Yeah, and you have a big low pressure(and low velocity) from the large area in the filter right? So you would be restricting again going from the I.D. of the filter to .547 and then back up to .585. The PVC thing sounds like a cool idea, but how do you get the tube through/ around the intake? I was thinking about it and I think there may be a spot on the timing cover that could be drilled and tapped to run a tube out of. I can't remember for sure but it seems like I took note of that for some reason while doing my cam. That would probably be better because oil could still come into the timing area via the valley/timing set cutout.

 

Well lot's of ways too look at that, some are my opinions that others often disagree with.

As for actual fitment I don't have one in front of me so there may certainly be better options that I don't see. However my line of thought is this.

I don't see much oil going down via that hole, it's forward and a little higher then the others. So because the engine also typically leans back a bit the only time any oil would be going down via that hole is if the valley is filling up and your going down hill or breaking hard.

Then there is how I personally would do it but many would disagree. I likely wouldn't bother bringing it out of the manifold and just keep it all in the valley. First it would be better to have an oil separator to get any oil mist out of the gasses before they exit. This can just be a lager diameter tube full of course steel wool. Second I don't like PCV valves, I find no reason to have a "valve" or restriction, I want manifold vacuum right in the crankcase. The only thing that needs a "valve" is to limit the flow of fresh air coming in. So I'd just connect it right to the floor of the manifold.

So all in all if I was doing this and it was my engine I'd drill a strait hole in that hole in the front. In it place a tube sealed with a simple O-ring. That tube connects to the bottom of a larger tube full of course steel wool that lays in between the lifters attached to the lifter valley. Going strait up from the separator to the floor of the intake a 3/8 steel tube sealed with an O-ring in a hole in the floor of the intake. This coupled with a restricted and filtered vent in the both valve covers puts a simple permanent and very effective PCV system completely contained in the valley. The single hardest part being lining up the hole in the manifold.

Course it's not my engine and fitment through the manifold clearing everything could be a little tricky. Maybe a steel tube going up in front of the ports behind the dizzy. Sealed in the manifold with either an O-ring or a PCV grommet. Or maybe skip that hole and vent the oil pan directly, a passage in the drivers side of the pan just under the pan rail as far forward as possible wouldn't get too much oil to separate. Or many people if a manual fuel pump isn't used will put a drain or vent in the pump mount cover. There's options, the key is venting under the valley instead of in the valley or valve covers.

Speaking of which nobody has mentioned windage tray yet. Windage trays and scrappers are always a good thing but need to be planned for a bit.

 

I like the idea of chamfering everything.

In some racing type applications they will use standpipes in those holes between the lifter banks, forcing oil to drain back to another area, not right over the crank. It probably doesn't matter for most engines, but when you're making 700+ HP and looking for every bit you can get...

I don't understand the timing chain concerns. It seems like chasing rainbows really. I've never, ever, EVER, heard of a timing chain failure on a 335 series engine because of an oiling issue. Not at 5,000 RPM, not at 7,000 RPM, not at 10,000 RPM. Use a good double roller and forget about it. Concentrate on the real issues.

I think I'm going to install two pressure gauges, one in the normal location and one at the tap in point near the oil filter, just to see the pressure differential from no.1 main to no. 5.

 

There sure is a lot of diversity re oiling mods. And, as I learned long ago, diversity is a good thing as it causes us to think out of the box, and that's what I wanted in this thread. But, just because there are differing opinions doesn't make one right and another wrong. In fact, each of us may have different needs or plans for our vehicles so we would expect differing decisions on what to do.

On the one hand we have BruteFord that has a lot of ideas including mods to the cam retaining plate, PCV system, and driver's side oil gallery plug . On the other we have SDDL-UP who likes the chamfering but not the other things. (And, probably further in that direction we have the silent majority of the 726 people (788 views minus 62 posts) who think we are crazy to modify something as perfect as a system created by Ford.)

Personally, I'm a middle-of-the-roader. With your help I've come to a reasonable understanding of the oiling system on these engines and think these mods are appropriate for my needs:

• Tim's cam bearings
• Tim's suggested block-off of the large port and enlarging of the smaller port on the #1 main
• Drilling a small, probably 1/16", hole in the driver's side gallery plug to provide more oil to the distributor gear and timing chain. (Timing chains don't fail as in come apart, but they gradually stretch and that adversely impacts the stability of the ignition and cam timing. So why not provide them a bit more oil since there is now plenty and it is easy?)
• Slightly enlarge the oil filter adaptor's ID as well as radius its discharge area
• Radius or chamfer the inlet and outlet from the block at the oil filter
• Chamfer all drain-back holes
• Use a ball hone to radius the joint between the drilled passages after the oil filter as well as any other passage that looks dodgy

And, I like SDDL-UP's idea of two pressure gauges, although I think I may do that just for a test and then put the plug back in.

Anyway, what have I missed that I said I wanted to do? Or, what really ought to be done? The reason I ask is two-fold. First, the work here-to-fore has been done on my spare block, not on the one that will be used. So, I need to remember what the plan is when the time comes. And second, I want to put all that I can of that on the drawing for posterity.

Thanks again, and keep those cards and letters coming in.

 

I like your ideas and what you've done so far. I am of the opinion that radiusing/chamfering any oil holes can only reduce friction and offer a slight increase in flow......goood stuff! Done a lot of the same on mine - except for Tim's cam berrins and such. Maybe on another motor when I can.

I don't believe, however, that a 0.0625" hole drilled to let more oil to the distributor gear and timing chain will work. I don't think the oil would break it's surface tension to flow through that small of a hole when it's not a stagnant operation.

Are you planning to do the same radius-ing/chamfer-ing to the heads, too?

 

Well, I disagree about the .0625" hole being large enough, but I don't have any proof. So, I propose to prove it. I'll rig up a pipe arrangement with a hole that size in the end and an air fitting in the other end. I'll partially fill the pipe with 10W-30 and put air pressure on it - all the while hopefully videoing it. If it works like I think it will I won't have to put more than 20 psi on it before the oil is going everywhere. And, since we've heard that even at idle these engines have about 40 psi at the other end of the driver's side gallery, surely by the time the oil gets past the 8 lifters there will still be more than 20 psi left. Is that a reasonable test?

As for the heads, I don't know what I'll do since I've not had my hands on a pair of Trick Flows. They are said to have better oil return passages, but I don't know what that means and will have to wait and see.

 

Sounds good....do you think you might have to do some kind of suction to get that 10w30 in a pipe with a hole that small? Will gravity alone work?

Well, I concede that 20 psi is more than enough to blow 10w30 out of a 0.0625 hole.

 

Wait! Are you saying I don't need to do the test? I'd really rather not as it is gonna be messy.

 

Yes, sir....it would be messy. No test needed - unless you have some one you want to get oiled with......Bwahahahaha.

It would be interesting (after you've gone ahead and drilled the hole) to check how much difference it made.

 

Something we could do to test it is put the motor together except the timing cover and dizzy then prime it with a drill and see how much it squirts. Then if you want more flow you can take the plug back out and drill it bigger and try again. And you'd probably want to have a pressure gauge handy to see how fast to run the drill.

 

Id start with only a 20 thou or even smaller drill. Can always go up but id suggest you may be surprised how much it work. If you go to big do another plug or braze the old one up and start again.

 

Gary,

I'm not trying to offend anyone and I'm sure some good will come from this thread, but maybe we could put together a "priority list" for the oiling system? What do you think are the most important parts of an engine needing lubrication?

 

Cole - I'd like to have this sorted before putting the engine together as I don't want the bottom end open, like it would need to be in order to do this testing. I'm thinking of using 1/2" pipe in an L-shape, with an air fitting in the top of the vertical leg and a female fitting in the horizontal leg where I can screw in the drilled plug. Lay a tape measure out so we can see how far the stream goes. Put a cup or so of oil in it, screw the air fitting in, start the video camera, and hit it with 20 psi of air. I have a stainless steel work top with sides that will contain the oil and a drain at the end. I'll take a pic in a day or so to show y'all what I'm thinking and ask for advice.

crsmiffy - I don't think I'm good enough to drill a .020" hole. I'll see what the smallest bit I have is, which is probably .040". And the only way I can see making that work is to chuck the plug in the lathe and use the Dremel tool post grinder w/a collet to hold that bit. That might work. But, I agree with your suggestion of starting small and working up. However, at what point is the hole small enough that it can easily get plugged with something in the oil?

SDDL-UP - No offense taken as I think that's a good idea. So, here's my first stab at a priority list, but I want everyone's input - although I doubt we will all agree with the exact order as that is dependent both on opinion and plans for the engine.

1. Name brand standard volume oil pump properly installed. I will use George Reid's suggestion in his book on Clevelands and take the new pump apart to ensure it is clean, deburred, and has the proper clearances.
2. Perfectly clean oil pump inlet tube properly installed with slight clearance to the pan. I like Brute's idea of sandwiching a strong magnet there as it serves several purposes.
3. Tim's mods, including his cam bearings and plugging the large port/enlarging the smaller one on the #1 main
4. Oil filter area: radius the outlet of the adaptor and the entrance/outlet of the passages into the block
5. Smooth the corner where the oil filter outlet passage meets the horizontal drilling, which will take a ball hone
6. Smooth oil drainback holes in the valley
7. Drill the plug going into the driver's side oil gallery to provide a supply to the chain and cam gear

The first two items might not be truly "mods", but then many people think they need either a high-pressure of a high-volume pump, and Tim says "NO!". (Tim, you are more than welcome to chime in here and correct me.) And most would bolt a new pump on w/o checking it. Further, how many check the position of the oil pump inlet tube or ensure it is squeaky clean? So, should they be included in the list?

Items 3 - 5 are still aimed at the supply side as that seems to be the biggest problem with these engines. Yes, I've read that race engines running at continuously high RPM may pump all the oil to the top and starve the pan, but I'm not going to be running at high RPM, much less for long periods, so don't see that as a huge problem. On the other hand, I can't see any harm in smoothing the oil's return path, so did include that easy step as #6.

Last is the controversial drilled-plug. I put it there for several reasons. First, as has been pointed out, this isn't a known problem area. But, it isn't hard to do and has no chance of falling apart and hurting the engine, and almost no chance of bleeding off enough pressure to cause any problem if the other mods are done properly. So, why not do it?

Again, please, PLEASE chime in.

 

Just talked to Tim about my engine plans, and along the way I asked him about the mod to the driver's side gallery to aid oiling the cam gear and timing chain. Here's what he said:

• I've done a lot of these engines, some of them racing engines with almost .900" lift, and none of them have needed this. There have been no problems with the cam gear or timing chain.
• The timing chain brings a lot of oil up from the splash in the sump so there is plenty of oil for both the chain as well as the timing gear. And the distributor's shaft has its own oil feed. So there's just no problem this would solve.
• Oil at 235° flows like water.
• And, you would be surprised how much oil you would get out of even a .040" hole. We tried to put some sprayers on the rockers under the valve covers and even a .010 to .015" hole really sprays a lot of oil.

So, I think I've just been put off the drilled hole in the gallery plug. It is fixing a problem that doesn't exist and might raise another one in reduced pressure.

 

Makes sense. This is why Tim is the professional haha. So what did he say on the oil filter adapter passages?