Ok, so I found a 1985 F150 with a 302 engine with 35,000 original miles. It's been sitting it a farmers barn for the last 20 years. I thought this would be a great opportunity to rebuild my first engine. Plus I need something to drive back and forth to the home depot. I upped the cam for low end torque (comp cams), put a bigger intake manifold and 4 barrel carb on (both edelbrock). I gutted all the emission and EGR. I've replaced almost everything except the distributor. I'm running full length headers and a flowmaster 44 muffler. New radiator (2 row core), new hauling/towing shocks. Thought about roller rocker arms, but I don't get the impression I'll gain much for the $400 it will cost. I've ran out of stuff to do so the playing is over, or is it? I've been reading online about converting to electronic ignition. Can someone tell me some general info on how this works and what the benefits would be, if any? With everything being new I thought why not replace the distributor also, but I want to explore all my options, especially if there is anything I can do to improve performance for a reasonable amount of money. I'm open to any suggestions.

 

You already have, or should have had, electronic ignition. But, which type is the question. I don't remember which ignition the 302 had in 85, and I think that varied by whether it had EFI or not. There were two forms of ignition - DuraSpark (DS) and TFI.

Anyway, look on the driver's side fender and there probably is a silver box that looks like this:

If you have one of those with a blue grommet where the wires go into the box you are golden as that is the preferred ignition. If you don't have that box or if the grommet is of another color report back and we will discuss the options.

Oh yes: WELCOME TO FTE!! Where are you located?

 

Pictures, please! We love pictures, especially of barn finds!

 

A 1985 302 came from the factory with either a computer-controlled carb & TFI ignition, or else EFI (optional up until at some point they made it standard equipment).

Seeing as how he says he replaced the carburetor, my bet is the former.

But if he's still running the computer-controlled ignition, it's not gonna be advancing the ignition timing like it should because it's been crippled by being disconnected from its carburetor and performance will be extremely lackluster.

A DSII swap is in order here if the above is what's really going on.

 

Amen! I was just wanting some confirmation, and pics would be ideal, of what he has so we don't go guessing. The carb/EFI thing is a real issue. But, wouldn't both be TFI by then?

 

I'm in Cincinnati. I'm not too knowledgeable about the ignition system. I'll look and see what type of box I have, I know there is some sort of electrical connection that plugs in to the carb. When I changed the carb and ripped out all the emission crap I was concerned if the computer was going to know what to do, but I don't think there is really much of a "computer" in this thing. I'll let you know what I find out. I certainly do not want to be missing out on additional performance if the ignition is not being handled properly. What is a DSII swap?

 

If you "ripped out" the emissions stuff without doing an ignition upgrade, aka DS-II swap, then you are going to have really, really poor performance. In either the carb'd or EFI'd variety of fuel system on that truck there is a computer and it controls the ignition timing. Totally and completely. And by removing its inputs you made it mad and it has your timing locked in limp-home mode. Just enough power to drive it.

The DS-II swap is how you fix it.

(And, by the way, I'm standing by for what I'm sure will be a lesson from ctubutis on "ripping out" what you don't understand. You just hit one of his hot buttons.)

 

Do you care if it looks stock?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SBF-Ford-289-302-HEI-Ignition-Blue-Cap-Distributor-w-50K-Coil-Small-Block-260-/330825387937?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4d06bacfa1&vxp=mtr

 

I don't care if it looks stock.

I'm no engine expert, but if seems to run and drive just fine. Honestly, I feel an improvement over before I did the rebuild. Now, there may be more performance I am missing out on. When I purchased the carb, I went with what the manufacturer recommended for my truck. So, there is an electrical connection to the new carb, I just no longer have EGR and oxygen sensors and a couple other devices. I don't feel any issues with loss of power, in fact I had 1600 pounds of landscaping block in it last week. Yeah I felt the weight behind me, but had no problem getting up to 70 on the interstate.

 

Give us a few shots of what you have as well as on of the calibration label on the radiator support. I'm betting there's quite a bit more power to be had.

 

Ok I'll get some pictures and additional info tonight.

 

I see the term "limp home mode" thrown around here quite a bit and I suspect there is some confusion around it...

The computer will go into LHM when it detects certain things being wrong, but I forget what those things are, although I remember the Tempo's IAC/ISC failure causing it once.

When this happened to me in my Tempo (RIP) it was truly not gonna allow me to go more than 30-35 MPH in 2nd gear; it would buck and chug and kick and just refuse to do it.

This is wholly different than when the ignition timing isn't advancing, a situation which can be created on demand by disconnecting the SPOUT connector - effectively disconnecting the computer from the distributor. In this case, the engine will still run as well as it can while locked at 10° BTDC and even allow you to (eventually) reach highway speeds.

To some people, this may very well appear to be normal operation as they just don't know anything better.

Point being, LHM is obviously crippled and that's all you can do is limp home, whereas non-advancing timing will run just fine but performance will be less than impressive.

I purposely removed the SPOUT connector from a Taurus SHO in an attempt to get it to pass the emissions test, it is amazing how much that affects performance.

NB yes, ripping out, throwing in, etc. - especially affecting components you don't understand - is a pet peeve of mine, just like im, id, ill textese is (and using such textese will almost guarantee many of our more helpful members (myself included) won't bother to respond or offer help, or even finish reading the question).

 

You didn't disappoint.

And, you are right about Limp Home Mode. What Ford actually called it in the EVTM for 81 is LOS Mode:I don't know what LOS means, but I think it was derived by a Cockney and is Limp 'Ome Service.

 

Only one label left on the radiator support. As far as ripping everything out, there is a lot of bad information out there. I did quite a bit of reading and talking to people prior to this rebuild. I got a lot of conflicting information. At the end of the day a number of people made it sound like everything was ok to just run the carb without anything and you were "running the truck like the old days". I went back and forth about all this and when it ran without everything hooked up I thought I finally understood. Maybe not.

For some reason my phone isn't letting me send pictures, I'll take some on my camera and send them, but it's pouring down rain right now. I'll have to send them later.

 

Yes, there is a lot of conflicting information out there, much of that is because people make certain assumptions based on their knowledge and experience combined with incomplete information provided by the requester. Sometimes, the answer is "it depends" but it can take a lot of time and energy to think it through and write it all out and people are not always willing to do that.

So, yes, people here are needing to know exactly what it is you have right now to know how to best diagnose this.