Yep, I think this goes back to my original post that I think Ford should have worked with some of the owners more about this. As I said, GM is sending 'experts' directly to the dealerships now for these high dollar trucks. Well, that's what I read on two different forums. Not sure how long that has been going on. According to Magn moss act, Ford, GM, Dodge are all within their rights to deny these claims... How many people on these forums were looking for "tune friendly" dealers when they were having issues? When I was researching buying my first diesel, I saw similar topics with all the big Diesel Truck Manufacturers forums. Not just ford.

MAGNUSON MOSS WARRANTY ACT

US Code - Title 15, Chapter 50, Sections 2301-2312

Legally, a vehicle manufacturer cannot void the warranty on a vehicle due to an aftermarket part unless they can prove that the aftermarket part caused or contributed to the failure in the vehicle (per the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)) . If your vehicle manufacturer fails to honor emission/warranty claims, contact EPA at (202) 260-2080 or www.epa.gov. If federal warranty protection is denied, contact the FTC at (202) 326-3128 or www.ftc.gov.

 

I think you have to look at it from the standpoint of Most Common causes of Failure

The first 2 I feel pretty good that they take top spots the Others IDK

Oil Cooler what Leads to EGR Cooler Failure and Blown heads
HPO Systems
FICM
Injectors Fuel Issues
Turbo
Alternators

Josh do you Really want throw 2003 6.0L Under the Bus so Fast??

How would you Rate the Most common cause of Fail?? What order would you think??

Trust me I have thought about having a Poll but I don't know how to Weed out the Folks that had Parts thrown at there Trucks

 

The 2003 engines are the reason Ford was sued by several emergency responders for failed engines resulting in loss of life.

Don't hear of that with 2005+ 6.0 engines do you?

I feel the biggest issue with the early roll-out of the 6.0 was the PCM/FICM software.

Bad HPOPs.
Bad lifters.

Each engine release has it's pros and cons, however the strange reputation the 6.0 has to this day occurred with the 2003 engine and carried over with each revision.

Josh

 

Iv never heard of this at All with any year

Im Not debating why they were Sued neccserily

More just to the Point why a 2003 is Being singled out

But that's Crazy to think 1 year 2003 Cause all the Heartache



Really

I don't mean Catastropic Failures Specific

I mean just the Most Common Cause of Breakdowns Across the Board (ALL YEARS)


I Agree with that


You mean the Bad Rap??

IMO some Upgrades that were Introduced as time went by were Worse or at least seems like they Solved one problem but created other problems

And in other areas Some changes redesigned the parts But the Original Flaw was still there and Problem Remained

Aftermarket Part Dealers are making Lots of Money because of this

In theory they should have got better 06-07 should have been the Best Stock

 

But I wonder how experience with the differences between 7.3 and 6.0 being better understood contributed to later years getting better diagnosis: EGR failures caused by OIL Cooler being clogged (replace them BOTH), extended idling, NO canned TUNES, etc.

Then add in the # of "diesel shops" that STILL don't understand the 6.0 (just look at the # of mistakes in the "rescue" thread involving run6.0run) so back in the 2003/2004 nobody had it figured out yet, vs. today where SOME understand it very well.

 

Kind of whati stated here:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l#post13670516

Josh

 

We owned one of the infamous LLY Duramaxs - they came out mid '04 through the end of '05 MY and were "designed" to overheat. By that I mean they made substantial fuel injection changes which lessened the cooling capability and also bumped the power up; and nobody back at GM bothered re-running the thermal calcs. Ours was hot from day one and so were many others. They were sending out regional reps back then to verify the claims and we were documenting a case for a Lemon Law buy back. I remember one humorous event when I took our 3500 SRW in to complain again about the overheating, and the Service Manager came out and said they wouldn't even look at it 'til I put the stock tires back on (the 3500s came stock with a larger tire). Boy was he looking stupid when I showed him the door sticker and the tire sidewall (they were the tires they came with).

So GM was doing everything they could, including not allowing you to bring your truck in with a load to show that it puked if it was warm out, had a load and went up a mild grade. If someone was able to go thru the hoops and the dealer agreed, they would have a regional rep come out to verify the symptom (a 2nd "test" required). This was back in '06, we had an '05 LLY.

Ford was having it's problems but was far more liberal in fixing 6.0s back then than GM was on it's major mistake. We got tired of the hassle and not being able to go anywhere or do anything with the truck so traded the POS in on our current '07 Ford. Depending on the dealer (well only the one closest to us is crap), we've had excellent response to concerns about the EGR cooler, fixing a bedplate and other oil leaks right up to the end of warranty. In fact, Ford rolled out their 5 year/60k mile warranty in '06 that even eliminated the $100 deductible.

Between those experiences and seeing how Ford got smarter during the bust we just went through and never took federal money (or took the bankruptcy out either). I'm gonna' stick with them for some time.

Sorry, a bit of a soapbox there -- it comes out of me whenever I think about GM or our Dmax

 

A Huge Factor SO Big that it Demands The most Common cause of Failure throughout ALL Years Be Determined Before the 2003 or any year for that matter Gets throw under the Bus Immediately like some have Done

Id say with How many times this EGR and Oil Cooler thing has come up in Not only this Thread But Many Many other threads and posts, I would give it the #1 Spot for the Most common point of Fail


Josh I get the Feeling you already know where Im going with this

If folks look at it like the Coil Spring front end and Grills looked better and Electronic climate control That Stuff is Nice I would like SOME of it even but you wont be sitting on the side of the road waiting for a Tow over it

Once you look at it from the point of view of the Most common causes of Fail [NO GO] little bit of a Game changer IMO

 

Scott Iv only bought a few cars from GM but had pretty good luck with them IMO The ones I have had Go 100K easy no big problems Even 200K nothing Big Basic really

But since they took that Federal Money I wont spend another Dime on a new car or any auto from GM

 

My '97 Tahoe had 2 head gasket replacements, and 2 catalytic converter replacements, rebuilt trans (the torque converter grenaded at 160k), rebuilt diff (2wd), heater core, and A/C system replaced in 197k.

I traded it when the rear axle seals went and I lost brakes on an exit ramp off the freeway, luckily I'd practiced using the E-brake to stop before then..
Luckily, there was a tire shop one block from my office and they fixed the rear seals for $450 and I bought my Excursion the following weekend (3 years ago)

It did serve me well, but I spent more in repairs on that Tahoe than it COST to buy (I bought it new). My Ex even with ALL the 6L engine upgrades, is still FAR below the costs for that Tahoe.

 

Ya mine were Cars

My one car a Berretta struggled with Lower intake manifold leaking but it made it 225K before that

I do get the feeling they struggled with Bigger trucks and SUV

Mine just made it to 200K basically problem free so I feel I got my Money out of it

 

It's always seemed strange to me that the GM 1500/2500 (perhaps 3500+ too) used the same chassis. Whereas, the F150/Expedition vs. Excursion/F250+ were totally different designs (after 1999 at least).

either way, I much prefer my Ex over the other brand.

 

Benny/Misky: Since we're going down this path... I'll share a bit more: I've generally had good luck with GM cars, but was fortunaate to have a very close relationship with a dealership, for while our '90 Lumina was still going strong at 140k when I sold it, it wasn't trouble free, but with the help of dealership "over-the-phone diagnostics", was able to fix things that were major $s for other owners. We bought a '96 Lumina as they redesigned it and fixed sooo many things (it was trouble free). We had a '90 light duty 3/4 ton (bought new) we put 85k miles on. It got a new short-block installed just out of warranty as it used oil from day one (GM did cover it). They found 3 out of 8 cylinders with significant damage that they attributed to initial assembly. Paint was horrible and even though we had bought the exterior warranty they wouldn't cover it...

Now, just because Misky brought up the Tahoe and made me smile: we bought a '98 Tahoe new -- had some electrical issues, but it was ok OTHER than... It lost a rear axle seal (wets brake shoes) and braking wasn't just cut in half it was like a third was left -- I asled them to replace the other side proactively and they wouldn't (we towed a 4k lb horse trailer, Tahoe was rated for 7k). The good part: We had a steep driveway and we'd turn around at the top and back the trailer down to where we parked the trailer. Wife comes home from a ride and I'm at the top of the driveway chatting with next-door neighbor. She's backing down and damn near loses control, but has the smarts to throw it into drive. The Tahoe's windows are closed and we can hear her screaming an endless stream of obscenities to which the neighbor remarks: "she sounds upset" (ya' think?!") -- then she gets out of the Tahoe and yells up to me SELL this &(&*^&& and get me a REAL Truck!!! Yep, another axle seal...

As I recall, she didn't really like the looks of the Expedition is why we didn't consider one, but being the stupid husband I said something like: you know it's too bad you didn't like the Expeditions, because they are on a heavier chassis with stouter components including 4 wheel disc brakes.



Don't talk to a crazy upset woman that way, ever, is my advice to you all
We had an Expedition in a week and she loves it and it tows a far heavier trailer to boot.

The Dmax was THE final straw. Interesting watching GM do a complete clean-sheet design of the Chevy Volt. Didn't need no stinkin' help, let's just run this company into the ground (Ford licensed Toyota technology). The whole upper management should have been fired for that and the bankruptcy/bailout. idiots.

I'm needing or two or four now...

 

Man its a good thing about the trailer in the driveway deal wasn't on the Freeway coming down an Off ramp and trying to stop

Seems there lots of folks that feel that way about GM now they got the Bailout. Im done with them and Dodge is out the question. The Bailout may saved them temporary but they must be Losing sales over it, theres got to be a ton of folks that wont buy another GM Product Now!!

Hell maybe GM Don't need to sell anymore Auto with Gov supporting them

 

Dan, now you got me remembering stuff....
Disclaimer: dad was a chevy guy...

New '80 firebird, v6-231 starter never would start when hot, it heat soaked. New flywheel 'cause of bad tooth. Power steering always whined could never tighten belt enough, mounting bracket broke, used 5 stacked washers to hold it to block..

Exhaust fell off driving to florida in '85!
Traded for new '90 s-10 blazer. 18 months later, repainted under warranty because gray paint peeled everywhere.(happen to lots of other gm cars too) next intermittent dashboard gauges going wacky.

Replaced cluster with another with wrong color blank fillin covers., oh well that is best we could do. Leaving dealer gauges wacked out, pulled back in. They shipped my old dash can't get it back. Tech found pinched wire harness at trans, fixed issue.. next day...

Then traded for '97 tahoe built to my order. Was fine until first recall 20k or so) for something i don't recall, and the steering was never the same, it was 3x worse than the excursion! Before my redhead of course. The tahoe actually felt like driving a boat, you anticipating when you needed to start turning the wheel.

I also love working on my king of suvs again! With the fine help of fte. By far, this sight ensures staying a loyal Ford owner.

Oh, my excursion gets better fuel mileage than any vehicle i've owned!

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