engine replacement
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 269
Likes: 2
From: Abingdon. VA
Will check that. Dist is original to the 55.Could that be the cause of my idle problem when coming to stop light - especially downhill where it is not under throttle pressure instead of carb adjustment? Would it better to try to replace parts or get a remanufactured one from Macs Auto Parts or elsewhere? Like I said - I'm new to trying to restore and keep the 55 running and I'm not real skilled or real bright.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,041
Likes: 54
From: Sterling CO
When I started I had kind of a sour tempermental grouch motor too.. she'd always start and run, but bog down, hang up, start hard, etc.... it all came down to timing, carb, and tuneup... I got through all those and have a phenomenal engine now (that unfortunately is worn out).
Despite being worn out she starts very reliably, is dependable as any new car - and that is an engine last rebuilt in 1977.
Your 223 can be made reliable... and I wouldn't even jump to rebuild it right away.
You mention a couple whacks at the carb, I bet you don't have everything adjusted right and tuned well. I'd only pull the motor to rebuild if it smokes worse than Shane's or the oil pressure goes south like mine.
Lets take a collective look at how bad your motor is and help you get it tuned up first then you can decide if you really need to toss $$$ at rebuilding it.
A) what's your smoking / blowby look like - pop the breather off with it idling and see
B) what's your compression look like
C) got a vaccum gauge, if not borrow one - it really is the best way to tell if a motor got valve issues, ring issues, etc.
Oh probably most importantly: By all means don't feel intimdated... I think most of us started out here fairly naive to what we had gotten ourself into
Welcome aboard.
Despite being worn out she starts very reliably, is dependable as any new car - and that is an engine last rebuilt in 1977.
Your 223 can be made reliable... and I wouldn't even jump to rebuild it right away.
You mention a couple whacks at the carb, I bet you don't have everything adjusted right and tuned well. I'd only pull the motor to rebuild if it smokes worse than Shane's or the oil pressure goes south like mine.
Lets take a collective look at how bad your motor is and help you get it tuned up first then you can decide if you really need to toss $$$ at rebuilding it.
A) what's your smoking / blowby look like - pop the breather off with it idling and see
B) what's your compression look like
C) got a vaccum gauge, if not borrow one - it really is the best way to tell if a motor got valve issues, ring issues, etc.
Oh probably most importantly: By all means don't feel intimdated... I think most of us started out here fairly naive to what we had gotten ourself into
Welcome aboard.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,041
Likes: 54
From: Sterling CO
RE Vacuum Gauge: scroll down to the grey and white chart at the end of the article - this is the same steps I was taught by an old BPO (Buick Pontiac Olds) guy:
Technical Articles: Engine testing with a Vacuum Gauge - at Greg's Engine & Machine
Technical Articles: Engine testing with a Vacuum Gauge - at Greg's Engine & Machine
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,793
Likes: 19
From: Austin
Hey Beagle,
Welcome Aboard! Hmmm.. If you have good compression stick with the engine you have & learn about it.
We put a 351W with an AOD in our 1950. We started with a $500 short block & then ordered a Top End Kit from Summit Racing for $2,000. We went to the salvage yard & got an 8.8 Explorer rear axle with 3.73 gears for $125. The AOD transmission was around $2,000 with some internal upgrades or you can go pot luck from the Salvage guys. Pulley brackets, radiator, carburetor, new wiring kit, wheel spacers, etc.
Good luck over there.
Ben in Austin
1950 F1
Welcome Aboard! Hmmm.. If you have good compression stick with the engine you have & learn about it.
We put a 351W with an AOD in our 1950. We started with a $500 short block & then ordered a Top End Kit from Summit Racing for $2,000. We went to the salvage yard & got an 8.8 Explorer rear axle with 3.73 gears for $125. The AOD transmission was around $2,000 with some internal upgrades or you can go pot luck from the Salvage guys. Pulley brackets, radiator, carburetor, new wiring kit, wheel spacers, etc.
Good luck over there.
Ben in Austin
1950 F1
New User
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 18
Likes: 1
From: Northern Virginia
Welcome abeagle,
You've received some good advice already. I'd suggest checking your engine compression before giving up on the engine and Brain75's pointer to the vacuum gauge interpretations should be very helpful after that. I believe the specs state the cylinder compression should be 150psi with the choke plate and throttle wide open. Mine is down to 120 across most of the cylinders, but the engine starts fast, runs well, and is reliable. It just doesn't sport the acceleration it once had perhaps.
I've had my 56 223 for a long time and worked thru a lot of issues. The 1904 Holley carburetor can be problematic as can the stack of gaskets underneath it. With respect to the gaskets, I haven't had a problem there since I coated the eight or so gaskets with permatex #2 on all surfaces, even the outside edges after installation.
If you choose to replace the 223, I'd be happy to give it a new home.
You've received some good advice already. I'd suggest checking your engine compression before giving up on the engine and Brain75's pointer to the vacuum gauge interpretations should be very helpful after that. I believe the specs state the cylinder compression should be 150psi with the choke plate and throttle wide open. Mine is down to 120 across most of the cylinders, but the engine starts fast, runs well, and is reliable. It just doesn't sport the acceleration it once had perhaps.
I've had my 56 223 for a long time and worked thru a lot of issues. The 1904 Holley carburetor can be problematic as can the stack of gaskets underneath it. With respect to the gaskets, I haven't had a problem there since I coated the eight or so gaskets with permatex #2 on all surfaces, even the outside edges after installation.
If you choose to replace the 223, I'd be happy to give it a new home.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 269
Likes: 2
From: Abingdon. VA
Thanks for the gasket coating recommendation - I'll put it to use in the future. Ever had any trouble with idle stalls at lights/stop signs with your 223 and 1904 carb? Cause? I'm trying to consider all engine, etc options depending on what is found out or transpires. I appreciate everyone's expertise - keep it coming as I am not the brightest flame out there.
New User
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 18
Likes: 1
From: Northern Virginia
If I was having idle/stall issues, knowing what I know now (which by no means is perfect information), I would disassemble the carb, check float adjustments, and clean the carburetor, and ensure the power valve in the 1904 carb was set to work properly.
There's a lot of info on the 1904 Holley in the forums and I would look there for ideas. Mine seems to run a bit higher in RPMs and rougher when I come to a stop at a light. After a while(30 - 60 seconds) it settles down into what I think is a more typical idle situation. I'm not sure what is causing it, but am currently thinking it might be higher fuel pressure and fuel "leakage" past the fuel needle or other carb passages.
Over 30 years, I've purchased a few carburetors, cleaned, and perhaps unintentionally mixed parts from the various carbs which has brought me to where i am now....it finally idles at 450, but has that traffic light stop (minor) issue which I don't yet fully understand. Since it sounded like the RPMs were higher, I added a tach but it doesn't indicate a significant difference in RPM in that situation. I'm stumped at the moment, but the issue isn't causing a significant problem.
In summary, I would look at the carb given what you've said you're experiencing.
There's a lot of info on the 1904 Holley in the forums and I would look there for ideas. Mine seems to run a bit higher in RPMs and rougher when I come to a stop at a light. After a while(30 - 60 seconds) it settles down into what I think is a more typical idle situation. I'm not sure what is causing it, but am currently thinking it might be higher fuel pressure and fuel "leakage" past the fuel needle or other carb passages.
Over 30 years, I've purchased a few carburetors, cleaned, and perhaps unintentionally mixed parts from the various carbs which has brought me to where i am now....it finally idles at 450, but has that traffic light stop (minor) issue which I don't yet fully understand. Since it sounded like the RPMs were higher, I added a tach but it doesn't indicate a significant difference in RPM in that situation. I'm stumped at the moment, but the issue isn't causing a significant problem.
In summary, I would look at the carb given what you've said you're experiencing.
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