Flash wrote:
"You can't. however, compare ACEA with API standards as the US automakers have emmission standards that they have to meet that the euro folks don't."

Incorrect. Please take time to read and learn about the ACEA specs at acea.org. When you see a 30 wt oil with a A1 rating and one with a A3 rating on the bottle you can be assured the A3 30 wt will outperform the A1.

In another post you wrote that the Chevron Supreme has a large dose of Moly and Boron. Look at the analysis posted in this section. None. I believe you have the Delo and the Supreme confused.

And:
"Extended drain intervals in Europe are common practice because of the additive packages they are allowed to use and that package would virtually kill an American made auto"

I guess you are speaking of the Cat Converters and phosporus ?Most of the Euro oils are SL's and have phos below 1k per million like the API designates. Some of the newer oils do not even use Zinc. Take the Fuchs Titan GT-1 for an example.

Another example is the 0/30 Saab Longlife Turbo oil available at the Saab dealers for 18.00 per four liters and available in single litre bottles. It is a API SL/CF - GM-LL-A-025 ACEA A5/B5
This oil is made be Total-Fina and I think it is the ELF . It is a SL oil with a TBN of 17.5 as I have been told . It is not a ZDDP less formula though but has go to be one of the best buys out there . It has the Amsoil guys in a frenzy he he! Just bring that oil up and they change the topic to golf or basketball

Rockledge,

New additive packages sold for the group III basestocks have been optimized for use with that base oil.Much has changed in the past year and even Mobil now makes a group III oil called " System S ". Search Vanderbilt or Lubrizol for more or I will come back, edit and post links later.

Chevron's Delo has been a group II+ for quite some time. I am not sure what you mean by taking a step backwards from group III's. Their new 5/40 Synthetic is a group III. Can you comment more on this topic ?

 

DOHC, all of my post is correct. Concerning Chevron Supreme, the latest tech sheet and VOA shows 50 ppm moly and 125 ppm boron. Pennzoils new formulation also has the identical formulation and interestingly, has no trace marker to indicate the difference between it and the Supreme. Concerning ACEA, I work with it daily. You might want to take a trip to Europe and learn first hand about the lubricants that they use. In some countries, containerized motor oil is not available. You have to go to the local garage to buy it and the mechanic takes basestock from a drum and mixes the additive package right there. The Europeans are starting to see the benefits of emmissions systems and somewhere down the road they most likely will end up conforming more to API standards. Even the Russians are now specing emmissions systems on any new or imported vehicle.

 

Flash, where do you get copies of the formulations for the various brands? Most of the oil company websites are worthless when it comes to tech info.

 

Oppy, we have a girl at the office that on the first of every month she requests a new tech sheet and sample from all of the oil brands. Gives the guys in the back something to do when it all arrives. Sometimes not all companies respond, some send tech sheets and no samples, samples and no tech sheets, but we verify their claims. It's amazing how often some of the oil formulations change. Right now I would be willing to bet you can find 3 different Pennzoil 10w-30 in the stores. The latest looks really good. Castrol in the 5w-20 has gone thru a lot of changes as well and the latest again, looks good. It's a changing market place and it seems like everything is headed in a positive direction for the consumer.

You are also correct about info on the web is very dated and lacks a bunch. Even calling some of the tech lines is worthless as the "techs" don't have a clue. I guess if you can't dazzle "em with brilliance, baffle 'em with BS. But, yes, the oil industry could and should make a better effort to keep the public informed.