Yea... I had the money set aside for Infinity when I discovered Torque could read Ford Enhanced PIDs. I was going to get Infinity and sell the AE, but I always hated the size of the Infinity screen from day one. Torque is a nice stop-gap for those who want to get the basic OBDII abilities for a low cost, and AE is the 500-pound gorilla you keep in the cage until something on the Torque gauge looks a little hinky.

I was in a rush and I didn't make myself clear. AE can't see EGTs or fuel pressure, and neither can Torque, Dash Command, OBDWiz, or any other software bundle set up to talk through the OBDII port.

Infinity, Edge, Scangauge, and Aeroforce are examples of hardware and firmware bundles manufactured with an opportunity for external sensors to be added.

If I were building a device like this, I would have the firmware read the OBDII data, and have an opportunity to look at analog sensors like EGT and Fuel Pressure... and I believe this is what the hardware/firmware folk have done.

One other way to get those sensor readings is to make an electronic device that takes the analog sensor readings and converts it into digital data and "inject" it into the OBDII data stream - this is what is shown at Tim Hodgson's second link. That link shows a device that works with CAN - not our antiquated J1850 PWM OBDII protocol (like a forgotten language). Somebody would need to make a device like this that will work on our legacy technology to send data (not analog signals) to our software.

One more method is to make an electronic device that will convert analog signals into data that can be streamed into a USB, Bluetooth (with a multiple-device network), or Wifi device, then... Torque, AE, and other software would have to look for data from that source. While AE isn't written to do this, Torque might be... but you still need that "middleman" device.

I mentioned Bluetooth network. While a Bluetooth network is usually ad-hoc (one device to one device only), it can be "equipped" to be a Bluetooth network not unlike a Wifi network.

However... any software scenario above signifies serious searches, a bevy of Buck$Zooka blasts, wads of wire wrangling, and plenty of peripheral and PID programming - all to re-invent the wheel.

 

I would like to plead guilty before someone accuses me of throwing stuff which I don't understand at a thread where there are much bigger fish contributing or accuses me of being a talker not a doer... That said, how about this:

Temperature Sensors | MEMS and Sensors | Analog Devices

(Who knew there was a domain named "analog.com"?)

For fun basic reading:

https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials...tal-conversion

and

Analog-to-Digital Converters | EE Times

OK, I am just chumming the water to see if I can get some big fish interested in adding analog EGT and Fuel Pressure sensors to Torque Pro for us 7.3L guys.

Guilty as charged.

(Come on, some of you brainyacks, take the bait, it won't be that bad to take this project on in your free time. Ignore that shiny barbed thingy..)

 

Re-engineering an obdii dongle to accept the extra signal leads could work... but you would have wiring hanging out of it all octopus like, and it would sure make it difficult to transfer between vehicles.

Tim... the device in your post on the first page is pretty much exactly what it would take, but the signals from both devices (under dash obd dongle, and external sensor adapter) would either have to be muxed (multiplexed) if they speak the same language, or fed seperately into the torque data stream and translated in torque programming.

I would like to have the time to fiddle with it but just have too much going on...

... and i havent banged out code in years... so i would have to brush up.

 

The Edge CTS can accept up to 16 additional sensors independent of the PID's the CTS can read through the OBDII port. I didn't realize this until today, inspired to look it up from Tugly's post above, as I don't really pay much attention to aftermarket products.

HOWEVER, I called Edge today to verify what I learned online, and found out that there is no way to log the independent sensor inputs with the OBDII PIDs. In fact, the CTS can't log much other than a calculated (or inferred) "horsepower" and "torque" for 0-60 times and 1/8 miles etc.

So there is still an unmet market. I find the CTS "gauge" arrangement abysmal. I dislike the Banks IQ 2 gauge arrangement also. The graphics of both seem more appropriate for a playstation video that appeals to a 13 year old gamer. They say you can customize them... but the limited customization options are worse. Adding flames or flags to the background does nothing to make the gauges more instantaneously ascertainable at a glance.

The most startling appeal of the Torque app is the simplicity and visual match of the gauge panel. Those are the user posts that generate more sales of that app. It stikes a visio-functional nerve that says "yes, I can relate to that type of gauge display."

Now, whoever Ian is at Torque Pro must be laughing all the way to the bank. Not only is he able to get mathemajicians on vehicle forums to refine all the translation forumlas for him through trial and error, and not only is he able to get folks to port over proprietary enhanced PIDs to him to incorporate without paying the OEM licensing fees, but he is also able to continue to inspire folks who don't even have his product yet to contribute ideas and yearn for its improvement... all of which will be eventually incorporated and sold back to us. Talk about crowd sourcing intellectual property, packaging it, and selling it back to the source... that's a pretty good gig!

 

Pretty damn good way to ensure your customers get what they want too...
I find no fault in his business tactics...
Hell...i applaud with standing enthusiasm!

 

10-4 Y2KW57 and Christof13T !!! (I have often said that Necessity is not the mother of invention. Creativity is. Tugly is right, we could've stopped reinventing the oak spoked steel banded wagon wheel 500 years ago. And the horse-less carriage was not invented because we ran out of horses.)

If I was EE inclined, I would try the project myself. But I am a talker not a doer. What say you Y2KW57?

 

It's just 0-5 volts. Not gonna kill you Tom if you take a stab at it.

(Sensors send "data" in the form of 0-5 volts, and we look at translations of these voltages into scales of pressure or temperature for the relevant thing measured.)

 

For the sake of the readers, I'll clarify this: The sensors are wired directly to the PCM. The PCM takes all those analog sensor readings, converts the readings to digital data, and broadcasts the data over the OBDII port. All these scan tools just "tap the phone" and listen in on the data stream. The scan tool does one thing well - listen to the rabid "Morse Code" that is digital data... but asking an App to read sensors directly is akin to jamming a vinyl record into a CD slot. You need an adaptor.

 

Sorry if it wasn't clear. It is the adaptor that Tom is talking about making. (Right Tom? ) Or at least he is trying to prod others into making it. Not only do factory sensors transmit their findings in the form of 0-5 volts... I've noticed that many of the aftermarket gauge sending units do the same thing. 0-5v

So as not to "reinvent the wheel", let's hypothetically take an Isspro Performax gauge system ECU and call it "Adapter" part A. Then, we wire all our fuel pressure, triple pyrometer, rear differential temperature, HPOP, whathaveyou sending units to this "Adapter" Part A, and (since I don't have this system and don't really know how it works), let's pretend for the sake of this example that the Isspro ECU, or any similar Part A found or invented, digests and converts all the analog data into digital.

Then, so as not to "reinvent the reinvention of the wheel", let's hypothetically pick one of the Isspro Performax Accessory Dataloggers, either the PC Based, or the USB Based Standalone version. I have not personally seen either one, but the USB one sounds smaller and more mobile, and might more easily be connected into an Android type tablet via a USB hub.

If nothing exploded thus far, then the task would seem to be to get Torque Pro, or perhaps a new app, called Tugly Pro, to translate the Isspro digital data into something that could be rendered into pretty looking gauge simulations on the tablet, that are readable and log-able at the same time as the OBDII data feed. That is Part B.

And that is probably just one or two high school nerds away from happening.

 

(I think I got a nibble...)

And Y2KW57 I think you are probably just one or two actions away from solving this problem and securing your reputation as a true hero on this forum.

(I don't think I was too over the top on that last one. Whoever does this will be a hero.)

 

Read: "Having somebody to support them and having plenty of time on their hands."

 

Hey guys thanks for all the post.

I never though this thread would carry on as far as it has. I hope someone will come up with a way to add sensors that is cost effective.

The reasons I started thinking about this and how it could be done is because where I work we use instruments to monitor things like PSI. Temp. flow etc.

When it comes to a pressure reading we use a Rosemount transmitter that uses a 4 to 20 Mv signal. That signal is then coupled to a card on bus system and then connected to a computer. On the computer the input is then placed on a logic/ diagram page for display. Just throwing the basics out.

Unfortunately, a setup like above would be to costly for us.

Personally, I think it is just a matter of time before someone figures out how to add sensors, with additional hardware, to a program like Torque. At this time I don not have the knowledge to do so myself but Maybe I should hand this project to my 14-year-old son and tell him to "Getter Done" http://images.fordtrucks.com/forums/.../happy0161.gif

 

What I'd like to see is a FP gauge on Torque...that would be the one addition I'd like to see.

I use a BD X-Monitor....I'd go so far as replacing the Turbo with FP...That's how little I think of boost numbers compared to FP.

 

Yeah, but let one of the OEM's find a couple lines of their proprietary code in his work and they will fry his bacon using his own skillet. A certain company is in that position at the moment over a design change I did while at Tech. I took the old design, cast it, ground it, added a few billets to it, then before putting the bushings in it, I shot peened it to make it look pretty. It is still being used today on a friends show truck. Since I did most of the work at home and just dressed it up at school, the lawyers are in a pinch, does it belong to me or the school. I did turn it into a class I had (paper draft/drawing/dimensions), automotive drafting and design (second level finding faults). Anybody that owns or did own a 67 through 78 (when my design appeared) knows what I am talking about.

 

I've owned several 67 through 78s, and still own two. And I have absolutely not a free kindle clue what you are talking about. But I am kind of curious, now that you brought it up. Tangent notwithstanding.

Tugly mentioned Aeroforce earlier. Here is the website description of how Aeroforce accommodates two extra inputs... fodder that Torque users (or fantasy Torque users) would like to see in the mystery box added to the Android tablet of choice:

"2 user configurable analog inputs: 0-5v inputs can be configured to read the outputs from MAP sensors, Air/Fuel ratio kits, pressure or temperature sensors, etc. Raw voltage can be displayed or a conversion can be entered to read proper units."