cleveland had:
4 Barrel 351 Cleveland
2 Barrel 351 Cleveland
Bigger valves
Larger intake and exhaust valves
Smaller quench combustion chambers
Large, round "open" chambers
Cast iron dual plane intake
Hotter hydraulic cam
Autolite carb
Autolite carb
10.7:1 compression
9.0:1 Compression
Rated at 285 horses
Rated at 240 horses"
"The Ford 351
Ford offered two versions of the 351 engine, a Windsor 351 and a Cleveland 351. The Windsor motor is considered a small block. The Cleveland 351 is between a small block and a big block. Even though the Cleveland 351 came from the small block family, few parts will interchange.
First offered in 1970, the 351 Cleveland motor came as a 2V and a 4V engine. The heads and carbs were the difference. The 4 barrel 351 Cleveland had:
4 Barrel 351 Cleveland
2 Barrel 351 Cleveland
Bigger valves
Larger intake and exhaust valves
Smaller quench combustion chambers
Large, round "open" chambers
Cast iron dual plane intake
Hotter hydraulic cam
Autolite carb
Autolite carb
10.7:1 compression
9.0:1 Compression
Rated at 285 horses
Rated at 240 horses"
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Since the C block is smaller than the W, they are simply FOS on that point.
BB and SB are originally Chevy terms anyway, and describing a Ford as BB or SB only will get you the wrong parts.
I don't give a rip what that site says, you can't call something "big" when it is smaller than what you are calling "small".
BB and SB are originally Chevy terms anyway, and describing a Ford as BB or SB only will get you the wrong parts.
I don't give a rip what that site says, you can't call something "big" when it is smaller than what you are calling "small".
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New User
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Even Ford ranks the Windsor in their small block category. You can put a prom dress on a little pig and call it pretty. But underneath all the pretty it's still a "small' pig. Be that as it may, thanks for the parts info. I do appreciate it!!
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From: Chicago area
The thing is he's right.
The 351C, 351M, and the 400M all have bolt patterns for the bell housing that is the same as the 429/460 engines. Any trans that will bolt up to these "BB" engines will bolt up to a C or M engine.
The 351C, 351M, and the 400M all have bolt patterns for the bell housing that is the same as the 429/460 engines. Any trans that will bolt up to these "BB" engines will bolt up to a C or M engine.
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351C has the SBF bell pattern.
Very early 400s had SBF, then 385 series BB pattern.
C & W are SBF
460/429 BB
M and 400 are confused
This is why people build Chevalays:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ford_bellhousing_patterns
Very early 400s had SBF, then 385 series BB pattern.
C & W are SBF
460/429 BB
M and 400 are confused
This is why people build Chevalays:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ford_bellhousing_patterns
Lead Driver
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From: On the Edge of the Desert
A little old, but I feel things need to be cleared up.
When referring to ford engines, a small block is a 221 up to 351W. A big block is a 429/460. Then there are the FE engines, and the 335 "Cleveland" series, consisting of the 351C, and the twins 351M and 400.
The 351C is technically a small-block. HOWEVER, it is not a small-block like the windsor small-blocks. The 351C is just that. A cleveland. It's a "mid-block"
It uses the regular SBF bellhousing pattern. Same as 240-300 I6, 289-302-351W.
It is a 335 series engine. Same as a 400 and 351M. But it uses a different block. A smaller block. The 351M and 400 use a big block bellhousing pattern, same as 429/460.
When referring to ford engines, a small block is a 221 up to 351W. A big block is a 429/460. Then there are the FE engines, and the 335 "Cleveland" series, consisting of the 351C, and the twins 351M and 400.
The 351C is technically a small-block. HOWEVER, it is not a small-block like the windsor small-blocks. The 351C is just that. A cleveland. It's a "mid-block"
It uses the regular SBF bellhousing pattern. Same as 240-300 I6, 289-302-351W.
It is a 335 series engine. Same as a 400 and 351M. But it uses a different block. A smaller block. The 351M and 400 use a big block bellhousing pattern, same as 429/460.
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Engine swap
It's never too late to give good and correct information. Seems I raised the dander of a couple of contributors when I said the Cleveland is considered a big block and the Windsor is a small block.
Perhaps what I should have said is the Cleveland is the more prefered of the two when it comes to performance. Maybe that way I would'nt have hurt anyones ego.
However I did mention the Windsor was in Ford's small block category and the Cleveland is not. At any rate I was just looking for some opinions, not an argument. I'm not a total idiot when it come to vehicles. I'm 65 years old and have been working on cars for over 50 years. I'm a trained tracked and wheeled vehicle mechanic and have done a few ground up restorations. I currently have 3 rat rods.
But alas I don't know everything!! I am always willing to listen and learn.
Lately it seems I no can longer get answers to my questions. That is sad.
Thanks again for weighing in.
Perhaps what I should have said is the Cleveland is the more prefered of the two when it comes to performance. Maybe that way I would'nt have hurt anyones ego.
However I did mention the Windsor was in Ford's small block category and the Cleveland is not. At any rate I was just looking for some opinions, not an argument. I'm not a total idiot when it come to vehicles. I'm 65 years old and have been working on cars for over 50 years. I'm a trained tracked and wheeled vehicle mechanic and have done a few ground up restorations. I currently have 3 rat rods.
But alas I don't know everything!! I am always willing to listen and learn.
Lately it seems I no can longer get answers to my questions. That is sad.
Thanks again for weighing in.
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